Do (17) simply can't wake up in the mornings.

[BlastedPimples]

It's been going on for months.

He just can't get up in the mornings. I bring him coffee. Shake him awake. Set an alarm. He just sleeps through it. Open the blinds but the daylight doesn't wake him.

He has depression. He sees a psychologist. No medication. He refuses to take any. Fair enough.

He's missing 50%+ of his A level courses. Already he's had to drop down a year because he did so badly in his AS levels last year (E and two Us)

He's had blood tests. All normal.

He wants to get up and go to school but it's like he's a total zombie in the mornings and incapable. Perhaps insomnia? He says he doesn't sleep well.

I'm at a loss as to how to help anymore and I just leave him to it now.

He's nearly 18 and I can't do anything else. School will kick him out if he doesn't do well this time around as they require minimum C grade to progress to full A level.

He gets up around midday. Manages afternoon school sometimes. The gym. Rugby training. Is he just bone idle?

Is there anything else I'm missing that he could try? Or I should do?

He's going to bed at midnight and getting up at 7 so 7 hours sleep, not 12. If it were 12, this would definitely be something to see GP about!

No he's not - he is supposed to get up at 7am but he doesn't/ can't. He gets up at 12 noon. So he is sleeping for 12 hours.

He is obviously highly unlikely to go to bed at 7pm, and would need to go to bed at 9pm even to get 10 hours and be up at 7am, but he should definitely be going by 10pm, not midnight as he can't continue to sleep midnight until noon.

Ah OK. You're assuming he's actually sleeping till midday if he gets up then and I'm assuming he's not really. OP, which is it? Does he just properly stay asleep until then having properly gone to sleep at 12?

Melatonin makes it very hard to wake in the mornings unless you've had a very long sleep (at least 9-10 hours for my young child)

If he actually has depression it won't be solved by going to bed earlier obviously, but it would help to go early enough to have at least a chance of getting enough sleep to be up at 7am.

Robert Webb has written some insightful autobiographical stuff on depression in young men. Not a manual or self help books in any way, but insightful.

My ds worked out that once you're in a sleep routine, not to ruin it at the weekend/school holidays. He normally wakes up at 7:30am for school and is up by 9am at the weekend.

If your son sleeps midnight to noon then that means he needs 12 hours sleep. If he has to be awake by 7am it means he needs yo ho to bed at 7pm. Are you sure he's not taking any dodgy gym supplements or powders ? An adult is usually refreshed after 8-10 hours.

Melatonin shouldn't be taken over the counter... they only prescribe to over 55s because over time it can disrupt your body's ability to fall asleep itself.

And yes sleep tablets, including melatonin, leave me like a zombie if I wake up without 9-10 hours of sleep because they're still in the system.

Maybe get him checked for sleep apnea (spelling?) As that can cause you to be really tired.

Simple, he HAS to take the antidepressants. Why piss your life away for the sake of taking a tablet a day? He’s not an adult yet, take it in hand before he’s 18 and you’re powerless.

I'm confused that you've tried literally everything other than going to be earlier. Clearly 7 hours isn't enough for him if he's sleeping till midday. I'd try bed at 10pm with no screens and see what happens.

He's tired because he's not getting enough sleep

Could he have chronic fatigue? My DD has it and she basically never gets refreshed by her sleep and so is chronically tired all the time. She sees a specialist about it.

I would have thought a few weeks of 7 hours sleep would be fine. I'd put him on some supplements, vit d etc. Chronic fatigue is worth a think.

What time is he actually going to sleep?
Spending time w*ing?

I'd say bed an hour before sleep at least 8 hours before he needs to get up.

he's depressed, he needs treatment. You need to help remove the stigma for him. My son was the same. Now he's taking medication and I won't say he's 100% improved but there is definitely an improvement. Encourage him to get the help he needs.

Oh fgs. Poor kid he's clearly anxious and a bit depressed.

He may well be anxious and depressed but these also need responding to with some basic healthy lifestyle changes. Lack of sleep and then the subsequent inability to focus and cope at school are conditions which breed anxiety and depression. Getting the sleep sorted may not sort things out entirely but it is the place to start along with eating a basically healthy diet (which he may already be doing). This can be built on if it's not enough to help him move to a better place.

I hope he makes a good recovery from his depression. Frankly exams can always be taken again. I would be concerned about the risks associated with a young mentally unwell male.
If you have not explained the situation to the school, then please do so. He may agree to a 3 way meet with yourself and his Guidance Teacher but this would need not to be a nagging session.
He might respond to the idea of late afternoon exercise in a gym. This will of course release feel good endorphins and maybe even help with his sleep.
I am on here at 1.29 am because my depression is preventing me from sleeping.

Has he had Covid? If so it could be long covid.