Protecting kids from dogs

[Yeen]

We live very close to some lovely woods where I take my DC walking most days. Lots of dog walkers as you'd expect, most dogs on lead and perfectly friendly (I haven't got a problem with dogs). However recently there's been a huge increase in very large pit bull type breeds (I think they're American Bully XL dogs), and they never seem to be on leads - owners often miles away. I find these types of dogs really intimidating and most of the recent dog attacks in the news seem to involve them. I have no idea how I would even go about attempting to protect my DC if one attacked. If one is nearby I make sure DC aren't running around and are standing with me. Are there any other practical steps I could take?! I am usually carrying a hot drink of some sort, is that going to be of any practical use against a dog if it attacks??

Our local woods are Oldbury court but I've seen then all over, seen them at Ashton Court, Grenville smyth Park, Manor Woods, Moor grove, leigh Woods...

I love dogs. I own a large breed dog. However, I’m with everyone on this thread that feels xl bullies and the like should be banned.
I live next door to one of these monsters and it’s feckless owner. It has made my life a misery. My poor little dc asked me recently if we could move house because our house was scary because of next doors dog. My dc won’t play out and when we leave our house to go anywhere we have to be on alert. My heart pounds every time I’m on our road with the dc or my dog. The awful thing has changed my gentle dog who is now fearful. My dog is a working guide and has had to retire early because of this awful creature and it’s awful waste of space owner. It spends half its day trying to kill us basically.
Its owner is oblivious and convinces himself it’s lovely.
I watched it and it’s brother attack a random passer by a few years ago. Never sen anything like it. The owner was using all his strength to try stop them but had no change. The victim was a large man. He was floored by them and lay crying waiting to die. He survived but has life changing injuries. The damn dog is allowed to live. The owner said it was simply wanting to play. It’s brother was picked up by his son never to be seen again, no one knows if it was put down or they simply hid it. The courts and police openly told me the law is not strong enough on this and there is nothing they can do. I have reported it and reported it but have repeatedly been told nothing will happen. The dogs have attacked another person before and have killed a dog.

Most attacks happen to known people in the home but that is not reassuring when these things escape or when they decide to turn at any moment.

Fully grown adult males have no chance against these dogs, owners cannot pull them off. If it attacks your dc you have to resign yourself to it leading to death.

The only thing that may give you a chance is if you carry a rope or rope type lead. You find a way to get it round the dogs neck, up high just below the ears, not round it’s collar area as that’s muscular, you need it round the windpipe. Then you find your mother’s instincts and your rage and you pull the rope together and you cross it over itself and you pull with everything you have and twist and pull until the dog passes out. Very hard to do but it’s the only way with a dog of that size and strength. Forget hot water, forget sticks, forget sprays they will do nothing.

@Yeen thank you OP. It's such a shame we are being told to avoid places due to out of control dogs. As human beings we are too of the food chain and shouldn't have to cower away from these horrible things in order to protect our children. If you aren't comfortable kicking the dogs you can use the dog detergent sprays. It burns their eyes temporarily and causes distress and enough distraction to get away from the thing.

Keep it in your pockets. It's essentially pepper spray for dogs and doesn't fall under the UK firearms law as human use pepper spray does. I

www.police-supplies.co.uk/k917-dog-deterrent-spray

@Yeen -also available here op.

Bite Back Non-Toxic Dog Deterrent 50ml amzn.eu/d/fOtehST

There seems to be more of them. A woman near my house was out walking a puppy version of them the other day he was already like a brick shithouse. I picked my dog up not an easy feat but it was longing at her. “Oh he’s just a big softy “ according to this owner who seemed utterly clueless.

somehow one had also been allowed in the Starbucks near us and unaware I took my kids in. It was lying on the floor the size and build of a young alligator muscles rippling and these dead eyes. Their owner was on the phone not remotely aware of a toddler approaching. My heart was in my mouth.

they need to be banned. That includes the seizure and destruction of any kept in this country as family pets “they’re soft as anything” before another child or adult is mauled to death.

*lunging

I do recognise that all the fatal attacks seem to have happened inside family homes rather than out in the open.

On what authority do you say "child friendly, get a grip" because how many cases do you know of where a Alapaha Blue Blood Bulldog has attacked a child? Unlike Xl bully they are a recognised breed. It is XL bully dogs that are the issue.

I don't agree with people who say that it's all in the ownership of the dog. Breed temperament, socialisation, training all play a part and no one can definitively say which input has greatest effect.

The issue with XL bully is 1) no breed standard 2) The original dogs were a mix of bull breeds including pit bulls 3) the people who set out to breed xl bully wanted specific pit bull traits (despite their protestations of creating family friendly dogs) they wanted the tenacity of the pit bull. 4) it was bred in response to breed specific bans and other legislation. 5) breeders are crossing them now with mastif types to create even bigger dogs. 6) status and links with crime. 7) its more aspirational amongst peers and more profitable than drug dealing. 8) from beginning to end this has always been about idiots wanting status dogs, and other idiots believing the "it's a fat, huge, beast of a dog, with pit bull in it.....but it just loves kids"

Yes, of course the knuckle draggers want you to be afraid, whilst all the time telling themselves what a lovely child friendly pet their dog is. How else would you justify having 70kg dog with a massive bite force.

