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How to build Dd7's self esteem

59 replies

Florencenotflo · 12/05/2023 11:15

Sorry for the long post. I'm really struggling at the moment, despite googling I'm still at a loss.

Dd is 7, she used to be so confident, un-bothered by friend drama and able to find friends anywhere. Since the start of year 2 she's really changed.

Her best friend moved abroad in the summer before year 2 and I know she's really missing her. We've tried to stay in touch via pictures and videos sent between her mum and me. But it's not the same.

Dd has found another little group but 'Amy' is certainly in charge in this group and likes to tell dd when she can and can't play with them. I've tried to stay out of it and try to help dd deal with it herself (she doesn't want me speaking to her teacher). Dd says she's alone a lot of the time. She's mentioned letting them boss her around so they'll like her which of course we've talked about.

Dd has always been the tallest in her class and is certainly stocky, our whole family are (DH and I both used to play rugby) but she is healthy and very active. We don't comment on our own bodies negatively and I've always been positive around dd (even if I do have hang ups). But a boy in her swimming group called her fat and she's hung onto this since then.

Now anywhere we go, even school, getting dressed results in a meltdown over her tummy sticking out. It's sticks out the normal amount for a 7 year old (especially as she usually pokes it out further to prove her point).

No matter what I do, I can't seem to get my little girl back to how she was and it's breaking my heart. I struggled exactly as she is now but my parents said it was 'character building' and left me to it. It wasn't, it caused years of damage and eventually depression which only resolved when I found a group of friends in my late teens.

How do I raise her self esteem, her self confidence and get her to see how amazing she really is.

OP posts:
Talkwhilstyouwalk · 13/05/2023 14:57

I'm so sorry, children can be so unkind. How dare any child ever call her fat! I'd be inclined to change swimming lessons to avoid said child.....little shit!

I don't have the answers but some good confidence building activities:

Climbing wall
Drama - LAMDA qualifications are excellent
Outdoor activities such as forest school or gardening club
Brownies is also a good one, so hopefully she'll get into that soon!

The teacher being made aware should also help, hopefully they will keep a close eye on things and she will be sat with some kind children.

Playdates are also good!

She will find her people in time....

Fraggiola · 13/05/2023 15:23

I would recommend a martial art as they are great at building self-esteem in girls and boys.

Obviously keep her off all screens and social media and help her be involved with groups and friend groups outside school.

Floralnomad · 13/05/2023 15:36

Don’t speak to the parents , speak to the teachers . If it doesn’t improve would it be possible to look at a change of schools . As always on threads about children with self esteem issues I will recommend horse riding as it is the absolute best thing for self esteem and ponies / horses are lovely to tell your problems to .

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

BOOTS52PollyPrissyPants · 13/05/2023 15:51

Get her into some form of either boxing, mixed martial arts for children, kick boxing, will build her confidence and make her strong mentally and physically and she will make new friends.

CharlieBoo · 13/05/2023 16:00

I’m sorry to hear your little girl is going through this. My dd also had her best friend move abroad when she was in year 5 and it was tough.

Absolutely tell the teacher about the bullying. I’d encourage her to stay away from that group of girls and maybe encourage some other friendships by inviting someone over for tea, maybe something will click.

it doesn’t get any easier, my dd is almost 14 and the daily challenge of kids and their nasty comments can really take its toll. And she is confident enough, but it just chips away at them bit by bit. I always used to tell her not to say anything unkind back, but now I just tell her to tell them to fuck off 🙈 guess you can’t do that in year 2 🤣

Sandrose · 13/05/2023 16:17

Hi @Florencenotflo

I am sorry to hear that your little girl is having a difficult time at the moment. It is so hard to see our children suffering.

Sorry, this is going to be a fairly long post. I hope it is helpful in some way to you.

Firstly, I am saddened to see how many of the responses to your post have focussed on your daughter's body and/or body image. I know they are well-intentioned, but they are the product of a culture of fat-phobia and body-policing which is ultimately really damaging to self-esteem.

I am going to talk about that issue first, and then get on to the more important question of what might help your daughter right now.

