Racist comment or statement of fact?

[Spinxsta]

7 year old DS said that a TA at his school stated "the Chinese eat dogs". He said they were talking about what people in other countries eat.

I feel there should be some context behind a statement that stereotypes people. Maybe "in the past, some of the poorer people in china ate dogs as they were starving" or something.

Another school mum said the statement didn't sit right but she didn't see it as racist.

We spoke to DS about how people have made statements like that in the past to be racist towards Chinese people and make them seem like disgusting people. I want to say something to school but I'm not sure if this is even complaint worthy... it just doesn't sound like something I want my children growing up saying or thinking.

Am I right to feel cross about this or am I overreacting??

Not just pretending, then.

For clarification, I am very much white British myself. I just have a different viewpoint as I have witnessed my DH being racially abused on many occasions because he is ethnic Chinese. Each and every time it was from a white person who was “just stating a fact” or “just joking”. We white people have no bloody idea what it is like to deal with that. Just walking down the street eating a sandwich and someone ‘jokes’ to their friend about the Chinese guy eating a bat sandwich.

But the issue here is those people thinking they are superior because they don’t eat certain food rather than the fact that other foods are eaten in other cultures.
Pretending that these food aren’t eaten just feeds that feeling of superiority.

We need to teach our children to accept and respect other cultures. Not deny or diminish them.

Just to expand a little…

It would be fine for someone to discuss the health implications of being obese.

It would not be ok to use these facts to abuse an obese person.

We shouldn’t shy away from facts because there is a risk some idiots will use them to abuse groups of people.

@Surelyitscoffeetime
Don’t tar all white people with the same brush based upon your own experiences. It’s racist.

@GrinAndVomit
that’s a good way of putting it

I didn’t intend to tar all white people with the same brush. It’s just important that people who are of the majority race in this country think about things from the perspective of the minority. How a comment made is likely to be received.

The post that I recommended white people to read was from a Chinese person who very eloquently explained why she was offended with the comment that Chinese people eat dogs. Walk in another person’s shoes before making a judgement as to whether something is offensive or not.

@GrinAndVomit , no you are wrong. No one should be compelled to “respect” the practice of eating dog meat. Most Chinese people don’t respect it either, and want it banned.

The real issue is that the phrase “Chinese people eat dog meat” is a dog whistle (no pun intended). It is being used to justify or allow racism. It depicts all people of Chinese ethnicity as uncivilised and cruel. It is not used as a rallying call for veganism; it is used as a rallying call for intolerance towards Chinese people.

Consider this: out of 26,000 university professors in the U.K., only 125 are black. Should we then teach our children that black people are less intelligent, less ambitious and lazy? Or do you think perhaps that would be unfair and racist? Would it be appropriate for the OP’s TA to say to the class that “In Britain, Black people do not become professors”, since it’s true for the overwhelming majority of them?

Sometimes, “facts” mask a much more complex reality.

I’m not wrong. I have a different opinion to you. That’s all.
Eating dog meat is no different o any other animal meat in reality.
Condemn animal cruelty. Condemn the way they are treated before and during death. Fine.

Your post is very confused. I’m not the one making judgement calls on people based on their skin colour, ethnicity or country of origin.

It actually goes against my very point.

@Surelyitscoffeetime
Then why not say other races need to read this….You’ve still singled a race out negatively.

prodiscrimination is still discrimination

The more I think about this reply, the madder it is.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with pointing out that there is a disproportionately low number of black people in a particular profession.
The issue is in conflating that with laziness or low intelligence.

Similarly, there is nothing wrong with making the statement that dog is eaten in China. The issue is mocking or belittling people from China and using this as an excuse.

There is nothing to suggest that the teacher went on to call Chinese people names or even pass comment on the morality of the dog meat trade. If she had, that would be sackable offence. As far as we know, she just stated the fact without further comment.

Only you are suggesting that if you are aware that dog meat is consumed in China, that you must also think that they’re “less than” in some way.

Like I have said previously, it's a loaded statement because

1. it is often used to dehumanise and denigrate the Chinese.

1. Dogs are considered to be beloved pets in the UK so saying that someone eats them makes them sound cruel or primitive or like savages though in reality it is of course no worse than eating chicken.

Especially in a school I'd expect teachers or TAs to be aware enough to realise that they cannot make this statement without giving more context. Maybe in this case the TA did but I don't think the op is wrong for potentially questioning if they did.

And as I’ve said, the solution to A is not to deny or pretend it isn’t true, it’s to teach acceptance and respect.

