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Yet another person killed from a dog attack.. what is going on

877 replies

icelolly12 · 13/01/2023 08:32

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-surrey-64254413

Something needs to be done...reports of dog neglect taken more seriously, harsher prison sentences... any other ideas?

Awful, awful way to die, and makes me think twice about passing dogs off lead on walks.

OP posts:
vitahelp · 14/01/2023 21:33

Pupinski · 14/01/2023 20:56

Glad to hear your cats are house cats. I'm not a cat person but if I was to have a cat it would definitely be a house cat, not just because of the issue I mentioned previously, but because the likelihood of a wandering cat meeting an untimely end is not small...

@Pupinski Yes so true, we live rurally which is even more dangerous for letting cats wander, a neighbours cat got shot by a farmer - he somehow survived it but still! There is a degree of guilt with keeping them indoors though, it is unnatural really for any animal and the reason I don’t think we will have any more pets in future.

MightyMom · 14/01/2023 21:39

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

MightyMom · 14/01/2023 21:39

I meant WEF, typo.

MightyMom · 14/01/2023 21:41

They will end up banning everything. They want you to demand it. Mind control.

TenTeo · 14/01/2023 21:42

It is not just about the deaths, I’ve been listening to a couple of radio phone in shows today and heard horrific stories. Dogs attacking, biting, maiming etc. People ending up in hospital needing surgery and being physically and mentally scarred for life.

MightyMom · 14/01/2023 21:42

And may I add, I had 7 cats growing up and they all went outside and lived long and happy lives.

MightyMom · 14/01/2023 21:43

I honestly fear the pedophiles in charge of armies and the media more then I fear any creature.

H2bow · 14/01/2023 21:46

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Maybe time to log off the Internet and get outside for a bit, what on earth did I just read.

Pupinski · 14/01/2023 22:14

This reply has been deleted

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Weirdo 🙄

BitOutOfPractice · 14/01/2023 22:30

Pointerdogsrule · 14/01/2023 18:46

They're assholes, not all 'dog owners'.

My dogs are trained not to jump up and have brilliant recall, I spent months and months training them, they went to 'dog school' with expert trainers and then and only then would I let them off lead , and that's only in fields and parks where its clearly permitted.

That’s the thing. Not all dog owners are shite, but enough of them are to ruin it for all of you. That’s why you all get tarred with the same brush 🤷‍♀️

masterblaster · 14/01/2023 22:30

You can’t make leashes compulsory. Some of us have reasonably well behaved greyhounds, that need a proper run….

masterblaster · 14/01/2023 22:38

I have a greyhound, which we rehomed after he retired. He needs to run, and can’t be on lead. The idiots breeding these monstrous dogs won’t bother with muzzles and leads anyway - and the dogs are likely banned breeds in any case. Just enforce that law.

yorkshirepudsx · 14/01/2023 22:43

Stricter laws regarding how dogs are handled in public is a must, i.e - leads on, etc.
Some councils already have other things in place but don't have the funds/time to enforce them etc.

Back to the statistics though, I don't think it's fair to brand all dogs as being 'bad' based off the small percentage that cause harm. YES, all dogs, big or small, are capable of causing harm - but all humans are also capable of causing harm. It's solely on an individual basis.
I also think that certain breeds are 'hyped up' a lot and become really popular suddenly, almost like a trend, so for example, people all seem to want XL bully's at the moment - therefor statistically, that breed will be named mostly for attacks, etc.

Personally - I love dogs, of all sizes, I absolutely adore them. When they're in the correct environment for their breed & temperament, they flourish and are such beautiful souls.
I myself have been severely attacked by a dog - twice.

Once was when I was 7 years old walking to school with my mum, a neighbours Rottweiler got loose and attacked me, my mum & a neighbour that tried to help. The reason that dog stopped attacking us, was because of our dog - my mum used to walk me to school with our family dog, and during this attack, our dog kept putting herself between me and the other dog, and she eventually bit the other dog and scared it away. The owner of said dog had been reported multiple times due to her treatment towards animals (locking multiple dogs inside a cage under the stairs).

The second time, we were on holiday and I was randomly attacked by a small mixed breed dog. I had puncture wounds to my head, face, neck and chest. I was simply sat down and the dog came out of nowhere and went crazy. I had to have rabies shots, but the wounds luckily healed well.