My experience: like you, I was on the larger size as a child. Objectively, I was overweight between the ages of about 9 and 12/13 but my negative feelings about my body lasted a lot lot longer than that fairly temporary time of actually being overweight. These came primarily from being steeped in a culture (as my mother was) of being ashamed/terrified of being too large. My mum encouraged me to join her in dieting, aged 13. I lost weight but remained terrified of gaining weight, being seen as fat, or being asked about my weight.

Children of both sexes, like adults of both sexes, come in different shapes and sizes. Being a larger girl (whether you have a lot of body fat or not) is really hard; it often feels that being tall is only acceptable if you are very slim too. But some people naturally carry more muscle and/or fat than others.

My daughter has a similar build to me. Like me, as a younger child she was not a waif, but by no means fat. When I saw her putting on weight at around 8 or 9 (despite eating in a natural way) I was so fearful that this was the beginning of the same 'weight' ie body issues that I had.

Thankfully the big difference for her was that I had by then been working with a family therapist for some years by then, who had helped me see the negative patterns of shame around body size in my family and start to work to changing it. I was able to avoid restricting her diet in subtle or not-so-subtle ways, and allow her to keep eating naturally ie in tune with her hunger and from a wide selection of 'healthy' and 'not-so-healthy' foods. To my amazement I saw that once her periods started at 11.5 years, her body lost weight. Now at almost 13 she is a natural, healthy weight. Slim but not skinny - with more body fat than some of her peers, with more muscle than some of her peers, but very definitely her natural size and shape. That was her experience - of course we are all different shapes and sizes - but I mention this as evidence for the idea that it can be far better to eat naturally/intuitively, and to accept changes in body size and shape as we develop, than make an issue out of what we eat and what we weight, which so often sets people up for a lifetime of shame, food-restriction/disordered eating, and yo-yo dieting.

Turning back to the issue of self-esteem, the reason I started working with a therapist was that my son was struggling with various issues, including anxiety. The therapist opened my eyes to a different way of looking at self-esteem and where it comes from. It's a lot to try to explain here, but in a nutshell the idea is that self-esteem (and long term good mental health) comes ultimately from our relationships with our family - i.e. attachment relationships. Specifically, from seeing truly seen and understood by our parents for who we are, from having our feelings listened too (but not over-reacted to), from having reliable adult structure, but not harsh boundaries. It is simple in a nutshell but much more complex and challenging to achieve, especially when we (the parents) are carrying baggage from our own childhoods.

You mentioned that you had similar struggles to your daughter at that age, and that your parents 'left you to it'. You are trying to do something different but it's really hard to see what to do when you didn't receive that yourself. This was my position about 7 years ago. In my experience, listening to your child worries, sadnesses, fears etc without over-reacting or dismissing/minimising can be much harder than you think it might be, particularly when the issue is something you experienced as a child and were not comforted in.

I wish there was an easy 'go to' book which would I could recommend which explained all this but I feel like I've read millions and none was the absolute nugget. But things like "The Opposite of Worry" by Lawrence Cohen was a good one - about the value of play with parents as an antidote to the stresses of childhood, and the feeling of safety that comes when you can express your feelings to your parents and have them accepted. Theraplay was the main therapy we received, and there is a Theraplay book of parenting which might also help. Writers such as Daniel Hughes and Kim Golding might also be useful if you want to explore more.

You mentioned that your daughter now worries about her tummy; the legacy of a hurtful comment at school. Another way of looking at this is that she is fearful of the feelings of hurt, and perhaps humiliation she felt in that moment. She wants more than anything to avoid feeling that feeling again.

I know how horrible that can be. Even though I can only recall one comment along these lines to me as a child, I still remember the incident with pain.

The long term solution is not to seek to change her so that no-one ever says something like this to her again. It is to help her process those painful feelings from that moment, so that the sting of them starts to fade, and help her to feel the unshakable force of your love for her, your acceptance of her just as she is, whether she is feeling happy or sad, brave or timid, angry or conciliatory. It is that unshakeable sense of being valued, indeed treasured, for being her, that will form the deep well of self-esteem which will all hope will see our children through the challenges they will inevitably face in the future.

Blossombathing · 13/05/2023 16:27

I may get flamed for this but it worked for us. We have 3 dds that are all teens now.

