The NHS is collapsing - what can we do?

[FedUpWithTheNHS]

First of all, I am not interested to do more bashing on GPs, NHS, nurses and whatnot. I sincerely do not think the issue is with them. So let's leave it at that.

But I have been trying to get some support for myself and struggle to get anywhere.
I have family members who have been waiting months, turning into years for severe issues and they are left in pain and scared.
I read threads on here (the one on sepsis, cancer scare etc...) and it's more of the same.

The system is collapsing but there isn't a private sector to pick up the pieces. I had to wait 4 mnths to see a cardiologist privately.... And now another 6 weeks to be able to have the prescription from my GP (At more than £100 per month, I just can't afford to get said prescription privately).
It very much feels like we are left to die, from no healthcare, tbh.

So far, I have written to my MP.
I am supporting groups working against the 'privatisation of the NHS'.
I'd vote Labour but tbh, just now, I can't say theyve filled me with confidence they will actually do what is needed. Which is increasing funding and ensuring doctors and nurses are staying in the UK and the NHS (at the very least)

What else can I, we, do?
I feel like we need to start shouting. LOUD. Very loud. But I am at loss as to what else I can do :((

Graduated tax increases dependent on what you earn. The rich should be fucking taxed more any way. If they don't like it then fuck off out of the country.

And what happens when everyone who can afford to leave does in fact leave? When all the corporation's and businesses that hold all the employment leave?

What then? Who do you tax then?

@CriticalAlert how do you know if it’s a minor complain?

Recently, I’ve had a mole that bled. Absolutely nothing serious. GP thinks I caught but I wasn’t aware of it. Is that a minor complain? How was I suppose to know?

There is a recent thread where a woman went to A&E after being hit on the head. Was told by doctor it’s all fine and the OP felt she shouldn’t have gone ‘because ut was nothing really’. But how was she supposed to know?

The issue with talking about minor complain is that people are not doctors. They simply cannot make that sort of evaluation. Remember that it’s the same population that needs leaflets written at the reading level of a 10yo. Would you trust your 10yo to take that sort if decision?

Well that could be an issue if they bugger off how do you get the funding? And who picks up the tax they paid, now gone

That's why I'd trust Starmer when he says he's going to change it.

On this change what has he said that you particularly like? Ie which policy

Has it ever happened?

I mean even France who has much much higher tax levels than the U.K. is attracting companies and investment. Even with the recurring strikes.
Just now the reason companies are leaving (I’m thinking the automotive industry for example) isn’t taxes. It’s brexit.

The reality is that if your workforce is ill because there is no healthcare, then companies are buggered anyway. Sick leave increases. You can’t find people to do the job because they are ill. It’s costly for companies too….

I thought Welsh Labour - who have income tax raising powers in Wales - had decline to raise it recently even for higher rate tax payers because of the adverse effects predicted for the economy at least still more stable post covid and how little it would actually raise for NHS as budgets which are magnitudes bigger than they could raise.

I think everyone will due just to demographics end up paying more tax and not just for the NHS over next decades and suffering service cuts.

I've seen recently suggestion sluggish UK economy is possible being impacted by discretionary spending declining - as house, heating and food costs bite more and more of the population are affected and cut back shutting more business that then close - can't see higher taxes helping with that.

I think most of the population like the NHS - but I think it needs looking at - it's so big has so many scandals needs reform and huge amount more money but I don't think there any political will to do more than tinker.

@CriticalAlert plenty of people don’t want to pay anymore including me. I'm sick of my taxes going into a system I struggle to access - I would rather pay insurance and have more and better choice.

And you will be glad to know I am fucking off to another country! Taking my higher rate tax with me. And if we overtax all the wealth generators they won't invest which means labour will have even less money to pump into your romanticised notion of the NHS.

And of course I know it isn't free, what I said was free at the point of use.

You could pour (and we do) millions into the NHS and it still wouldn't function as it should. It needs reforming - there is so much waste and bad management and needs a cross party solution to even attempt it. It is performing a function it was never set up to do.

You are delusional if you think Labour will come in and wave a magic wand.

Increasing tax for large corporations will mean they will look to move operations to a lower taxed jurisdiction - not a good.
Likewise you can't tax the super wealthy too much or they will leave the UK. A couple of years ago the top 1% paid more than a third of the UK's income tax. Upset that 1% and suddenly you are looking at having to hike everyone's tax very significantly to plug that enormous tax hole. Meaning the poorer suffer even more.
I don't pretend to have the answers but making the UK an unattractive location to do business or live if you are wealthy will only make the situation worse.

I’ve certainly put in more than I’ve taken out.

Wow you seem very angry@CriticalAlert i hope starmer delivers you the country of your dreams if he can scrape a majority which looks doubtful.

Certainly not a Tory by the way but that wouldn’t fit your narrative so 🤷‍♀️

NHS could do with not doing silly things that cost them money.

