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Huge increase in large groups of teenagers terrorising the public

288 replies

Shopaholic100 · 26/02/2023 01:08

Has anyone else noticed a huge increase in large groups of teenagers terrorising the public? I was in York today and there were huge groups of teenage boys causing havoc, screaming, swearing, shouting and pulling peoples hats off and throwing them on the floor as they walked past. At the same time another huge group of girls were also screaming and kicking full cans of fizzy drinks around so it was squirting everywhere. Milton Keynes a few weeks ago was the same with large groups running round John Lewis causing havoc whilst security were trying to get them to leave. In another part of the shopping centre another group were causing trouble too. I’ve seen the same in London too. I used to see small groups sometimes do silly things, but the size of the groups is much larger and threatening and they seem fearless. Anyone else noticed this?

OP posts:
Eve · 26/02/2023 17:45

Small market town in SE, 1st time ever a dispersal order has been issued due to group of teens causing issues.

cakeorwine · 26/02/2023 17:49

User8646382 · 26/02/2023 17:22

Well, all those statistics might be true, but there are many differences between then and now/them and us.

They are spoilt beyond belief and we weren’t. They despise the older generation and we didn’t. Their ‘human rights’ have been respected and ours weren’t. They have never had a clip round the ear or been humiliated by a teacher. They have probably never even been shouted at. They are ruthless, entitled and arrogant. They don’t care about other people because the world revolves around them. Some of them - too many of them - will kill without remorse.

I don’t what the solution is, or even if there is one. If we could go back 50 years and do things differently, society might have a chance. Sadly, I think we are finished.

How old are you?

I grew up in the 70s and 80s and don't really remember much of this behaviour towards children that you describe.

Except corporal punishment at school which was banned in the late 80s?

LexMitior · 26/02/2023 17:49

It's about crappy parenting and crappy expectations. The amount of attention you have to give even one of these kids from public services makes it incredibly unlikely that it will ever be done - there's not enough money.

They will have lousy or uncaring homes.

How it gets solved is rough stuff, dispersal orders, children excluded from certain areas, and youth detention. Businesses who sell alcohol to them should be prosecuted, and curfews applied when it is really bad.

cakeorwine · 26/02/2023 17:51

woodhill · 26/02/2023 17:34

@User8646382

They also had 2 wars to contend with and I think this made them more resilient

I think there were more opportunities in some ways without necessarily having to go to university. Now you need a degree to do a similar job which a 16 year old used to do.

I think people read more because there was no tv or social media

What generation are you talking about?
Children of the 50s and 60s had TV.

They are in their 60s - 70s now.

Someone who is 80 was born in 1943 - 4 years into WW2 and they had the 50s and 60s to grow up in. Mods and Rockers and all that

cakeorwine · 26/02/2023 17:53

Florenz · 26/02/2023 15:32

Kick them out of school and put them on a fast track to prison. Normal people shouldn't have to put up with bullshit like this. It's not the fault of the government, covid, "society" it's the kids themselves and their useless ineffectual parents. Yes it's always happened to some extent but it's definitely worse now as there are no repercussions, no-one has ever said no to these kids, not at home, not at school. Years ago the police would have just gone in mob handed and started cracking skulls and that would have largely controlled it. Nowadays if that happened you'd have lefties bleating about "human rights" and the like and blaming the Tories.

What's your view on corporal punishment then?
Too good for them?

Do you think the police should go in, truncheons waving, dispersing people?

Just like this.

MushMonster · 26/02/2023 17:56

That is quite shocking.
I have witnessed only two cases, long ago. Just one teen being arrested in a crowd of teens and looking smug rather than sorry. And a large group of teens running around us when talking by a block of flats.
They did not bother anyone though. Just the sheer number of them was haunting.
I hope I never get to see such a horrid behaviour!

VladmirsPoutine · 26/02/2023 17:59

I think social media has played a hugely significant role in this. Not only the ability to mobilise quickly but chasing clout by doing all manner of things to cause nuisance to people. Young people do tend to be more criticised and actually have been dealt with quite a terrible hand in comparison to generations before them but I agree there's something a lot more sinister now than in the past regarding their behaviour.

