Just wow at the student loan changes… eeek

[juliajo]

Students beginning university study this year upon completion of their studies will have to pay back 9% on earnings above £25,000 (aka, almost all full time wages now pay rises have been granted - national living wage is not far off that even if you decide to work in a supermarket after going to uni). It will now need to be paid over 40 years too so most of your working life, right through the expensive mortgage years and childcare years etc

I think this is catastrophic tbh and removes some of the incentive in education. I really hope schools spend time making sure cohorts fully understand the financial implications of university study, and think really carefully about what subject they choose. It’s a huge decision to make at 16/17 (when applying)

I think it is crazy that so many of you think it is entirely reasonable. England and Wales(I don't know about NI) are so out of step with most of Europe when it comes to Third level fees. The fact that there are no needs based grants is shocking, the fact that 93% of students come out of university with debt is shocking. People need to expect better.

She's being ridiculous.

I agree. Education is hugely important to a society. Without it the population loses the ability to think critically and becomes parochial, insular and passive. Those are not qualities which will take the country forward.

@juliajo @Tinkietot and @Tippingadvice Thank you all for the advice about degree apprenticeships. We will definitely look into it! 👍

How did the logistics of this even work? How did you go.to lectures or tutorials if you were at work full time?

And how fucking depressing to think that buying a house and car before your peers rather than socialising and making human connections is in any way laudable.

It's not the student loan that's the problem. That's a tiny amount you pay back over many years. The much bigger issue is that the loan is means tested against parental income. We will be expected to 'top up' the amount our child can access but with cost of living increases we will struggle. On top of student rent costs increasing. Those day to day immediate expenses are what will stop our child choosing university, not paying back a small amount a month from when they earn over the threshold (which actually we could easily help them with compared to the huge top up we would be expected to make).

I agree though, that sixth forms must ensure students understand university finance and other options (like accessing university later), so students can make an informed choice. There is no rush to go to uni at 18, there are lots of other routes out there now.

Personally, it's still doable in my experience, my first 4years where 40 hours per week contact time. I worked most evenings until 3am, then up and out the door for 8am for another full day. Worked all day on weekends. I was very committed and run on adrenaline!

Im on plan 2 which I think is 9% of salary above £25,000 i think, with it being written off only at state retirement age. I cant get worked up about the new plan - students do need to pay for their education and maybe some should reconsider if its the right thing/course for them.

Im still paying my SL back over 20 years after graduating.

That sounds like something no normal person would or should ever do.

£25,000 = £0pm of £1,752 take home pay
£28,000 = £22.50pm of £1,922 take home pay
£30,000 = £37.50pm of £2,035 take home pay
£33,000 = £60pm of £2,205 take home pay
£35,000 = £75pm of £2,319 take home pay
£40,000 = £112.50pm of £2,602 take home pay
£45,000 = £150pm of £2,885 take home pay
£50,000 = £187.50pm of £3,169 take home pay
£60,000 = £262.50pm of £3,654 take home pay
£75,000 = £375pm of £4,379 take home pay

I think that people sometimes forget that student loans aren't charging for nothing, it's paying off something that was loaned by the tax payer - degrees are expensive.

It’s a loan, and one that a relatively high proportion of people never pay back, so I can see they had to adjust it somehow.

Hardly the most sensible course of action though

@Dorisbonson There are no degrees which are fun for everyone. People studying Engineering may be bored to tears by History, Literature or Classics. They may well have no aptitude for it as well. Generally people study the subjects they perform well at, so it's less of a choice than you say. Universities usually want you to have good grades in the subject you study, so that's more relevant to what you end up doing. A student who is brilliant in Computer Science may be completely unable to write a great screenplay. A student who can write a great screenplay may be completely unable to grasp Computer Science. Let people do what they do best and enjoy the benefits.

Well I loved every minute of it! Best years of my life. Set me up with a great work ethic and good financials. Couldn't do it now though, I'd be bloody knackered at my age lol

I'm in my mid thirties and currently paying back £450 a month. I got a letter from SLC to say I am 12 months off from paying it off. I can't bloody wait to have that money back in my pocket and not taken out of my pay slip.

That’s so annoying! I remember at one point I was paying off £75/month and it was going up by £35/month. I thought that was bad. Then I took a career break for kids and it’s not gone up higher than it ever was! No idea what it is now.

Im sure when I took it out in 2000 something I was told it was interest free.

I don't think that parents, or some of them, have ever fully understood student loans even as they currently are. The number of parents who seem to be shocked at the point that student loans are applied for, at being expected to stump up a parental contribution due to their household income being too high is astounding. Do parents not think about such things when deciding to have kids? Their university education is going to need paying for somehow, it's up to you as a responsible parent to figure out how it all works - quite a few years in advance, in case you need to build up a bank of savings.

I'm not saying that the system is fair, it has many flaws. But you don't get many things in life for free and it's down to personal responsibility to educate yourself in financial matters including that of your child, or potential child.

I really feel sad for academically talented children from normal families who want to, and are able to, get into Oxbridge but whose parents take the attitude "I'm not paying the maintenance shortfall, they can get a job like I did". My son's at CAmbridge. He does 50 hours work a week and there is absolutely no way he could fit in a part time job during term time. He has secured a summer internship which pays for his living costs during the summer. He does not get a full loan due to our household income. I pay for his accommodation and that is basically the shortfall on his student maintenance loan.

I've got DS2 probably going next year under this new system so more uni costs to pay for and higher costs overall for him. I'm glad that Martin Lewis is bringing some attention to it all. For many years there has been woeful public knowledge over many aspects of personal finance and students loans are a prime example.

@ReadingSoManyThreads this is our difference, I need sleep to function like most humans. So while I wasn’t partying like you suggested I did sleep from 9/10pm after labs or studying and only worked the weekends.

Surely you have to admit it’s not normal to have a full time job then work more in the evenings and not get burnt out

I don't really understand what you think the issue is?

I graduated in 2012. I pay 9 percent over £22k. It's written off after 25 years.

Most people graduate when they're 21/22 at youngest, the expensive childcare years with young DC are usually before 46/47 anyway for most people. I can't get that het up about people between the ages of about 47 and 62 having to continue to pay their student loans.

It's an extra tax, on people who earn more because they've been funded to go to uni. It's not a "debt". Anyone whose DC have said they're not going to uni because they "don't want to be saddled with debt" have miseducated them about this.

Plan 2 student loans only started in 2012, so you're either on Plan 1 or you're not 20 years after graduating!

I didn't suggest YOU were partying!

When I was in my younger student days, it was pretty normal for quite a few of us to do this. No burn out. I also worked while I was a pupil at school too (before the laws stopped it).

But I absolutely couldn't do it now! I'm too old and tired and absolutely would burn out now.

You educate her that it's not being "saddled with debt", it's just paying a small amount of extra tax because going to uni has increased your earning power.

Yep, mine is exactly the same.

My degree had 18 hours of lectures/seminars per week. I then worked 34 hours on top. Plus study time it all fit in fine.