If you have a demand avoidant autistic child at a mainstream secondary school...

[Blort]

How did they get on in their first year of secondary school?

My child is starting secondary school in September and I've no idea how they are going to manage. They dont have an ehcp, they are "too bright" to go into a specialised unit attached to a secondary.

I just have no idea how they will get on with different teachers, a large school, limited continuity etc. It's hard enough to get them to do work at the best of times (they often regulate themselves in class by reading a book eg Harry Potter)

Don't sugar coat it please, how did their first year go settling in?

Being too bright is not a reason not to be in a resourced provision attached to school. The reason is that you child doesn't have an EHCP. But to answer your main question...without an EHCP or diagnosis, the school will not make reasonable adaptions. Is your child's behaviour a symptom of unmet need? Have you considered pursuing an EHCP and diagnosis?

How are they going into secondary without an EHCP? Agree with pp, I would push for that asap

Not good. She started mainstream secondary with an EHCP in place. Just about coped in term 1, it all went wrong in term 2 and by term 3 their attendance dived. Persistently absence in year 8, and moved to a specialist school in June of year 8.

I know other children with ASD have coped ok in secondary, and some thrived compared to primary. So it's hard to predict, but I do think high anxiety playing into a demand avoidant profile makes it harder...

I was advised the provision was only for children who are educationally 2 years below their grade with ASD. My child is meeting expectations in a few subjects.

We are going to apply for a parent ehcp, child has Autism and ADHD.

Mine didn't manage. Lasted less than a term.

Ended up Educated Other than in School.

As others have said intellectual ability has nothing to do with ability to get an EHCP. Apply for one yourself.

www.ipsea.org.uk/asking-for-an-ehc-needs-assessment

i took dd out as I knew she wouldn’t cope and she does have a ehcp but they still wouldn’t give her a special school. She didn’t even get a dsp. She’s been at home since September I’ve realised a ehcp doesn’t mean much 🤷‍♀️

Don’t do it. Honestly, just don’t. It’s genuinely torture for them, don’t hurt your child that way.

I agree with pushing for an ehcp now.

ds is in a mainstream secondary but he has full 1-1 and systems in place for when things get too much. For most of the first first two terms he spent more time working in learning support than in the classroom but we have gradually built it up. He is yesr 8 now and generally access all lessons but will leave when he needs to regulate or his 1-1 may note he wouldn’t be able to cope in a particular lesson so they go and work elsewhere.

I work in a school with a resourced provision for ASC within a 10 form entry comp. All applicants have to have an EHCP and be able to access approx. 90% of mainstream curriculum. Typically all are above or significantly above average in terms of academic ability. The intervention they need is more around social, therapeutic.

Honestly? We ended up with school refusal and he missed about half of year 7. Then Covid struck. After Covid his sickness due to anxiety was very high in every term. We got loads of threatening letters about attendance which all went in the bin.

However, he is now in year 11 and is likely to achieve good enough GCSEs to be able to do A-levels. It's been a long, hard road and I don't know what we did right or what we did wrong. But we did get there.

Ugh... who advised that you do not need ECHP? I'm guessing the current school as they don't want the extra work for themselves.

You can apply yourself direct to your LA. You will get better help and advice on SEN area of Mumsnet x

Two years after we'd moved to France. French was pretty good, but not quite fluent. Ended up soending 10 days in hospital due to anxiety levels through the roof.
Never managed to get a diagnosis, PDA was unknown here, but collaboration with Liz O'nions when she was devising her questionnaire to distinguish between PDA and Asperger led her to say that DC was PDA.
They never worked much in lycée, took drugs, dropped out of uni but addicted to iPhones was recruited for bilingual after sales. Is now manipulating callers to the best of their abilities and is paid a fortune

Good luch

I dont have a child in this position and agree with getting an ehcp if possible.
But i did want to add that your child should still have reasonable adjustments for their disability without an ehcp in place.
Basically some schools are more aware of pda and more prepared to try to work around it than others, but unfortunately mainstream secondary is a very demanding environment though.
As others say, some children do actually get on with the more structured lessons and cleaer unform/behaviour expectations than primary.