Both events scared me, however, both dogs were also poorly treated by their owners. One dog was a large breed, the other was tiny.
Growing up - we always had pets. Cats, fish, snakes, lizards, birds, rodents and dogs. We only ever had 1 dog at any time, usually a large breed dog.
All dogs I grew up with were trained to high standards by my parents, they always chose breeds that fit our household, and the dogs would have set boundaries - as my safety and my siblings safety always came first. But - my parents also taught myself and my siblings how to behave around dogs and how not to behave.

The experiences I had with the aggressive dogs, scared me massively, I saw the horrible side of a dog that ALL dogs have the capability of showing. However, I've come across so many dogs in my life, strangers dogs, friends dogs, family members dogs, stray dogs and so on. Of all breeds, sizes, temperaments etc. And out of all of them - only those 2 ever scared me.

I am now a mother myself, and I have a large dog. I've put a lot of time and other resources into training her, ensuring she's socialised in every possible way (as socialising doesn't just mean people/other pets etc) and I work hard to ensure that the needs of my dog are met.

When out on walks, I always come across dogs, some amazing and beautiful, some are massive dickheads like their owners. I remain wary of dogs that I am unfamiliar with, however I don't ever presume all dogs are bad, because they're not. When treated properly, trained properly, etc, I think they're great.

It's like with people, I was once on my way home from work after a long 12 hour shift - I was followed and then attacked by a random man. Yes it terrified me and took me a long long time to get over, however, I don't look at every man I see and presume they are going to do the same. All people are capable of it, men and women. I remain wary and keep my wits about me.

echt · 14/01/2023 22:43

masterblaster · 14/01/2023 22:30

You can’t make leashes compulsory. Some of us have reasonably well behaved greyhounds, that need a proper run….

You can if you then have designated off-leash areas(OLAs). It's managed pretty well in Australia, though it must be said some councils don't come up to the mark in providing OLAs.

yorkshirepudsx · 14/01/2023 23:06

As I said earlier, I don't think 'trends' of certain breeds help. Certain types of people go for certain types of dogs.
All you need to do is go on YouTube and watch some up to date 'grime' music videos and you always see younger lads, wearing balaclavas, stood behind their huge XL Bully's that have massive chains around their necks, all to meet an 'image' and look tough. It's purely for aesthetics and it's very sad.
But it's not much different to the women who walk around in a dress and heels, that have their precious little chihuahua in their handbag pressed to the side of their bodies.
Makes me think of the start of 101 Dalmatians where the dogs and owners look exactly like each other. Certain dogs will always attract a certain type of person.

Me? I went for a breed that suited my lifestyle. A breed that I could provide the perfect home for.
She's a huge, lazy, sleepy, snoring, goofy chunk of love. The breed is known for their loyal and calm temperament, they're known for being good family dogs and require low amounts of walking etc.
I researched breeds before deciding on one, I spent years looking, speaking to licensed breeders to know exactly where my dog was coming from.

Too many people buy a dog based on their aesthetics and that alone, they don't take into consideration the temperament, the lifestyle the dog requires etc.

It's like when people buy a husky and expect it to be ok living in a small house, and being left for 12+ hours a day whilst they work - then they are shocked when they come home to a half eaten sofa and rearranged house. That breed require a lot of mental stimulation and 'canine enrichment' - if they become bored, they will entertain themselves.
Or the people that buy a dog originally bred to be a guard dog, then complain that it barks whenever the postman comes.
And so on.

There's a reason it can be difficult to adopt a rescue dog - and they ask so many questions about your lifestyle, etc. Because not every household will be suitable for every dog. They aren't going to allow a person/couple/family, that are out of the house for 12+ hours a day, to adopt a dog that requires a lot of physical exercise, it would be inhumane, and the last thing they would want for the dogs they've rescued is to see them come back months later because the new owners cannot cope.
There are also really really good breeders out there, that want to know every in/out of a persons lifestyle before selling them a puppy, simply because they know and love the breed and want the best for their puppies.

I know of family's that suddenly decide they want a family dog, they do absolutely no research and just go to buy the cheapest or cutest dog they can find and months down the line, the dog is a lot bigger than it was, it isn't behaving how they expect it to behave and the family and the dog are all miserable.

