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Teachers balloting for strike action - school closures

515 replies

noblegiraffe · 15/10/2022 17:08

A pre-ballot poll from the NEU suggests that the ballot will be in favour.

The NASUWT have announced that their ballot will open around 27th October in England, Scotland and Wales, and will close on 9th January, I assume that the NEU will be doing similar and it would be joint action.

Strike action would mean school closures around Jan/Feb time and obviously this will impact parents who need to start thinking about arrangements for this eventuality. Please consider emailing your MP asking them to forward any concerns about this to Kit Malthouse, Secretary of State for Education, as any pressure on him from parents to avert strike action by entering pay negotiations would be highly welcome.

The current pay offer of 5% for most teachers is unfunded, meaning that it has to come out of current school budgets. This means that the pay rise will result in cuts to education provision for your children. However, this offer is after over a decade of real terms pay cuts for teachers and with inflation at 10%, teachers cannot afford more pay cuts and to continue to shoulder the burden of government financial incompetence and deliberate running into the ground of public services any longer.

The unions are asking for an above inflation fully funded pay rise for teachers. A teacher pay rise, any teacher pay rise, cannot come out of current school budgets as this will mean a lower quality of education for your children. This could involve even bigger class sizes, even fewer courses on offer, even less provision for SEN children, fewer school trips and extra curricular activities.

School funding has been devastated by the Tory government over the last 12 years. SEN funding has been cut: the impact falls on schools and teachers to deal with. CAMHS funding has been cut: the impact falls on schools and teachers to deal with. Schools are being asked to solve more and more of society's issues, with fewer and fewer resources. It's unsustainable.

People will tell you that teachers are well paid and don't deserve a pay rise. However, we have a critical shortage of teachers, and the obvious conclusion is that if we can't get teachers for the pay that is on offer, then the pay is not enough. Market forces, right?

The government know the impact of increasing pay to attract and keep teachers; they have, this week, announced a big increase to the teacher training bursaries in response to the truly dire and alarming numbers of applicants to teacher training this year. They have also introduced early career payments in shortage areas. They have yet to extend this logic to increasing teacher pay to retain more experienced teachers - the ones who are crucial in training and supporting the new and early career teachers.

I'm not suggesting in the slightest that teachers are more deserving than other workers, or that we have it harder than other workers. If you have also not had a pay rise in years, that's unacceptable. If you are balloting for strike action, or undertaking strike action to try to improve your working conditions, then all power and support to you. I really hope that school support staff join us in taking action.

This government is ruining the country. I think everyone can see that now. Instead of proposing increases to public funding, they are proposing further cuts. But we've already cut everything.

They'll claim there is no money, but then propose tax cuts for the best off. They'll reject windfall taxes even when Shell is asking for them. They'll claim that higher wages will increase inflation so they can't possibly increase wages, while talking about how important it is to move to a higher wage economy. Not higher wages for the ordinary worker though, they mean the ones already on high wages. The ones who would have benefited from the 45p tax rate cut that they've already had to u-turn on.

The DfE have said that strike will damage the education of children, that they can't afford to miss out on more school. Teachers, if they vote to strike, will be voting for better education. We want a qualified, decent teacher in front of every class. This is absolutely not happening at the moment, and will not have a chance of happening unless teacher pay and conditions improve.

TLDR: Support teachers; the government are self-interested, public service destroying, incompetent shitheads.

OP posts:
EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:00

Of course, you did get a massive rise in your teacher’s pension in 2019, when the employer’s contribution went up from 16.4% to 23.6%. (Yes, that really does say 23.6%, and isn’t a typing error.)

I notice teachers never mention that when talking about how hard done by they are.

KarenPirie72 · 16/10/2022 13:00

RainStalksMyWashing · 16/10/2022 12:59

@treeline6 my mind is changed. Love your ideas!!! I think we could also ask them to do the caretaker role. If teachers could do a rota between them to help with school runs and pick ups, that could allow parents more time to work leading to more tax to fund schools.

Yes! Each teacher could be made to buy a 35-seater coach and go round every morning collecting every child from their class and returning them home again at the end of the day. Sorted.

MrsHamlet · 16/10/2022 13:01

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:00

Of course, you did get a massive rise in your teacher’s pension in 2019, when the employer’s contribution went up from 16.4% to 23.6%. (Yes, that really does say 23.6%, and isn’t a typing error.)

I notice teachers never mention that when talking about how hard done by they are.

Where has anyone on this thread talked about being hard done by?

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:02

Your pay rise is in your pension. You can’t have everything.

MrsHamlet · 16/10/2022 13:04

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:02

Your pay rise is in your pension. You can’t have everything.

Again, you're completely - and deliberately - missing the point.