There are a few ways you can crack this:

Choose one or two girls from the group each week and really fun play dates - memorable ones that will be shared. Encouraging deeper friendships.

If old enough, super fun sleepovers

Consider inviting the parents, it’s easier to bring up issues if you know them well

Expand her friendship groups inside and outside school so she has many children to choose from and not just the group of girls

Take in sweets, friendship bracelets and fun stuff every week - it works

Tell her she is amazing every day. Highlight what she is good at, point out constantly acts of kindness, skills no matter how small and embolden her to love her powerful body - remind her how wonderful it is to be tall and powerful. It will work. She needs to learn to fight back with words ‘are you always so rude to people’ ‘coming from someone as ugly as you’ etc - she needs to empower herself by standing up to horrid comments with cone backs. This won’t get any easier so give her the tools to defend herself.

Be bold. You need to give her tools and confidence to stand up for herself.

Most teachers won’t have the time for petty playground politics. So teach her how to manage horrible children and girl friendships.

WhackADoozy · 13/05/2023 16:32

But maybe the OP is trying to avoid having to put her primary school child in therapy or having negative feelings about her body. She doesn't want her to have anxiety like your child or to have to read 'millions' of self help books which is why she's trying to take action.

I don't think it's enough for a child to 'feel the unshakable force of your love for her, your acceptance of her just as she is, whether she is feeling happy or sad, brave or timid, angry or conciliatory. It is that unshakeable sense of being valued, indeed treasured, for being her, that will form the deep well of self-esteem which will all hope will see our children through the challenges they will inevitably face in the future."

Children can't build self esteem from their own mothers telling them they are great.

The OP's child needs to get her self-esteem form other places than just her mother. Maybe she's good at drawing or at maths, maybe she's interested in Pokémon and the OP can help her dd peruse some interesting activities out of school where she can meet different people with things in common with her.

abpsoton · 13/05/2023 16:34

I am so glad you wrote this, as someone who has struggled with weight issues all my life I wish people could understand even a tiny bit of the damage unintentional fat shaming can do. Thank you x

Blossombathing · 13/05/2023 16:41

A mothers ‘unshakeable love’ will pale into into insignificance when she is facing bullies, it’s a little like asking her to put an imaginary bubble around herself - it’s ineffective. She will powerful if she stands up for herself properly, and doesn’t become a doormat, the more she does this confidently the better she will manage, creating respect in her peer groups which will mean a whole lot more than Mummy’s unshakeable force.

I agree we have to listen properly, without reacting emotionally and respond by saying what do you think would work? What do yon want to try first? We are on your team, every step of the way. She knows you have her back.

TeenLifeMum · 13/05/2023 16:49

Check the language you use because it really matters. I have identical twins but one has always been smaller than the other from birth but also the smaller one is less food focussed and more active. The “bigger” one is a totally normal size but used to compare herself. She’d say “I have fat thighs” and I’d say “nope, you have STRONG thighs”. That was around age 7. She’s now 11 and always refers to her thighs as strong. That one sentence stuck with her more powerfully than I could ever imagine.

Usernamen · 13/05/2023 17:28

Sorry for my ignorance, but is a child choosing their friends considered bullying? If no mean words are exchanged but some children prefer to hang out together without other children, can OP legitimately report this as bullying to the teacher?

I don’t remember friendship groups being policed like this when I was in school, I’m just wondering if that has changed?

Sandrose · 13/05/2023 17:48

WhackADoozy · 13/05/2023 16:32

But maybe the OP is trying to avoid having to put her primary school child in therapy or having negative feelings about her body. She doesn't want her to have anxiety like your child or to have to read 'millions' of self help books which is why she's trying to take action.

I don't think it's enough for a child to 'feel the unshakable force of your love for her, your acceptance of her just as she is, whether she is feeling happy or sad, brave or timid, angry or conciliatory. It is that unshakeable sense of being valued, indeed treasured, for being her, that will form the deep well of self-esteem which will all hope will see our children through the challenges they will inevitably face in the future."

Children can't build self esteem from their own mothers telling them they are great.

