My Mum's strange behaviour/lack of awareness.

[LetsGoDoDoDo]

My Mum (67) has always been a bit of an odd character. She has never been particularly concerned with how she comes across outwardly and does seem to lack self-awareness. She can also be rather self-centred and so I don't know if these behaviours I'm noticing are a development of her character now that she's retired or something to be concerned about. (For example, she'll walk into a room and immediately talking, constantly brings the conversation around to herself, it can be draining but she means no harm.)

The main examples are that she can't stand still. If we're standing up having a conversation she will rock herself from side to side, in a slow rhythmic motion. Its quite exaggerated and can be distracting for thera in the room. When sitting down she rubs her toes together rhythmically and also rubs her fingers over her hands. She also hums as she potters around but never a tune. She doesn't appear to have a tune in her head, it's just noises.

She is constantly engaged in at least one of these behaviours. At all times.

I have to be honest, and I know this sounds awful, but I find it excruciatingly irritating. But more seriously, I am concerned that this is symptomatic of a health problem. It's becoming more noticeable and I'm concerned for her that other people outside of the family will be picking up on it.

Has anyone else have any experience of this? Is this a cause for concern or are they just more of her quirks?

I notice I stim more when stressed. So after a busy day masking around people at work I’m very loud and twitchy.

DD ? are you the OP?

dammit, if the mum was 54 then she'd be me ...

ugh.

My dd is adamant i have adhd and autistic traits
I have restless leg syndrome and when i relax at the end of the day the toe rubbing and hand rubbing gets worse and worse until i take my rls meds. My nail skin is raw where i pick off or file off the surrounding quicks, and I move all the time when standing. But that's cos my back hurts if i stand still, my replacement knee aches if i stand still too long and i am just constantly rubbing at my knee scar ...

I am soooooooooooooooo annoying lol

isnt this just normalish tho?

i do admit to walking in to a room already talking but thats because I am concentrating on what i am doing and going in there for

I would echo this. My MIL constantly twirled her hair and ran her tongue over her front teeth. I think it's called styming? She was largely oblivious to the social dynamics in situations and would become very distressed if anyone showed strong emotion e.g. she immediately left the room when her daughter started to cry over a miscarriage. MIL had lots of what her family called 'Mum's oddities' but I believe 100% that she was actually autistic.

It sounds like she might have ADHD to be honest. Very undiagnosed in females according to the NICE guidelines. My ADHD has worsened as I get older.

I don't like it when people online try to gatekeep who can identify what trait as potentially being autistic or not, or who get offended by a situation that isn't exactly their own therefore can't possibly be... It's such a broad spectrum, your mum could easily be on it somewhere. Her behaviour is familiar to me with family members (and most likely myself) on the spectrum. Read about masking in girls and women.. it's definitely a real thing!

However I would also keep a keen eye on her general neurological health, any change or increase in something is worth noting for the larger picture. Different things can exist alongside each other too in people. Best of luck

I’m autistic…those behaviours are pretty standard and nothing to be concerned about. You ought to hear me singing absolute nonsense and pretending to have a conversation with my dogs with me doing silly voices for the dogs. It’s just a way of coping with anxiety. You can compare it to zoo animals who start acting strangely in a stressful environment.

That said, I’m very self-aware. My mum isn’t at all self aware and went through a phase of talking about my dad’s underpants constantly. She thought I was mad for commenting on it! I don’t know if she’s autistic but all autistic people are different.

Sounds like me...I have adhd. Can come across as both socially confident and self centred. I al at o self soothe I'm similar ways. A massive shift in routine can exacerbate "symptoms" hugely.

Hmm, a lot to think about here. Thank you. From what I've just read, she does seem to be stimming. I don't want to make her feel self conscious by pointing it out but it's such odd behaviour that it makes me feel uneasy. Perhaps I'm being overly sensitive because she's my mum. I know it's bothering my dad.

I'll keep an eye on things. I work full time so don't see them every week.

As for being ND, I have wondered in recent years if I have ADHD. My DD also has some traits... but then, don't we all!

I do look at my family at times and see that we're a bunch of odd balls 😆😆 I grew up wishing we were a bit more "normal" I've been told in counselling (more than once) that I am very self aware so maybe I'm projecting my own fears and insecurities and need to live and let live. She's not causing any harm (apart from irritating a few close family members), my main concern is that it is a symptom of something unpleasant or deep rooted anxiety that she needs support for.

I'm asking the very same question about my husband.

I'm not any sort of expert but I thought maybe some kind of autistic traits or maybe extreme social anxiety? Or maybe she shy but comes across as confident which is very common for many people.

While a people who are ND might exhibit some of the symptoms or traits associated with autism it doesn't mean they are autistic or definitively not autistic. And certainly does not mean they are "little bit autistic".

Someone is either autistic or they are not. Please don't fall into the trap of thinking everyone is a bit autistic

(yes I'm extrapolating from your comment)

Correcting my post. ND in first sentence should be NT.

Older people get more like kids as they get older so you sort of have to manage them in my experience.
This is a condescending generalisation.

Yes it is. Good grief.

It was the humming and repetitive movements that made me think it might possibly be autism. Not the unusual behaviours.

No idea how I have managed to offend anyone by making a reasonable suggestion?

Sometimes people who don't have autism use stimming behaviours or self soothing behaviours. Could be trauma related in many cases. . It Was in mine.

I am shocked - shocked, I tell you - that the OP's mother may be neurotypical. How very unMN of you to suggest this.

She sounds like she's stimming which is a self soothing activity. This is common in autistic people but not exclusively for people with ASD but there are other flags for that I see in your post.

My father has autism (undiagnosed) and he leant right into it post retirement as he no longer needs to mask. He is much more authentic and less angry.

Older people get more like kids as they get older so you sort of have to manage them in my experience.

68 nearly 69 here. Can you advise on what behaviours family need to look out for so they can manage me?

If these are lifespan ways of being, rather than recent changes, perhaps your mum might be neurodivergent in some way. You are allowed to find her way of being provoking regardless of cause. Has her behaviour always annoyed you so much or has something else changed to make it more annoying?

It may just be habit she's got herself into, however my late grandma did the humming as you describe and the hand rubbing, she had Alzheimer's, no idea it it's linked. Have you asked her why she does it?

Because you have noticed changes, I would recommend encouraging her to see a GP.

It can be extremely difficult to spot subtle changes in someone you see regularly, but I think since you are concerned, it is worth seeing her GP.

I have two close family members who do the stims described - one diagnosed with ASD. The older one does it far more now he is retired because he doesn’t have to mask anymore. He wasn’t allowed to do the rocking when a child because his parents disapproved , even though he found it very reassuring. I must admit that I found it challenging, mainly because it makes me a bit dizzy sometimes, until I read about ASD and understood the soothing and sensory-seeking elements.

I’ve also seen stimming and the talking aspects described in children with ADHD at work, although the stims are more likely to be tapping, drumming, walking around in lessons etc.

This just seems bizarrely self-indulgent and totally lacking in awareness. I do realise I am being harsh.

I understand many of your concerns, especially if behaviour that seems irritating or antisocial is affecting her relationships with others or her interation with the world at large, moreso if getting markedly worse.

But as she has always been like this to an extent, I'm genuinely interested (ie not trolling you) to find out why you think your way (standing still, not humming, waiting to speak, or whatever it is) has always been the right way or better way of being than hers?

Particularly in her own home, and to a lesser extent around her family that she is comfortable with, why does she need to totally toe the line in terms of behaviour that you find more acceptable or less irritating?

…and yet an autistic person upthread says this resonates with her and agrees it’s possible she may be autistic.