Every person, before buying or rescuing any animal, should think deeply into their decision and think well ahead. They need to weigh up every aspect - will the dog fit into their lifestyle, are they the right fit for the dog, can they be responsible for an animal for the next 8+ years? (Life expectancy and common breed illnesses is another thing people need to be more aware of).

But the same goes for cats, other animals and even baby's. Don't buy/adopt a cat if you can't handle them bringing you dead mice. Don't have a baby if you expect it to sleep through the night at one month old.

There needs to be more regulation and guidance for breeders and owners. And I think children from a young age (and their parents!!) should also be educated on how to behave around animals, and how to act if they were ever put into a position of being around any animal. I've seen far too many photos/videos online recently of parents allowing their child(ren) to treat animals in such horrific ways and the parents just laugh about it. For example - videos of kids sitting on top of dogs just led there minding their own business. Might seem cute and funny whilst it's being videoed but no dog is 100% predictable.

Dogs can be amazing animals & companions when put into the right situation for them, it's just an awful shame that they do end up in the wrong hands - or hands that simply cannot handle them.

XenoBitch · 14/01/2023 23:06

echt · 14/01/2023 22:43

You can if you then have designated off-leash areas(OLAs). It's managed pretty well in Australia, though it must be said some councils don't come up to the mark in providing OLAs.

What is the population in Australia compared to the UK? Density too?

Irresponsiblebreedersmakemybloodboil · 14/01/2023 23:16

it is reported today that the Leonberger is the same one that appeared a few years ago on a BBC2 show about puppies. At the time, the woman who had bought the puppy had zero experience of giant breeds but ‘fancied a really big dog’. She also lived in a first floor flat with no garden. She arrived to collect her puppy with no equipment for it, wearing stupidly high heels and planned on taking the poor thing back to her home on the train (a journey which appeared to take a couple of hours). With no bowls or water. The breeder still allowed her to take the dog. When the show followed the ‘progress’ of the puppy it was out of control by 5 months and was without any stimulation which was not a Surprise given the lack of space. I have the same breed. There would’ve been zero chance of our breeder allowing one of her dogs to go to such a home and certainly not without giant breed experience. Leonbergers are not aggressive dogs but they are unruly and unpredictable if not trained well. You also don’t get a Leonberger to sub contract looking after them. They are usually a one dog household and need space to roam.

According to the report, the owner (a ‘psychic’) now claims her dog is missing. Obviously no one knows what happened yet but given the fact she had already appeared (willingly)on a tv show and demonstrated a lack of awareness of such a dog’s need one can only surmise. I really hope this does not put the breed in the spotlight for the wrong reasons.

report here www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11636065/Pictured-11st-Leonburger-named-Shiva-centre-horror-saw-walker-28-mauled-death.html

prettypastel · 14/01/2023 23:44

This is such a dreadful tragic accident. I live fairly close to where this happened. It sounds like the poor lady was walking a lot of dogs and for whatever reason something happened they all got tangled on their leads and one or more attacked her. Sad to hear from the press too that she warned the horse rider to get away to avoid them getting hurt too. What a tragic end of life :( I don’t understand how one person was legally allowed to try and be in control of so many dogs. I have two and would not want to try and control more than that. My dogs are genuinely friendly and controllable but I wouldn’t want to take responsibility for more than two at one time for my safety as well as theirs. It was sad to notice today on a dog walk that two groups of people stepped away as I was walking my very well behaved spaniels on leads and I wonder if it was a result of what happened in Caterham.

Danja2010 · 15/01/2023 00:23

It sounds harsh but it was the dog walkers fault. She had way too many dogs that she could not control. The dogs were probably frightened when she fell and had them all on lead . Sadly, she died and the dogs that were not at fault will probably put down, it’s not fun to come across a large pack of dogs being walked and you have just yours. Tensions are high. Dog walkers need to be restricted as to the number of dogs they can walk.

MichB86 · 15/01/2023 00:39

ChiefPearlClutcher · 13/01/2023 09:08

Don’t be ridiculous.

Almost every report I have ever read about a person being killed by a dog, it was in their own home by a dog known to them or the family.

We need
a total crackdown on backyard breeding and the selling of dogs.
dog licences - tracking ownership and rehoming ( as is intended for chipping)
mandatory training
mandatory pet insurance (like car insurance) with third party liability.