The OP's child needs to get her self-esteem form other places than just her mother. Maybe she's good at drawing or at maths, maybe she's interested in Pokémon and the OP can help her dd peruse some interesting activities out of school where she can meet different people with things in common with her.

Wow @WhackADoozy . I'm sorry you feel the need to make a dig about seeing therapy to help a child (and indeed family) in deed. For what it's worth, my child is now a 15 year who does not suffer with anxiety, precisely because of the therapeutic process and what we learned/how we developed from it.

@Blossombathing I don't actually disagree with what you wrote in your first post. Being able to stand up to bullies is great. But if you are a mother who has been shamed about their appearance, for example, [OP I'm not saying this is you btw, but this was me] then telling that mother to help their child stand up to fat-shaming bullies is not a simple thing. Because the mother has internalised those shaming messages herself. Deep within her she believes the bullies might be right.

The self esteem that comes from true acceptance from one's parents, and the security of a relationship with them in which you are fully accepted IS like having little bubble around you. It is what helps the child BELIEVE that is is the bully's problem, not their own. To be able to say "you are so rude!" and walk away rather than have those arrows hit. You can learn to say those words (though I never could) and still not believe them. If the mother who is telling you the words doesn't fully believe in them themselves, it is hard to believe in them yourself.

Sandrose · 13/05/2023 17:50

*in need, not in deed.

Bilingualspingual · 13/05/2023 17:55

If you’re on instagram, an interesting man to follow is Doc Amen, a brain expert. His take is the more responsibility you give your child, the greater their self esteem, rather than telling them they’re great all the time. I know this is a bit more left field and I know she’s only seven, but maybe worth thinking about? And yes to martial arts, definitely.

Glo1988 · 13/05/2023 18:25

Sorry you’re seeing her go through this. My daughter had the same.

I’m another vote for Speak to teacher. Also some sort of club / team. And a positivity jar - get a little jar or tub that she can decorate and then you and teacher put in little notes of things she’s done well / great things about her character.

Round123 · 13/05/2023 18:36

This excellent book :)
https://thebodyimagebookforgirls.com/
sending you both a big hug x

The Body Image Book for Girls

https://thebodyimagebookforgirls.com/

Talkwhilstyouwalk · 13/05/2023 18:39

Usernamen · 13/05/2023 17:28

Sorry for my ignorance, but is a child choosing their friends considered bullying? If no mean words are exchanged but some children prefer to hang out together without other children, can OP legitimately report this as bullying to the teacher?

I don’t remember friendship groups being policed like this when I was in school, I’m just wondering if that has changed?

Kindness and inclusivity is and should be a big focus in schools.

Talkwhilstyouwalk · 13/05/2023 18:40

Kindness and inclusivity are and should be a big focus in primary schools.

Fourpeasinapodcast · 13/05/2023 18:41

The self esteem that comes from true acceptance from one's parents, and the security of a relationship with them in which you are fully accepted IS like having little bubble around you. It is what helps the child BELIEVE that is is the bully's problem, not their own. To be able to say "you are so rude!" and walk away rather than have those arrows hit. You can learn to say those words (though I never could) and still not believe them. If the mother who is telling you the words doesn't fully believe in them themselves, it is hard to believe in them yourself

Have to disagree. Kids can be vipers, they say what they see and if a child is overweight, they will say it, if a child is small for their age, they will say it. The fact the child ALREADY knows they are overweight or tiny compared to the others only cements the fact. The child KNOWS! No mother can save their kid from that. What planet are you on? You can be fully accepted at home and live in Mum's bubble but life is not like that on the outside. Those comments do not bounce off the imaginary self esteem bubble your mother gave you. Kids tend to care a hell of a lot less about what their parents think and more about what their peers do. That is basic, human nature. They want the acceptance of their peers not their mother, they want to be valued by their friends not their mother.

The self esteem that comes from true acceptance from one's parents, and the security of a relationship with them in which you are fully accepted IS like having little bubble around you. It is what helps the child BELIEVE that is is the bully's problem, not their own. To be able to say "you are so rude!" and walk away rather than have those arrows hit. You can learn to say those words (though I never could) and still not believe them. If the mother who is telling you the words doesn't fully believe in them themselves, it is hard to believe in them yourself

This is trite shite to be honest.