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:00

@cakeorwine

I was talking about my dps and possibly dgps generation in response to User... post

Dgm bought a tv for Queens Coronation in 1952 but it was a relatively new concept

So quite a while back😀

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:02

Lol mods and rocker, think it passed my dps by, they were too square but dm liked Elvis

cakeorwine · 26/02/2023 18:05

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:02

Lol mods and rocker, think it passed my dps by, they were too square but dm liked Elvis

My Mum went to see Bill Hailey and Rock around the clock at the cinema. Apparently it was wild with all the teenagers.

And all the screaming and God knows what with Beatlemania

I bet there were people talking about "bloody teenagers" back then in the 50s and 60s.

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:07

Yes I'm sure they were

I think in some ways it is harder for the youth of today

Affordable Housing is a big issue and decent jobs

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:08

Don't forget Skiffle😅

justasking111 · 26/02/2023 18:12

Two of mine born early 80s didn't go feral. However they did one day throw some Rio bangers off the castle walls scaring folks. Local policeman marched them to the police station, rang me and said shall I show them the cells. I said yes, please do DH will be along in a bit. DH picked up the three culprits who wer very chastened.

The ones of their era who did end up in trouble one in prison at 18 their parents thought the sun shone out of their backsides, an excuse for every incident which morphed into crimes. One whose dad was a vicar was done for serious domestic violence, the other who went to public school, expelled for drug dealing. Continued at college wound up inside.

So yes I do judge the parents sometimes

justasking111 · 26/02/2023 18:13

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:07

Yes I'm sure they were

I think in some ways it is harder for the youth of today

Affordable Housing is a big issue and decent jobs

What do you mean by a decent job?

Itsnotyouitsmeiswear · 26/02/2023 18:17

Happening by me almost daily in the West Midlands. Large groups of teens wearing balaclavas and brandishing machetes. Stole the bike from a just eat rider the other day. Robbing all the local newsagents. They also use mopeds to go around mugging other teens. My sons friends have been mugged while waiting at bus stops. I work in a store and we have been warned about the trend on social media where gangs all meet up to go into larger stores to terrorise them. It’s scary and I don’t like my teen going out but why should I have to punish him because of the actions of other little scumbags! I absolute do wander who the parents of these kids are! Are they clueless to their behaviours or do they just not give a shit?

Florenz · 26/02/2023 18:20

There are plenty of decent jobs out there for those that are prepared to study and work hard and plenty of OK jobs out there for anyone who wants them.

HedwigIsMyDemon · 26/02/2023 18:24

@LaughingCat your stats are really interesting and I totally accept them. However I have worked in education since the turn of the century across many schools and age groups and I think it’s universally recognised that behaviour in schools is catastrophically bad in comparison to 2000, so I wonder what has happened?

Do schools struggle so much with behaviour (a lot due to having zero support from parents) that kids no longer need to misbehave in the community? I’d be interested to see stats from teachers around perceptions of behaviour. Teachers on here are saying how frightening some schools have become to work in. The stories my DC tell me make me want to home educate some days.

Something has gone very very wrong.

Florenz · 26/02/2023 18:28

Schools care too much about catering to the needs of children instead of vice versa. Then when they get out in the world, they're totally ill-equipped to deal with it, have no idea of societal norms and how to behave etc. School (and parents for that matter) have the responsibility of turning children into adults. At the moment they are just churning out violent sociopaths who

TimandGinger · 26/02/2023 18:31

LaughingCat · 26/02/2023 16:54

I live in Yorkshire and travel weekly for work, a lot in London. I’ve not noticed any ‘wild yoof’.

They tend to ignore me because I’m 39, and therefore ancient, practically Victor Meldrew (not that the uncouth urchins would know who he is). My decrepitude renders me invisible as they focus on their teenage dramas.

But…are they as bad as many posters on here are making out? Bear with me, as this will be quite the ride.

When I remember what it was like when I was a teenager in the heady Nineties: sneaking out to go drinking cider with the lads in the park, smoking, sleeping around (in the latter years), FHM ladette culture, the occasional spot of cow tipping…kids today, well, they’re just a bit lame, aren’t’ they?

Let’s compare 1998, when I was a wayward fifteen-year old, to now (or as early as we can).

🚬 Smoking is down - 13% of 11-15 year olds were regular smokers in 1998, compared to 1% now
🍻 Drinking is down - 20% of 11-15 year olds had at least one drink a week in 1998 compared to 6% now
💊 Drug use is down - 29% of 11-15 year olds had ever tried drugs in 2001 (earliest figures) compared to 18% now.

