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Original poster

Anyone got a Scout or Explorer going to WSJ in South Korea?

630 replies

lazylittlelucy · 16/07/2023 16:57

Just thought I'd start a thread for parents if there are any on here.
My 17yo DD is going as an Explorer and is getting excited now.
Anyone else?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
33
Tidypidy · 04/08/2023 19:35

Please see below to clarify message from UK Scouts re: contacting children.

Anyone got a Scout or Explorer going to WSJ in South Korea?
Tidypidy · 04/08/2023 19:36

CheersToMe · 04/08/2023 19:34

The UK Contingent are not trying to prevent young people from contacting their parents!!

They asked parents to hold off whilst the leaders spoke to their units on site. So they remained in control of the situation.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

Cross post!

swanling · 04/08/2023 19:38

CheersToMe · 04/08/2023 19:34

The UK Contingent are not trying to prevent young people from contacting their parents!!

They asked parents to hold off whilst the leaders spoke to their units on site. So they remained in control of the situation.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

Agreed.

They are trying to look after these kids and I completely understand the request they made - the last thing they needed was mass panic and 4,500 sets of parents trying to make individual plans when the organisation has it under control.

Lemonsole · 04/08/2023 19:43

The UK Scouts' move and accommodation will be covered by the insurance. Their mention that they were working with the FCO shows that the decision was not taken by the association alone. We at home are not party to all of the information either, and should be mindful of this. My best guess is that the health and safety worries went way beyond the heat: food allergies not being catered for, not enough loos, and poor hygiene (originally only 70 cleaners for loos for 45k people?), in an area that is flooded, are ideal conditions for water-bourne bugs to spread like wildfire.
I've been to a WSJ as a leader, and my child has been to one. The professionalism and risk management by the UK Association is second to none. This is NOT on them.

swanling · 04/08/2023 19:52

@Lemonsole Well said.

CheersToMe · 04/08/2023 19:58

Thank you lemonsole, that is reassuring.

MrsBigTed · 04/08/2023 20:04

Agree 100% with @Lemonsole.

The posters that suggest risk assessment wasn't sufficient, it's exactly how uk scouts have arrived at this decision. You don't up and move 3000kids to a city without a plan.

Rewis · 04/08/2023 20:08

CheersToMe · 04/08/2023 18:34

Apologies if I've misunderstood @Rewis but are you suggesting that conditions are being exaggerated because you haven't heard about it before today?

If you have someone at the site, trust me, you would have known about this for several days. I've been well aware since last Friday when the UK IST arrived

Merely made a neutral observation on how my local scout media (official and unofficial) have been quiet. Did read a few main stream media articles which were very factual "weather is x, x nunbe rof kids hospitalised, these are activities". Defiantly not suggesting anything being exaggerated.

EduCated · 04/08/2023 20:10

MrsBigTed · 04/08/2023 20:04

Agree 100% with @Lemonsole.

The posters that suggest risk assessment wasn't sufficient, it's exactly how uk scouts have arrived at this decision. You don't up and move 3000kids to a city without a plan.

Agreed. This is the plan in action, and it isn’t a snap decision that will have been made lightly. I can’t even begin to imagine the work behind the scenes from the volunteer contingent team, and the staff members supporting them, who have probably been moved from their day jobs to help. The fact they are in a position to make and enact this decision speaks volumes.

UsingChangeofName · 04/08/2023 23:07

CheersToMe · 04/08/2023 19:34

The UK Contingent are not trying to prevent young people from contacting their parents!!

They asked parents to hold off whilst the leaders spoke to their units on site. So they remained in control of the situation.

Please stop spreading misinformation.

Well said

UsingChangeofName · 04/08/2023 23:12

Well said @swanling , @Lemonsole , @MrsBigTed , and @EduCated

The volunteers that are doing an incredible job putting this contingency plan into place should be left to focus on that, and arranging what is going to happen for the next 12 or 13 days.

the "should have"'s and "Why did it happen" s will come later.

Original poster
lazylittlelucy · 05/08/2023 08:48

Confirmation of USA pulling out, but the get to stay nearby at a US army barracks ...

amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/aug/04/uk-children-to-move-to-seoul-hotels-heatwave-world-scout-jamboree

OP posts:
Original poster
lazylittlelucy · 05/08/2023 08:49

Cross post @MrsWombat
I didn't see yours before I posted... oops

OP posts:
Beamur · 05/08/2023 09:28

The logistics of these mass events are usually very carefully planned - it would be unusual to send a Leader in advance to check what you have been told will be provided is there, normally there would be a high degree of confidence in arrangements.
However, things can go wrong which is why you risk assess dynamically. There will be a contingency fund of money and insurance should cover the bigger costs.
It's not unusual for children not to be able to contact parents during trips - contact home usually goes between a Leader on site and a Leader at home. If you are on the ground dealing with a crisis the last thing you need is 30 sets of worried parents trying to ring you. This is a protocol to protect the children and ensure that the Leaders can actually deal with the situation.
As long as no one is seriously hurt or unwell, I would imagine that the kids will still have a great time. It may not be quite what they expected but it will be both memorable and challenging.

Twyford · 05/08/2023 09:38

The UK Scouts' move and accommodation will be covered by the insurance.