When I was young my parents had our dog licence and rabies vaccine displayed in the window (abroad) as the dog warden was around so often it was just easier!

Why not? Ok maybe not muzzled unless they have previous for aggression but absolutely be on a short lead when in public areas.
Ive grown up with dogs my entire life parents use to breed border collies and we’ve always had at least 2 ourselves. We have always exercised them in the woods away from people and if we did come across anyone would swiftly put them on a lead.

I now have 3 children and no dogs and I’m absolutely sick of the amount of dogs charging up to my kids jumping up them and bowling them over with there owner powerless apparently to stop it and my kids being labelled as sensitive or a bit weird because they don’t want to be charged at on the walk to school. Also the amount of people taking their dogs onto play parks when it quite clearly states they aren’t supposed to be on there.

People constantly go he won’t hurt you love to my 5 year old, it’s the size of a horse to him and charging right at him I’m pretty sure it could.

Emily3325 · 15/01/2023 01:24

JanusTheFirst · 13/01/2023 08:57

Time for all dogs to be muzzled in public and on leads in public areas.

Dreadful tragedy for the family and a horrible way to die.

Why should my dog be muzzled? She’s on a lead at all times and has never posed a threat to anyone. Let’s not punish everyone due to irresponsible owners

TTTtired123 · 15/01/2023 02:18

I have been a long time reader of mumsnet. And joined just now to get off my chest in private how infuriated I am about out of control dogs. Since lockdown. It’s got out of control. I’m genuinely really sad that what used to be such an enjoyable, relaxing past time walking my dog, has now turned into anxiety inducing and stressful due to the amount of aggressive, unsocialised dogs, with clueless owners who clearly now don’t have time for them that they need dog walkers who are another burden when out walking.
They should have got themselves a goldfish!

MeghanAndTheSeals · 15/01/2023 02:34

Irresponsiblebreedersmakemybloodboil · 14/01/2023 23:16

it is reported today that the Leonberger is the same one that appeared a few years ago on a BBC2 show about puppies. At the time, the woman who had bought the puppy had zero experience of giant breeds but ‘fancied a really big dog’. She also lived in a first floor flat with no garden. She arrived to collect her puppy with no equipment for it, wearing stupidly high heels and planned on taking the poor thing back to her home on the train (a journey which appeared to take a couple of hours). With no bowls or water. The breeder still allowed her to take the dog. When the show followed the ‘progress’ of the puppy it was out of control by 5 months and was without any stimulation which was not a Surprise given the lack of space. I have the same breed. There would’ve been zero chance of our breeder allowing one of her dogs to go to such a home and certainly not without giant breed experience. Leonbergers are not aggressive dogs but they are unruly and unpredictable if not trained well. You also don’t get a Leonberger to sub contract looking after them. They are usually a one dog household and need space to roam.

According to the report, the owner (a ‘psychic’) now claims her dog is missing. Obviously no one knows what happened yet but given the fact she had already appeared (willingly)on a tv show and demonstrated a lack of awareness of such a dog’s need one can only surmise. I really hope this does not put the breed in the spotlight for the wrong reasons.

report here www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11636065/Pictured-11st-Leonburger-named-Shiva-centre-horror-saw-walker-28-mauled-death.html

I saw that programme when it aired and it really pissed me off. She was totally unprepared in so many ways and the breeders where arseholes letting her totter away like that.

However, it is not yet determined that the Leo was the cause of death. The media reports are really not doing anything to help the situation. And I disagree that Leo’s are unpredictable. They may be “unruly” if not trained properly, but I wouldn’t class them as unpredictable.

It is probably obvious from my posting, but I was a Leo owner. I sadly lost my girl just before Christmas 2021. It is, obviously, important that correct details are known with regards to what happened to this poor lady. But I really hope that the breed doesn’t become demonised in the meantime. Yes, they are huge dogs, but this does not mean that everyone should fear them.

For health reasons, I am not likely to be in a position to own a dog again. But, if I could, I would 100% be having another Leo.

LoisLane66 · 15/01/2023 04:52

This reply has been deleted

Not in the spirit

Mothership4two · 15/01/2023 06:40

Well that's compassionate! It's still not 100% clear exactly what happened but that idiot appears to have shouted at others to stay back whilst being attacked. No-one deserves to go through that

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