Source: NHS Digital Smoking, Drinking and Drug Use among Young People, England 2021 (latest figures).

Ok, so, they’re not using chemicals to look cool or numb their pain anymore. Cool. Cool.

How about sex? 👩‍❤️‍💋‍👩

🤰Teenage pregnancies down: from 47.1 conceptions per 1,000 women in under-18s in 1998, to 13.1 per 1,000 women now.
Source: ONS, Conceptions in England and Wales, 2020

🤒Chlamydia is down: from 145,000 detected in 15-24 year olds in 2012 (earliest figures) to 88,000 in 2021
Other STIs are also down: from 451,000 in 2012 to 312,000 in 2021.
Source: OHID Sexual and Reproductive Health Profiles

So…if they’re having sex (which, current figures suggest they’re still the most active age group sexually), they’re being smarter about it than we were too. Must be the lack of drink and drugs 🙃

Ok, ok, but a lot of people on this thread are complaining about their increasingly violent tendencies. So, antisocial behaviour must have gone up, right?

🥷 Antisocial behaviour…down: from 3.87 million incidents recorded by the police in 2007-08 (earliest figures) to 1.07 million in 2021-22.

There’s no age breakdown for ASB, unfortunately, but it’d be a stretch to say that there hasn’t been a fall for under 20’s when it’s dropped by over 72% overall in 14 years.

“But!” I hear you say, “that’s because the police don’t bother recording it anymore, not because there’s less.”

So…let’s move to the perceptions of antisocial behaviour that is measured in the long running Crime Survey for England and Wales, shall we?

👯 For the hugely relevant, ‘teenagers hanging around on the streets’ indicator - no surprises here but it has also dropped from 23% of respondents in 1996 saying it’s a problem to 13% in 2022.

Source for both: ONS Crime in England and Wales, 2022

So…evidence clearly shows that teenagers are drinking less, smoking less, taking less drugs, getting pregnant and catching sexually transmitted infections less, engaging in less antisocial behaviour and are seen as less of an issue by the general population than our generation ever was.

Let me say that again.

Teenagers today are nowhere near as bad as we were.

The proof is literally in the statistics.

But let’s have a look at some other statistics, shall we?

😔 Admissions to NHS children and young people’s mental health service UP: from to 290,000 referrals in 2016-17 to 1.09 million referrals in 2021-22
Source: NHS Digital Waiting time into children and young people’s mental health services 2016-17 and 2021-22

🧁🤮 Eating disorders UP: from 2,971 hospital admissions for under-18’s in 2015-16 to 7,767 admissions in 2021-22.
Source: NHS Digital Hospital Admissions for eating disorders by patient age

🔪 Self harm UP: from 1,305 hospital admissions for under-18s in 2007-08 to 4,214 admissions in 2021-22
Source: NHS Digital Hospital admissions relating to self harm

That’s…bleak. Right?

So, maybe next time the posters on here want to go on a rant about the terrible state of today’s youth, they might think about actually looking at the facts.

Kids today are overwhelmingly making better choices than we did but are paying a heavy price.

Mental health outcomes are hugely poorer today: they are self-harming and developing eating disorders in increasing numbers.

There’s additional pressures of social media to handle that we never had.

County lines drug operations are preying on young people who are increasingly vulnerable. Knife crime is increasing in turn.

They’re also learning to talk about their struggles more - where we self-evidently handled our shit with (fun) but destructive behaviours, they are asking for help (sensible gits - go on a bender and smash something, fer Chrissakes).

So, we need to be supporting them more. Not letting our increasing vulnerability and insecurities scapegoat them.

They Are Not The Problem.

That is evidently clear.

It’s quite normal to demonise younger people though - we never thought we were that bad at their age because we had those rose-tinted glasses - you don’t realise what a twat you are when you’re young and by the time you’re old enough to know better, you’ve forgotten.

But a look at the evidence shows that the vast majority aren’t doing so bad on the behaviour front. When you see bad behaviour, it’s the exception, not the norm.

However, in case you think that we’re the first generation to unfairly tar all young people as dissident wastrels with no manners or standards, I’ll leave you with this quote:

“The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in place of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers.”

Socrates said that. Nearly 2,500 years ago 🤣.

Essay, over!

Your local, friendly stats lover.