Fourpeasinapodcast · 13/05/2023 18:44

feel the unshakable force of your love for her, your acceptance of her just as she is, whether she is feeling happy or sad, brave or timid, angry or conciliatory. It is that unshakeable sense of being valued, indeed treasured, for being her, that will form the deep well of self-esteem which will all hope will see our children through the challenges they will inevitably face in the future

Sorry this is trite shite.

The other one I quoted is trite shite too but this one is triter and shiter.

Sandrose · 13/05/2023 18:52

abpsoton · 13/05/2023 16:34

I am so glad you wrote this, as someone who has struggled with weight issues all my life I wish people could understand even a tiny bit of the damage unintentional fat shaming can do. Thank you x

@abpsoton I am making an assumption here that you are referring to my earlier post. If so, you are really welcome. If not, my mistake Blush.

Fat shaming/body shaming is so prevalent in our culture, sometimes so hard to call out for what it is, and so damaging. I'm so sorry you too have suffered Flowers

Ihaventgottimeforthis · 13/05/2023 18:56

If she's interested in rugby and you and your DH can talk about it with passion & knowledge then start watching the Red Roses games & social media even.
The absolute love & respect shown to players who have all sorts of body types is genuinely inspiring and they are such a powerful & impactful team who all support each other.
I think as well as body positivity it shows what true friendship & team work is, and there are lessons there for us all in life and in sport.
Seeing strong, stocky, powerful women being successful & happy and proud, on the telly! is so brilliant.

Bobbinsbop · 13/05/2023 18:59

Does her school have do the ELSA program? Dd has been struggling with her self esteem and did it with her school it has really helped her.

Hopehelps · 13/05/2023 19:14

Hi there,
I’m sorry your daughter is struggling with this. My son was about the same age and was going through a bit of a tricky patch. We used to do a lot of art projects at home. My son had done quite an elaborate diorama of cave man type theme - food, a fire, cave etc etc. I don’t know why but he took it in and his teacher’s reaction was really insightful I thought. She said that he had shown it and that it was helpful for the other children to see him in a new light / for something he had done.
When you talk to your daughters teacher perhaps ask whether there is a show and tell or some way that kids can share things even in an informal way if there is something she can share that she is proud of / has been given / has made.

unfortunately the sticky problem with self esteem is that it is a by product of other things - a sense of mastery, control, happiness in other areas, peer approval.
I would second those who mention clubs. Make some connections with friends outside of school so your daughter has other playmates.

I would also suggest a couple of ‘high status’ play dates where your daughter and friend or friends go for a treat play date if you can afford it - movie or something like that. Something a little bit special. Have you got a pottery painting place near you? There will be an ‘artifact’ of their fun time. Or maybe making cupcakes as activities can break down barriers. I know it must be tough with work.

I would also look at praise - how do you praise her ? Painful though it is - descriptive praise is brilliant. “I noticed you kept going with that task - that took stick-at-it-ness.” OR “You seem to be a little sad today but you’re still putting on your shoes for the park. Which part of the playground will you go to first ?”

There is a great book called Positive Parenting which I would recommend. At the end of the day they suggest to spend time before the child goes to sleep talki about the best bits of the day and projecting forward to the things the child might be happy or looking forward to. Parents to do the same. It’s a nice ritual and other (less happy stuff comes up naturally so can be discussed). We also drew diagrams with ‘islands’ and we explored my sons world with people closer to him and far away in terms of friendship and closeness. These change over time so it can be helpful to keep them to give a sense of perspective. I’m sure that would help her with her friend that has left. My son started drawing bridges to people on islands he wanted to get to know. You could also do this to help her look at different parts of her life - school is a big part obviously but what about swimming, seeing grandparents etc

Definitely look at her weight and talk to the teacher. 12 is old enough to be able to ask not to tell the teacher - I think your daughter is too young to make that call. Our son had a lisp and we loved him so much we didn’t even notice. Try and rule out any processed foods especially at 7.

start a project with beginning, middle and end. Do it together. Can be simple or practical.

You sound like a great mum by the way.