Yeah, let’s teach acceptance and respect by telling kids that the Chinese eat dogs, the Japanese eat whales and black Americans like fried chicken.

I could easily name you 50 interesting facts about Chinese food, and I’m not Chinese. But yes, let’s teach kids about dog meat, as naturally this will lead to acceptance and respect among a group of seven year olds. Are you for real?

You’re twisting yourself in knots trying to deny the obvious racism of choosing THIS particular statement as illustration of “what’s it like to be Chinese”. Which, as many posters have said repeatedly, is not true for the vast majority of Chinese people.

They were learning about foods that are eaten in other countries but not here.

There’s no knot twisting. I think I’m being incredibly consistent. It’s you who seems to be flapping around making racist statements.

And yes, I do think talking about things with children about different cultures will result in respect. Obviously not if you speak about them in the way you have repeatedly done.

Nice - I’m the racist one then. Typical DARVO. I guess I better tell my non white DH and DCs.

Please carry on using that phrase @GrinAndVomit . Have it emblazoned on your tshirt so I know who to avoid. It’s a dog whistle. It’s like #notallmen and #itsokaytobewhite. Or, let the scales fall off your eyes. You are not promoting acceptance and respect, you are promoting a worldview that is divisive and based on othering.

And to spell it out further: we’ve had two family dinners discussing this with my DH and DCs.

DD (14) was instantly appalled and could see how this is a dog whistle.

DS (11) has a Chinese friend at school - let’s call him Jake. This made DS realise that whenever dogs are mentioned, Jake turns it into a “yum, what’s for dinner?” joke. Why? Because Jake has been abused, and has decided to lean in and own the joke. And that is not okay.

We live in one of the most diverse parts of the country, with a huge Chinese community. I have three Chinese households on my door step.

And yet Jake is facing “dog eater” abuse that he needs to turn into a joke. If you think for one second that this “Chinese people eat dogs” shit is promoting inclusion, you are completely deluded. It’s just plain wrong. And it’s been a very painful awakening for my family that the majority view, based on this thread, is that it’s perfectly fine to reference minority practices so as to tar an entire race.

Also, as a reminder, this is a time when record numbers of Hong Kongers are immigrating to the U.K. to flee political persecution. I’m sure the best way to welcome them is to tell them they are dog eaters. 🤔

It’s semantics really. Just like saying people in America love burgers & fries, or people in England love fish & chips/ bangers & mash/ cups of tea. Not everyone in the US will like burgers or eat them. There will be English who hate fish or are vegan etc. It’s about what is considered National dishes, not about arguing whether 100% of people in a country actually eat the dish.

But SOME Chinese people do eat dogs....however you want to try and wave some sort of 'racism' banner, that is a fact. Not all do, but SOME.
And it's not so much that eating of the dogs that's so abhorrent, but the torturous way they are treated and killed, utterly barbaric.

Are we not supposed to mention what some people eat in other countries then, keep it a secret? 🙄
Fwiw I think eating any animal is wrong. But dog eating to a nation of dog lovers is never going to be the most popular choice.

Also, as a reminder, this is a time when record numbers of Hong Kongers are immigrating to the U.K. to flee political persecution. I’m sure the best way to welcome them is to tell them they are dog eaters

I'm sure the majority of Brits can see past that. They're pretty accepting and tolerant of others on the whole. Despite what some like to say about them.

I really don’t think ignoring, denying and sanitising other cultures will do anything to resolve racism.

In fact, I think by not introducing the fact to children in a respectful and normalising way, we will continue to perpetuate the idea that people of other cultures are less than because they eat XYZ or wear XYZ etc.

At some point children will grow up and hear or see these things for themselves. Without sensitive conversations to prepare them, I think they’re actually more likely to jump to the same uneducated assumptions about entire races of people as you have exemplified.

A TA made a statement which lasted about four words and was factual. And there has been 14 pages of discusiion. Unbelievable!

Ethnically Chinese person here.

It's not wrong to say that dog meat is eaten in some parts of China, although it's not as mainstream as some people think.

The Yulin dog festival isn't a traditional or historical event, but something that was started by businesses promoting dog meat trade. As far as I'm aware, most people are against it and want it banned.

It becomes racist when it is used as a negative stereotype against someone who is Chinese. I've personally not had a dog meat joke aimed at me, but would certainly think it racist if someone were to ask me whether I ate dog, as they wouldn't ask someone who was white.

I ate a beaver after a night out in January. Does that count?