Such a patronising response. That quote is always used to make out that anyone who is concerned about crime is being silly, so no originality there.
No one is saying all teenagers are like that. Quite the opposite. People are pissed off because they're a minority making life unpleasant for other people, including other teenagers. Read my post about some of the stuff that's happened that I know about, including beating up another teenager who ended up losing teeth, and ruining sports facilities (apparently because they 'have nothing to do', which is absolute bullshit. There's plenty to do in a city like Edinburgh - sport for starters).
They have harassed my dad, who's in his 70s. So good luck with them avoiding you just because you're not a teenager. It may still happen.
I think people are wilfully blind to be honest because I've seen plenty of this despite living in an ok area of my city, and I saw plenty in London too.

LaughingCat · 26/02/2023 18:40

TimandGinger · 26/02/2023 18:31

Such a patronising response. That quote is always used to make out that anyone who is concerned about crime is being silly, so no originality there.
No one is saying all teenagers are like that. Quite the opposite. People are pissed off because they're a minority making life unpleasant for other people, including other teenagers. Read my post about some of the stuff that's happened that I know about, including beating up another teenager who ended up losing teeth, and ruining sports facilities (apparently because they 'have nothing to do', which is absolute bullshit. There's plenty to do in a city like Edinburgh - sport for starters).
They have harassed my dad, who's in his 70s. So good luck with them avoiding you just because you're not a teenager. It may still happen.
I think people are wilfully blind to be honest because I've seen plenty of this despite living in an ok area of my city, and I saw plenty in London too.

Not patronising - just…it’s always been this way. It’s awful if you are personally affected by bad teenage behaviour and no, there is no excuse for it. But to claim there have been large increases based on anecdotal evidence - the statistics don’t lie. There’s no increase.

However, there have always been and always will be scrotes. They’ll likely grow up into adult scrotes. But to say that there is some sort of hugely increasing problem…no. No there isn’t.

JaffavsCookie · 26/02/2023 18:45

I also live in Yorkshire and have seen plenty of wild yoof @LaughingCat
thanks for the patronising repeat about Socrates, none of us have ever heard it before.
i also teach in the state sector, allegedly in a decent comp, and behaviour is getting worse and worse. Our y7s are feral, and the parents always support the kids, despite not having been there to witnessed the often shockingly rude, disrespectful and sometimes downright dangerous behaviour of their kids. I have given up ringing home as 95% of the time the parents just back their kids, even 10 years ago if you rang home the vast majority of parents would be basically “ sorry, I will have a word”
the only reason I will leave teaching before retirement is student behaviour, and ours are definitely carrying it out beyond the school gate. They don’t even respect the PSCOs

woodhill · 26/02/2023 18:45

Florenz · 26/02/2023 18:20

There are plenty of decent jobs out there for those that are prepared to study and work hard and plenty of OK jobs out there for anyone who wants them.

I mean for those who aren't very academic or are struggling in education and can't achieve maths and English GCSEs

It was easier to get by then with no qualifications

aCupOfTeaSunday · 26/02/2023 18:49

Yes, absolutely, a kid threw a newspaper at me. He was in a group, they laughed and ran away while I shouted 'you fucking bastards'. Central London, a rather posh shopping mall.

TimandGinger · 26/02/2023 18:55

LaughingCat · 26/02/2023 18:40

Not patronising - just…it’s always been this way. It’s awful if you are personally affected by bad teenage behaviour and no, there is no excuse for it. But to claim there have been large increases based on anecdotal evidence - the statistics don’t lie. There’s no increase.

However, there have always been and always will be scrotes. They’ll likely grow up into adult scrotes. But to say that there is some sort of hugely increasing problem…no. No there isn’t.

Ok, I'll ignore the evidence of my own experience then. I was brought up here, and there weren't gangs of lads hassling people like this. Fire services weren't attacked when coming out to a fire. They are now.
Stats can and do lie because people don't report trouble most of the time. We had a gang drive through a pedestrian area on their mopeds where kids and dogs were walking.
We knew the police would have done fuck all so didn't even bother reporting it.

HedwigIsMyDemon · 26/02/2023 19:00

@Florenz but it’s not the schools! It’s the bloody parents. As a PP literally just said above, teachers no longer have any authority because they get so little backing from parents. Parents either don’t believe the teachers or come up with every excuse under the sun.

Those who don’t believe this happens don’t work in schools. 🤷‍♀️

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