Mine coped ok. He likes the changing of classrooms as it serves as movement breaks especially with a loaded down bag on back! You can get passes that let them access the toilets at quiet times and leave lessons slightly early to avoid busy corridors between lessons. My sons secondary school did an enhanced transition so he was able to visit school a few times before he started and meet his form tutor etc. I'm not saying it was all plain sailing as it was a big change but we found the school supportive. We have found a lot of his teachers routinely offered adjustments to cater for a range if learning styles. I would make an appointment with the Senco if you haven't already and see what they can do to support the transition

We are halfway through year 7 with an 87% attendance. Coping ok except when wore uniform on non uniform day (which marked him out as ASD) and with homework demands. Recently used AI for English homework because it was "that or nothing". School have been great, he has a good key worker and form tutor where they have put other kids with EHCPs also .

I have to say that secondary school is going MUCH better than primary. I had to deal with school refusal every single morning and his primary were rubbish at addressing issues. Secondary school he is genuinely doing much better - does not have to stay in one place longer than a period, plenty of stimulation (he is a sensory seeker), and regular breaks. The school made some adjustments around providing quiet space and letting him know who to contact if it gets too much. He likes the routine of secondary and the clear expectations. It’s genuinely so much easier. Long may this last.
Lots of downtime when he gets home, though, it is very difficult to get him to do much, if anything, after school until he has had a good rest.

I had a SSP in the last school I worked at, which I managed, along with other responsibilities. We offered enhanced transfer, so the students would visit more frequently than NT. We took photos with them of key places in the school and subject areas. We introduced them to TAs who met them again at the start of term and went around with them for as long as they needed. We offered our department as respite at lunchtime and a TA would bring them along during lessons if needed. Sometimes they would leave the classroom and rush down to us, but that was OK and we’d let the subject teacher know.

We had systems in place such as one boy left the classroom a couple of minutes early at lesson end and put on ear defenders because he hated the bell.

In general, we were ready for the unexpected. They mostly managed to the end of Year 11 and those that didn’t were generally not able to access the curriculum academically.

I wish this sort of provision existed in my area, it would be perfect for DD.

Mine struggled to attend their first mainstream comp. We were incredibly lucky to get them into this sort of specialist provision and it has been life changing. Both the resourced provisions near us have some very able children in them.

The MS school it's attached also seems vastly better at supporting autistic kids in its MS classes than the previous Outstanding, high achieving school was. I think the good practice at the unit is passed onto the broader staff. I would start by picking a school that has a good understanding of autism and anxiety. Having less homework also makes a massive difference and is worth seeking out.

Remember that most autistic children are in MS school, and MS schools are very far from equal in the amount of support they can provide and in the amount of pressure they put students under.

Mine was like the perfect child for year 7. Came top of her year for positive achievement points.
Managed one day in year 8 and hasn't been in since.
Is now so anxious and traumatised that paediatrician is advising ehcp for eotas as she cannot do any adult led learning or even hear the word school or work.

Absolute nightmare. Coped for the first 6 months, then we went into lockdown and since then she has been on a reduced timetable and barely attended school. She hasn't been in school at all since before Christmas and school are fixated on getting her into the building rather than her education and emotional well-being. She's in Y10 now and unlikely to sit any GCSEs, at least not in the foreseeable future. I wish we'd taken her out years ago.

Thanks so much everyone.

I'm so glad to read the positive stories, but so sad to see how traumatised some of the kids have been. So much of it seems like luck.

All the time she is on roll, the school have no choice but to focus on getting her in (we are under huge pressure to do this). My advice would to electively home educated. This will take her off roll and be easier for everyone.

Two GC have ECHPs. Oldest GD went to a special school where with 1-2-1 teaching and otherwise very small classes eg 3 for maths she achieved 6 GCSEs and is now at FE college and even coping with work experience. Both the children coped in primary school but fell apart when they moved to secondary. You have to fight for an EHCP but in both cases it was worth it.

My child (ASD, PDA traits) in very bright (gifted in some areas) exceeding in nearly all subjects and has an EHCP. I think you have been poorly advised.