But please don't confuse either the Xl bully or its owner with the responsible owner of other bull breeds such as Alapaha Blue Blood Bulldogs, or Amstaf, American Bulldog, and certainly not all other bull breeds.

Bull breeds like other breeds were bred with specific aims. Staffordshire bull terriers are not "nanny dogs" as is often said. They were bred to fight other dogs, and they are often dog aggressive without careful socialisation and training. But every dog that was put in the ring, that bit a human was destroyed. It was necessary to part the dogs and therefore any aggression to humans was bred out of the breed.

XL bully is a mash up, and a dangerous mash up and I don't believe that breed specific legislation has the tools to ban these dogs unfortunately.

Thinking about how to ban xl bully. The XL bully is a mash up, and now those seen waddling about the streets seem to be a bigger mash up with mastif etc,....maybe all that can be done is to identify the dog as an Xl bully by using a process of elimination. It's not an EBT, it's not a boxer, it's not an American bull dog.....etc,... "and where is your kennel club papers proving its breed and lineage?" ......OK "got none, give us the dog" and have these dogs taken away under BSL. Anyone know if this could work?

There are loads of cases of staffs biting humans so I'm not sure your theory that human aggression was bred out of them really holds water tbh.

Then wtf did you start this discussion?
You clearly don't recognise the risk factors.

There you go then. Take your kids for a walk wherever you want.

I would add XL Bullies to the list of banned breeds. And also make it mandatory for large breed dogs to be leashed and muzzled when in public. I'd consider banning large breeds from homes where young children live but that might be a step too far.

The "advice" on this thread is dangerous.

OP, the chances of your DC being attacked by a bully cross, which is what these dogs are, is vanishingly rare. As you've said yourself, the fatal attacks in the news all took place in private homes.

Cars and streams/rivers are a far bigger danger, statistically.

I'd honestly do nothing to prepare for an attack because it's not going to happen. And if you absolutely must do something, do the opposite of everything advised on this thread.

Yes, and there are loads of cases of chihuahuas and labs biting. And records have shown that the dog breed most likely to cause a bite wound requiring A&E is labrodor. Chihuahua inflicts the least serious bites, labs are more prone to bite, Staffs not at all prone to biting, but have a different bite pattern and more likely to be more serious than a bite from a lab, and therefore more likely to be recorded, and could certainly cause fatality. However, when taking likelyhood into the assessment of risk Staffs really don't pose you an unreasonable risk.

Probably because the majority of the kind of people that own them never walk them that’s the only reason more members of the public have been spared

I'm not disputing there are tonnes of aggressive small breeds about. But the fact remains that most FATAL attacks are down to bull breeds, that is statistical fact. An aggressive chihuahua might bite a child but it isn't going to be able to kill it, is it.

So many triggered dog owners 🤣

So it was all a wind up? An excuse to call people chavs and to fear monger? Got it.

@Whiskeypowers It's actually because dogs, even "XL Bullies" aka mongrels, do not randomly attack for no reason. When you look at all the recent attacks the majority have a common theme (the dog is with an unfamiliar handler, in an unfamiliar home, and in the cases of children being attacked they've all been without adult supervision)

Nope, I've been on MN for years. Sorry to disappoint.

I find these dogs frightening and I worry about them being out and about where my kids are. I recognise it is probably irrational but no not a wind up.

I know this thread is about young children, but I've heard a lot about XL Bullies attacking other dogs too, completely unprovoked, and it would break my heart to see my lovely gentle dog attacked. No comparison to children obviously, and I doubt there's any data, but it's a genuine worry for me when I'm walking my dog.

WonderingWhale yes, I'd like to see XL banned too. I have a little 14kg staff x boston, and he would be eaten and torn to shreds by one of these monstrously huge powerful dogs. And yet.....just the other day the owner of an out of control off lead Maltese terrier that approached my on lead dog shouted at me "get your bastard bully dog out the way" His dog had no recall and no manners.

This is why I'm at pains to say that we need to be very specific about what we are talking about and in agreement somehow about what is an Xl bully, what are the risks, and the evidence so far (there is a lot of evidence) and then ban them. But how, because they are such a mash up of other breeds.

I'm such a dog person, never been afraid of them and usually a don't blame the type of dog but it's how the owners have brought them up type person but these xl bully's petrify me and I wouldn't know what to do if one attacked my baby, I think about it all the time. We have one next door but one and I'm so paranoid about it. They are bred to look threatening, muscly.. the bigger the better and the type of people that have them aren't the type of people to provide proper dog training. I hate to generalise but it's so true, the dogs are so scary and so big that many adults would be screwed if they attacked 😔

A genuine question - how come people can keep putbills and cane corso in this country if they are banned? I saw some and when questioned the owners what breed they were people answered. So it is definitely possible to obtain and keep them openly. But how?
I'm not personally scared of any dogs, neither is my DC, we have a large (not a bully type) dog ourselves. I grew up with dogs, was bitten/nipped by some when I was little/young but as I'm not scared I'd just fight and beat the crap out of any if it were to attack me/my DC. There are ways to fight the dog when it attacks, you can just google it.