What will happen to all the ten year old electric cars?

[Theeaglesoared]

I'm thinking of buying an electric car. The price of second hand EVs has plummeted in recent months so I could now get a 1-2 year old EV for the same price as its petrol equivalent.

All well and good but it got me thinking: the batteries in EVs wear out after 100,000 miles or 10 years. A replacement battery is currently around £8000.

But will owners really replace the battery? On a 10 year old car? I can't see it happening. So are we going to see loads of cars effectively dumped in 10 years' time?

It seems massively bad for the environment but I can't find the answer to this anywhere! It probably won't put me off buying an EV (I don't want to lease for various reasons) but I am interested, because I assume my car will be worthless in a few years.

If anyone out there is in the car industry I'd love to hear your views.

This worries me as I bought my car at 6 years old - it's now 18 years old and done over 200 000 miles.
Dh replaced his car (4x4) last year with a 10 year old one.

I wouldn't want to buy a second hand EV.

There must be many like me, but who also can't afford to buy new. Or need 4x4 or similar, live rurally, in a rented property so can't install a charging point etc.

Its because over the lifetime of the vehicle, the overall carbon emissions are greater because of the fuel use.
Assuming electricity grid decarbonises as planned.
Burning fossil fuels contributes to global warming which is the most pressing environmental concern because there is the potential to pass irreversible tipping points, which would cause runaway climate change and worldwide damage eclipsing other types of environmental damage, which can in theory be reversed (like dead rivers, acid rain, the hole in the ozone layer as examples).
So EV batteries are damaging to the environment, but not to the extent that global warming is.
The best course for the environment would be to reduce the number of cars of any type, but that is very difficult to do.
And the automotive industry is large, creates wealth and employs a lot of people.
Sustainability is about balancing the needs of the environment, society and economy. Most issues are very complex such as this.
The only thing to do is to proceed with the evidence and knowledge we have now because waiting will cause us to exceed carbon budgets (the amount of carbon we know we can emit before there is a high chance we reach tipping points).

@SecretVictoria How do you ever go anywhere? That would barely do one round trip to work for me. And is why I won’t consider an EV😨
The range the poster mentioned in fir 1st gen. They are all 200 miles plus now. Increasingly 300. That is more than enough for most people. Tbf, most people have a much shorter commute than you and would even manage with the 60! If you aren't one of those people then don't buy an EV 🤷🏻‍♀️

@onefinemess you tell your little story to the families who have lost love ones to inner city pollution induced deaths. Cling in to your rhetoric - flawed as it is.
Truth is all options have downsides but to ignore the climate change crisis and health issues caused by burning fossil fuels in concentrated areas is just asinine.

As with all things, it's useful to think of potential motivations - such as wanting to maintain a high sale price, not wanting to acknowledge making a mistake, sunken costs fallacy, still believing that EVs have to be the only way - maybe some still feel the lingering sting from having bought wood burners 'for the environment' as they were sold around 2005...

If you're interested in the facts behind rare earth metals and the impact of EVs you may enjoy this BBC Podcast.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/series/m001cdr7

Given the challenges around infrastructure, it seems bizarre that we’re not seeing huge investment in public transport. Surely making that a truly viable option - both time and money-wise - should be top priority.

I have a Mini E. can’t comment on battery deg as it’s too new. I leased it because I was uncertain where the EV market will go and because frankly I prefer cars to be someone else’s problem when they go wrong. I’m too old to be passing about under cars of a weekend and the days of home mechanics are gone with all the modern tech on them.

My range at this time of year is about 125 miles so at the lower end of the new EVs, but the Mini is very much a city car and suits my needs perfectly. I don’t really understand people who complain about EV range, you buy a car that suits your needs surely?
I have done occasional longer journeys in it and needed a charge stop, usually by the time I’ve used the loo, grabbed a coffee and eaten a sandwich I’m good to go again. Almost all of my journeys are local though with 95% of the charging done on my drive.

The car it replaced was a big old diesel 4x4. From a driving perspective I much prefer the EV, it’s a lot more fun and with the one pedal driving a bit like a go kart. Would o have another? Most likely yes. It suits my needs at the moment. I’d still lease I think, but again that’s mostly my personal choice to not have the hassle.

Talking to ds friend this week who works for a high end make of car range. They're worried. With the long order times customers are getting cold feet as interest rates rise and cancelling their order even at the 11th hour. This leaves showroom with unwanted new vehicles.

Err what you've said is not true. eVs have a much longer life than ICE vehicles cos the engines are simpler - less stuff to go wrong - so the car will last a lot longer.

The thing with batteries is to look after them. Charge to 85%, not 100%. The prob is that the range remains poor. I need >400 miles in winter per charge because of my work journeys. I've been coaxing my 11yo 240k miles ICE for 2 years waiting for new battery tech to be released, but sadly even though it was promised last year, it's not here. My car broke down 3 weeks ago, so I've just leased an ICE - had to get one that was available sadly no hybrids around, just petrol. 😞

How can one connect one's car battery to one's house? I'd love to understand this!

Can you explain how this works please? 🙏

Ours does 240 miles on a charge. That should be enough to get you to work?

I have a hybrid car and every time I get the car serviced at a main dealer they extend the battery warranty. So if it does wear out, they will replace it. It is 7 years old but fairly low mileage (still under 28k miles so the plan is to drive it until it's too much of a rust bucket to drive).

Agree with needing massive investment in cycle infrastructure too. I would cycle much more if the infrastructure were there. We do have one dedicated cycle path in my town but that's it really.

Yes and if anything we are doing the opposite. I think the government would love to do away with trains.

Citation needed.

This won't be a problem in the UK in the future as you won't be allowed to drive out of your zone.

They've cut back our trains in Wales again. Come the winter it's always cut back. Our bus services have been cut back too. This when our Welsh government Are passionate about getting cars off the road

Hmm. So you come in saying "I'm
worried about EV's having to have their batteries dumped after ten years, please enlighten me because I know nothing". Lots of people with EVs come on to say from experience that actually batteries last much longer that that in practice, and when they do degrade past usefulness for cars they can be repurposed for home use.

onefinemess, who very much doesn't have an EV comes on to give their usual take on the issue, and suddenly you're thanking them for backing you up.

I'm not completely convinced that you came here in the spirit of open minded enquiry you claim.

People replying to my comment focusing on the carbon footprint part, completely ignoring the human slavery in DRC.

Children dying trying to find cobalt for our EVs

Electric is absolutely not the way forward

www.independent.co.uk/climate-change/news/phone-electric-vehicle-congo-cobalt-mine-b2277665.html

Metal mining in the Congo and elsewhere is a genuine issue. But if you also make unrelated unsubstantiated assertions then that doesn't help your case.

There are battery swap-out stations in China (and elsewhere) although a said, only for certain models. A Chinese company is planning on opening a hundred or so across Europe in 2024, but I guess for their range of car only. But it's a start.

Maybe ether will come a day when EV batteries are a standard size and you have one/two/three in a car dependant on needs so you swap out the number of batteries your car has.

But I'll stick with my ICE motor until the infra-structure improves immensely.

I was just about to say that the world is in thrall to China who control the Congo now and thus 75% of the world's cobalt. But the Chinese aren't known for their health and safety policies.

Both hybrid and pure electric car batteries can be recycled (minerals and metals extracted for reuse) and/or repurposed.

The durability of batteries is proving to be much better than was initially expected.

I agree that govts should be doing more to improve public transport - we have an EV and solar but I would always prefer to travel by public transport if it's workable. Living rurally, getting to other cities is easy but if going between small local towns you really need a car.

Mine does 300 miles on each charge