My NHS friend told me that staff at her clinic always put too much stuff in medical waste bins that don’t need to go in there. Costs more to dispose of.

Also, NHS sends me so many letters for appointments when I just need a text. One time i got a letter to say the appt had been cancelled 2 days after it was supposed to take place. Stop sending so much post.

You have given me a real laugh today. Bye bye Tory.

Well I've just read The Wire .

We apparently have the 12th worse gender health gap in the entire world leaving 50% of population living long lives but in chronic poor health- often because our NHS used male body as default so miss common symptoms in women- medical training is women symptom's is poor - testing drugs in women poor and GP confuse common with normal and ignore impact on daily lives. Research on women condition is frequently not happening.

Really bad air pollution which is adversely affect a surprising number of health conditions - issue in city I'm in we keep exceeding limits set.

They also had articles also suggest government should get serious about diets and standing up to food lobby.

Also had predictions heath service will collapse winter 2023 to extent we'll all notice.

So not be female as that's clearly just unhelpful, live in better locations with good air quality ideally outside cities, be rich in time and money to have a good diet and do not get sick this winter.

Same with my OH - when he was first diagnosed, he had loads of tests at our local hospitals, i.e. skeletal x-rays, mri scans, bone marrow sample, etc. He had the first course of treatment at the local hospital, then he had to go to a hospital in the next town (same trust) for the next stage of the treatment. At the first consultation with the new oncologist, he had, literally, nothing, no file, no access to test results, nothing but a one page referral letter. First thing he did was order a whole new set of tests - exactly the same - skeletal x-ray, bone marrow, mri, etc. What a colossal waste of time and money! It wasn't until the third consultation that he got the results through of the first course of treatment, i.e. what had been prescribed/infused, the blood tests showing the effect, etc. So much wasted time, money and effort. I could just about understand if it were different trusts, but it was the same trust, two hospitals just 20 miles apart. Mind bogglingly inefficient.

Yes, it happened in the 70s where nearly all our authors emigrated due to Labour's penal "unearned income" tax rate of something like 98%.

It happens all the time with pop stars, actors, athletes, footballers, Formula 1 drivers, who relocate their "home" to tax havens etc.

Lewis Hamilton bought a plane via the Isle of Man so he could avoid paying VAT on it. Nigel Mansell "moved" to the Isle of Man to avoid paying UK tax on his earnings.

Usane Bolt and other top athletes got special tax dispensations to appear at the London Olympics which was effectively a tax haven for the duration of the games - top athletes like him threatened not to come unless they were given tax-haven status!

David Frost lived abroad but jetted in every Sunday to do his Sunday morning TV program and limited the number of days he appeared to stay "non resident" to avoid UK taxation.

Top musicians/pop stars carefully plan the dates and destinations of their World tours to avoid being in any one place long enough to have to pay tax there!

You're very aggressive. Are you feeling ok?

David Frost FFS this is nearly 50 years ago. Get some contemporary evidence

Usain Bolt was 2010
Lewis Hamilton was 2017
Why would you choose to ignore the more recent high profile cases and concentrate on an older one (David Frost wasn't 50 years ago by the way - it was more recent than that - late 90s'/early 00's!)
A quick google reveals numerous other famous/rich people who've left the UK to live in tax havens or low tax jurisdictions.

Isn’t that the point. Those examples had a detrimental effect so by the time Blair came around he changed tack and didn’t introduce taxes such as non dom, or even higher top end tax

New Labour keeping people onside rather than driving them away

This too.

There are companies set up to help people find advantageous tax locations, if not here another country will happily oblige

Check the real reasons, its weather, access to training, being close to other artists /rich people and sportsman/women who tend to congregate around certain areas... ask Coultard why he went to Monaco, he has explained why or why some of the UK's top cyclists live in Andorra.

Mansell lived nr Exeter for much of his retirement.

The UK hasn't got particularly onerous tax rates and the vast majority of people pay the higher rates and/or employ accountants to reduce liabilities.

Anyway, there is plenty of money in the UK, regardless of if a very few F1 drivers emigrate, there is a £25bn tax gap between earned and unearned income, as we all saw with Sunaks tax return.

But even if Tory supporters bleat on about the wealthy & their tax problems, whats the alternative? have no NHS, no state education and crumbling roads to protect the super wealthy?

Crazy thinking, then again voting Tory and Brexit (most Tories supported it) against your and your childrens best interests is also crazy.

If everyone who would be better off in a lower tax loaction left the uk well i suspect we wouldn't have a housing crisis

Look at how many people in the Scottish border regions have moved a few miles south into England to reduce their tax bills- almost half hhe population has left by now surely ?

Actually it is that simple. Buy a packet of 200mg ibuprofen from the supermarket for 75p.
Take 4 of them. There's no difference in the amount of Ibuprofen you're getting.

There's not point targeting the 1% (global elite) as they can evade it. The gov will need to come after housing wealth of the older generation. They haven't really tapped that & they are not particularly mobile in terms of upping sticks!