That's going to whack up the premiums for any future events, then.

Twyford · 05/08/2023 09:39

MrsBigTed · 04/08/2023 16:46

Do encourrage your DS to go for Poland. The polish team are amazing, the organisation as a whole are excellently run and safety will be paramount. They also have a huge amount of experience in very large scale events.

But then, we were told the same thing about Korea.

Beamur · 05/08/2023 09:42

Poland have run large scale events before. Lessons will be learned from Korea, but it shouldn't undermine confidence in international events.

Willmafrockfit · 05/08/2023 09:47

such a shame about Korea, but i imagine it is the weather that is to blame, and i understand there are food issues which are not being catered for, different culture

EduCated · 05/08/2023 10:56

Poland were ready to run in 2020 with Eurojam. I would have a good level of confidence in them at this stage.

They will also be planning an experience that feels more familiar to European contingents, and in an environment more similar to the UK than Korea. There are clearly issues with the site and event in Korea, but there will be a huge amount of culture shock and different cultural expectations feeding into the situation too.

RedToothBrush · 05/08/2023 10:58

Willmafrockfit · 05/08/2023 09:47

such a shame about Korea, but i imagine it is the weather that is to blame, and i understand there are food issues which are not being catered for, different culture

One of the UK team told BBC's Seoul correspondent Jean Mackenzie the decision to pull out was not based just on the extreme heat, but was also down to the facilities and the food.

They described toilets as a "health risk", adding children's dietary needs were not being met.

Dirty toilets are not a cultural difference. That's just poor planning.

I also don't believe that allergies and dietary requirements are cultural difference. The idea that there are no dietary issues in South Korea is bollocks. They are universal medical conditions that occur throughout the world. South Korea is not a healthcare backwater. Much of the food complaints relate to moldy food and lack of food full stop - which is covered by the comment above about dietary needs not being met anyway not just allergies. Again that's poor planning and logistics.

These aren't niggles either. They are the absolute basics.

Again putting a camp site on reclaimed land in monsoon season doesn't strike me as particularly bright or a cultural problem. Nor does a lack of tents.

The cultural problem is that no one spoke up and said that there were major unresolved issues prior to the event starting. We know that someone must have been aware of this before the event started because journalists were talking about it before anyone got to site.

BlossomCloud · 05/08/2023 11:01

RedToothBrush · 05/08/2023 10:58

One of the UK team told BBC's Seoul correspondent Jean Mackenzie the decision to pull out was not based just on the extreme heat, but was also down to the facilities and the food.

They described toilets as a "health risk", adding children's dietary needs were not being met.

Dirty toilets are not a cultural difference. That's just poor planning.

I also don't believe that allergies and dietary requirements are cultural difference. The idea that there are no dietary issues in South Korea is bollocks. They are universal medical conditions that occur throughout the world. South Korea is not a healthcare backwater. Much of the food complaints relate to moldy food and lack of food full stop - which is covered by the comment above about dietary needs not being met anyway not just allergies. Again that's poor planning and logistics.

These aren't niggles either. They are the absolute basics.

Again putting a camp site on reclaimed land in monsoon season doesn't strike me as particularly bright or a cultural problem. Nor does a lack of tents.

The cultural problem is that no one spoke up and said that there were major unresolved issues prior to the event starting. We know that someone must have been aware of this before the event started because journalists were talking about it before anyone got to site.

Show quote history

Exactly.

And if you are taking children with allergies/coeliac you don't just assume the organisers will have it under control. You have lots of conversations and do lots of checks in advance.

BlossomCloud · 05/08/2023 11:01

RedToothBrush · 05/08/2023 10:58

One of the UK team told BBC's Seoul correspondent Jean Mackenzie the decision to pull out was not based just on the extreme heat, but was also down to the facilities and the food.

They described toilets as a "health risk", adding children's dietary needs were not being met.

Dirty toilets are not a cultural difference. That's just poor planning.

I also don't believe that allergies and dietary requirements are cultural difference. The idea that there are no dietary issues in South Korea is bollocks. They are universal medical conditions that occur throughout the world. South Korea is not a healthcare backwater. Much of the food complaints relate to moldy food and lack of food full stop - which is covered by the comment above about dietary needs not being met anyway not just allergies. Again that's poor planning and logistics.

These aren't niggles either. They are the absolute basics.

Again putting a camp site on reclaimed land in monsoon season doesn't strike me as particularly bright or a cultural problem. Nor does a lack of tents.

The cultural problem is that no one spoke up and said that there were major unresolved issues prior to the event starting. We know that someone must have been aware of this before the event started because journalists were talking about it before anyone got to site.

Show quote history

Exactly.

And if you are taking children with allergies/coeliac you don't just assume the organisers will have it under control. You have lots of conversations and do lots of checks in advance.

Willmafrockfit · 05/08/2023 11:04

as said above, it will be memorable for them, they have been relocated now.

MrsBigTed · 05/08/2023 11:11

What checks are you imagining @BlossomCloud, and by who? Beyond the UK contingent saying 'we have 2 participants with X allergy, 3 vegetarians... etc" and the host saying "yes, we can cater for all of those"