Protecting kids from dogs

[Yeen]

We live very close to some lovely woods where I take my DC walking most days. Lots of dog walkers as you'd expect, most dogs on lead and perfectly friendly (I haven't got a problem with dogs). However recently there's been a huge increase in very large pit bull type breeds (I think they're American Bully XL dogs), and they never seem to be on leads - owners often miles away. I find these types of dogs really intimidating and most of the recent dog attacks in the news seem to involve them. I have no idea how I would even go about attempting to protect my DC if one attacked. If one is nearby I make sure DC aren't running around and are standing with me. Are there any other practical steps I could take?! I am usually carrying a hot drink of some sort, is that going to be of any practical use against a dog if it attacks??

I'd be hard pushed to do that! I've been in London, York, Leeds, Manchester and Devon recently and I've seen them in all five of those places.

If we are out with 6ft2 DH, are they less likely to attack, for instance?

"I work in the veterinary profession." That sounds like you're a vet, but also like you're not a vet. I'm guessing the latter.

The rule in my house is you need two permissions:

First, the owner. Ask if the dog is friendly and if you can approach.
Second, the dog. Hand out slowly, palm down, wait and see. Is the dog waggy, no whites in the eyes, ears up, looking happy to see you, maybe carry on, under the chin not over the head. Let them smell you and decide. And so on.

I've had an owner say yes and the dog definitely say no. DD 'asked' the dog and we decided no pets. The owner didn't know her own dog.

This is what we do. I am 100% a cat person and can't really read dogs, so I tend to just leave them be.

Yeen, this has some good pictures for body language www.allthingsdogs.com/dog-body-language/

I don't think your 6ft 2 OH will make any difference at all, no.

You really can't see them coming from a distance and subtly avoid being too near?

Look, dogs don't tend to attack people for no reason. It's just that some breeds like these ones seem to have a much finer trigger than most. If your kids aren't fucking about when you pass the dog, and the dog is walking along quite chilled, you'll all likely be absolutely fine.

It's people who don't understand dog body language and accidentally trigger the dog that get hurt. We can't teach you on a forum easily, but have a look on you tube to see if you can teach yourself what a dog showing subtle signs of stress looks like.

(Mostly)

Generally yes, I can see them coming, but sometimes we will be on a path that is quite narrow so no real way of keeping our distance.

They never tit about when a dog is nearby, that has been drummed into them since they could walk.

My colleague has a very big mixed breed but with a LOT of guard and fighting dogs in there. He HATES my DH, properly hates him. And DH is a very big, fit bloke. He'll sit nicely for me and take little snacks, proper 'good dog' puppy face.

My DH doesn't go there any more.

I would absolutely agree with PPs about teaching your children about canine body language and how to behave around unknown dogs. It’s so important even if it’s not aggressive breeds you’re taking about.

Having said that I honestly would also bring a shillelagh with me (heavy rough walking stick often with sort of knobs on it from where the side branches of the main stick were lopped off). I have one at home for hillwalking. I’m not saying it would work but it’s better than nothing if you were ever in dire straits. They were originally used for fighting.

I would stare at the dog, bear my teeth and growl at it.

When it comes to protecting children, I would not care how daft I'd look.

Carrying a knife is definatly illegal in this country (UK) but a rape alarm may work.........I do not know how effective this is as I have never had to use one. Babies hearing is sensitive so I don't know if this is feasible.

I empathise with your frustrations...there is a school mum who has what I think is an American Bully XL and when I'm walking on the narrow/busy paths around the school I always try to be careful to keep my kids well away.
She always has it on a lead, and keeps it out of the actual school grounds (dogs aren't allowed there anyway), but it is still a potential risk and nobody should be owning such dangerous dogs.Only yesterday I heard about one who used to belong someone else in my town having to be put to sleep as it had become violent.And this person had a young child.
This dog thing is getting out of hand....

Won't carrying a big stick make us more of a target?!

That is literally the opposite of what you should do.

Please ignore this advice.

I think if my DD (5) was at immenient risk of attack by a dog I'd try to make myself look more interesting and attackable, wave arms around jump up and down and shout etc and hope it attacked me not her. If my dog was at risk I'd release his lead as he is very quick and agile and would easily out manouvre most other dogs.

Fortunately the XL bully trend doesn't seem to have taken off much around me yet, but I worry when all the tourist arrive in the summer they will bring their's with them. But I tend to stay away from the main tourists spots anyway (DDog can NOT be trusted around a BBQ or picnic!!).

@Yeen I wouldn’t be waving it about😂 Just holding it quietly at your side.

This will sound cruel but if one of these dogs runs at your child use your feet. I don’t mean kick it. I mean put arm in front of child aim foot for where dogs head will run into it. Never use your hands on a dog attacking, only feet. This keeps your head the furthest distance from the dogs mouth and your arms free for maneuvering child. Don’t tell the child to run unless you have full control over dog. It sounds like gymnastics but is not as difficult as it sounds. The hardest part will be bringing yourself to do it. Flasks and coffee will mean your faffing when you’re needed.

By law dogs should be under control of their owners. If the owner is not within sight, they're not under control.

Even in sight some people walking these dogs would not be able to hold back a 30kg dog in attack mode so muzzling in public should be mandatory.

Put your DC first and just don't go to those woods

I think you can buy this non toxic spray online that dogs don't like, can't remember what it was called but saw it mentioned on here

I see these dogs in the street, in our local park, at any local walking spot. Should I never take my DC out for any kind of walk?

It isn't like there are packs of them everywhere, but I have certainly seen them in anywhere we might reasonably be expected to walk at least once. I can't never take my kids for a walk in the woods again because we might encounter one of these dogs, not when the exact same fact is true on our walk to the supermarket, the park, nursery or their grandparents' house.

I honestly don't think there is an answer till we get legislation
And personally I'd like to see any dog over a certain size being on a lead in a public space.
I'm a vet and wouldn't trust any of these breeds an inch , however " friendly " they are . And would actively cross the road to avoid them.
However nasty a smaller dog is , worst it's going to do is give me a nasty bite , it's not going to overpower me and rip my throat out !
Too many big breeds capable of inflicting too much damage and too many entitled incompetent owners.
There's no real technique I'm afraid , just don't make eye contact or flappy/ threatening movements and keep kids close to
You

@Grimchmas but what’s classed as fucking about? Playing? Running? Are kids just supposed to walk quietly in a straight line with no sudden movements just incase they set off one of these dogs? Just seems bonkers to me that they haven’t been banned. The statistics show how dangerous they are.

And personally I'd like to see any dog over a certain size being on a lead in a public space.
I'm a vet and wouldn't trust any of these

Again having a powerful dog on a lead held by someone not strong enough to hold it is an all too common sight.

I hate to say this but most of the time it is women who don't keep powerful breeds under control.