Cultural circumcision in babies/young boys

[junipermarten]

1 of my DS's is circumcised due to a medical issue, he was 3 at the time and it was bloody horrific.

When he was going through it, a good friend gave me tips on after care and offered the number of a private doctor. She has sons who were circumcised shortly after birth for religious reasons.

I personally don't agree with circumcision unless medically required however I respect others choices for religious reasons.

It got me thinking about the high % of boys in the US who are circumcised for cultural reasons, just over 2/3rds. Why is it so prevalent there?

I was having a look at % of male pop per country and the highest were mainly Islamic, but also Samoa was almost 100% which surprised me but apparently its cultural as opposed to religious (I think).

I actually think you should let the post stand so everyone can see how offensive the whole thing is

Its multilation. Its not a competition with other types of mutilation.

Me too.. my mouth dropped open when I read it. I didnt know what to say to it, its so offensive.

I was trying to find out - for my own curiosity- what the link is between Judaism and circumcision (ie- justification - for which I can see none, I am confused against it for any reason except in medical need) and anyway found this gem of an article… I mean what the actual fuck?! I won’t go into details incase it’s upsetting for anyone but I didn’t even know the subsequent “wine” thing was a thing…!

www.npr.org/2012/12/03/166399479/new-york-orthodox-jews-clash-over-circumcision

Thank you @Hoppinggreen and @bellac11

Why are you trying to impose a distinction between religious and cultural circumcision. Both come from a set of rules prescribed by the social group. Neither has any more credence than the other. In all cases individuals face just as much pressure to conform and have just as much ability to refuse to comply.

Yes, that's what I read too, @Twizbe.

The risks are small.

I think that FGM not comparable to male circumcision since you asked.

@Kissedbyfire1
I'm guessing the original reasons were to do with sandy environment, and probably also a mark of group identity, similar to facial tattoos or other body markings.

@Xrays, I have heard Jewish people say it's a direct commandment from God to the Jewish people. I can't comment on that as I'm not Jewish.

@Weefreetiffany

Millions of men are circumcised and don't have the issues you have mentioned.

Using any physical characteristic as an excuse or explanation or implying it is a cause of porn use is a slippery slope.

Its the toxicity of sacrifice, a bit like fasting etc, although permanent obviously. The psychopath that is the old testament/torah/quran god expects it.

I don’t agree with circumcision. I don’t get how people can look at their brand new baby boy, and then inflict pain in them by chopping off part of their penis.

I remember going to turkey when I was a kid and see two different celebrations of boys having their circumcision. One was on a horse and had his hands up showing off the blood.

Poor kid. The other went by in a speeding car shouting out words.

This! Its the male equivalent of FGM, how is it even legal to do this for no medical reason.

What the fuck?! How is the wine thing legal?

Thank you for replying. That’s what I’ve been reading but how / why? I can’t see any real logic to it. I’m coming at it from an angle that in order to challenge these things we need to be able to show they have no solid grounding and the reasoning makes little sense.

So much of what I'm proud of about Jewish identity is connected to this incredible tradition of questioning, challenging, re-evaluating, debating – I celebrate circumcision becoming a part of that evolution and conversation.

This is where I am too, as a Jew and mother of a son. It is the Abrahamic covenant for Jews, the symbol of God's promise to us and our promise to God, to whoever asked about why Jews circumsize. But I simply could not countenance doing that to my perfect newborn. And while we are not a very religious family, I also don't see it being a bar to a more religious life for my son, should he want one when he is an adult - or he can book himself in to have it done, if he disagrees with me! I did contemplate the scenario of, for example, sending him to a Jewish school when older and having him feel different somehow if others knew, but again that didn't seem a likely or compelling reason.

I don't like the Hitler point. I am proud of my heritage and will happily cop flack for talking about it if need be, but I don't think circumcision is the abiding symbol of Jewish faith, either practically or theologically.

More about why Jews circumsize, whoever asked: jewishmuseum.org.uk/schools/asset/the-covenant/#:~:text=The%20covenant%20is%20a%20promise,a%20symbol%20of%20the%20covenant.

Circumcision should be banned unless absolutely necessary for medical reasons. It is awful and barbaric and no parent should be allowed to make that decision for their child. No amount of cultural or religious justification could ever be good enough to cut bits off of an otherwise healthy baby.

This is absolutely a hill I'm willing to die on!

I asked, thank you for answering. I genuinely don’t understand why removing that particular part of the body is so important. Why the foreskin? Why not the ear lobe or the tip of the little finger? (I know I sound like I’m being ridiculous but I’m genuinely curious). I wonder why, in so many cultures and religions, the foreskin is such an abhorrent thing that needs to be removed.

Not really a comparable operation!

I'm a mother of two, a doctor, and the older sister of a brother circumcised for mecial reasons at 11 years old (NHS). Maybe humans just shouldn't perform surgery on minors without medical need regardless of beliefs/culture? It's not like they can consent legally?

My 8 month old is circumcised, it’s his dad’s culture and not necessarily mine. At first I was a bit hesitant and wondered what the need was to actually do it, but the more I researched, the more I agreed and thought it was the right thing to do.

People say, ‘if there’s an issue then we’ll deal with it at the time’ but the amount of pain and discomfort it causes for young boys/adults can really be traumatic. When they’re young, the procedure is so simple and just causes a bit of soreness for a week or two.

Circumcision isn’t the done thing in this country but then again, neither is showering every day. Every culture does things differently and if you don’t agree, no one’s forcing you to do it to your own child!

My younger cousin had to get circumcised when he was around 7/8 for medical reasons. His dad wanted it down due to his culture but my auntie didn’t agree. My cousin always says he wishes his mum did it when he was a baby so he didn’t remember the pain. His mum agrees too

It’s just cleanliness. In order to clean the penis properly, the foreskin needs to be pulled back and cleaned thoroughly. I’m sure there’d be many young boys/teenagers and maybe even adults who wouldn’t pull it back to clean it. So in certain religions, the foreskin is removed so there’s no issue with cleanliness

That's a stupid reason. There's plenty of little boys who seem to be incapable of cleaning behind their ears or brushing their teeth properly too. We don't suggest amputations or dentures as a solution.