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:09

I’m really not.

Get real - who, except teachers, has a pension scheme where the taxpayer contributes 23.6%? It’s unheard of.

Stop being so greedy and get on with doing the job you signed up for.

Pumperthepumper · 16/10/2022 13:13

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:09

I’m really not.

Get real - who, except teachers, has a pension scheme where the taxpayer contributes 23.6%? It’s unheard of.

Stop being so greedy and get on with doing the job you signed up for.

I’ll get on with the job I signed up for! Teaching a class of 24 well supported little learners. Not a 33-strong mixed ability, complex care and welfare/additional needs group who are being consistently and repeatedly failed by their education system.

MrsHamlet · 16/10/2022 13:14

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:09

I’m really not.

Get real - who, except teachers, has a pension scheme where the taxpayer contributes 23.6%? It’s unheard of.

Stop being so greedy and get on with doing the job you signed up for.

Greedy because I think the pay rise should be funded so that it doesn't have to come out of the budget that provides paper, exam entry fees, hot water, learning support etc etc etc?

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:15

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:00

Of course, you did get a massive rise in your teacher’s pension in 2019, when the employer’s contribution went up from 16.4% to 23.6%. (Yes, that really does say 23.6%, and isn’t a typing error.)

I notice teachers never mention that when talking about how hard done by they are.

I know a lot of ECTs who are opting out of the pension, because they can't afford their rent on their take home pay, either. Our own contribution is pretty hefty too. And of course, if you opt out, you don't get the employers contribution either.

The pension is good, but the pensions have already been messed with once, so I think a lot of teachers (including myself) don't have faith that we will actually see our pensions. Although I still pay in- so more fool me, I guess.

Ultimately, though, the pension isn't enough to attract people to the profession, or keep them in long term. It's not about "being hard done by".

If schools had more ability to set their own pay scales, I think many schools would be putting pay up in order to attract staff- that's what private companies do when they can't hire, right? (Among other things, obviously). But the vast majority of state schools can't really do that- so we're stuck.

Would it genuinely be better if we all went off and found other jobs?

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:15

You’ve had a pay rise. It was in your pension.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:19

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:15

You’ve had a pay rise. It was in your pension.

You're missing the point. The increase in pension contributions has happened. Teachers are still leaving the profession. Recruitment onto training courses was the lowest it's been for years, this September.

If you want schools staffed by well qualified teachers, and children taught by subject specialists, something else has to change too. It really is that simple.

The pension is generous, but it's pretty irrelevant to the 1/3 of teachers who leave in the first 5 years...

It's also not enough to attract maths/science/language grads to the profession- these are areas we surely need to build skills to benefit the economy long term?

If you believe in free market economics, then surely you understand that if not enough people want to do a job with the current pay and conditions, something further has to change?

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:20

The teacher’s contribution is between 7 and 9%, which is entirely reasonable (and normal).

The taxpayer’s contribution of 23.6% is mind blowing.

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:21

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:19

You're missing the point. The increase in pension contributions has happened. Teachers are still leaving the profession. Recruitment onto training courses was the lowest it's been for years, this September.

If you want schools staffed by well qualified teachers, and children taught by subject specialists, something else has to change too. It really is that simple.

The pension is generous, but it's pretty irrelevant to the 1/3 of teachers who leave in the first 5 years...

It's also not enough to attract maths/science/language grads to the profession- these are areas we surely need to build skills to benefit the economy long term?

If you believe in free market economics, then surely you understand that if not enough people want to do a job with the current pay and conditions, something further has to change?

In others words, blackmail. Pay us what we demand or else.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:23

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:20

The teacher’s contribution is between 7 and 9%, which is entirely reasonable (and normal).

The taxpayer’s contribution of 23.6% is mind blowing.

Honestly, I genuinely think a lot of mainscale teachers in their 20s/30s would happily take a cut in that employer contribution for a better salary now.

But anyway, you still haven't offered a solution to the massive teacher shortage in England.

Should teachers be forced to stay in the profession, because they'll eventually (maybe) get a decent pension?

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:23

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:21

In others words, blackmail. Pay us what we demand or else.

So again, what's your solution?

Force people to teach against their will?

MrsHamlet · 16/10/2022 13:24

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:20

The teacher’s contribution is between 7 and 9%, which is entirely reasonable (and normal).

The taxpayer’s contribution of 23.6% is mind blowing.

I'm pretty sure it's less than we contribute to MPs ' pensions.

yellowstickerbargain · 16/10/2022 13:26

I 100% support teacher strikes due to the fact that their pay rise (whether that be 5% or something different) isn't government funded, it's coming out of school budgets. That is disgusting. The government should be ashamed. But we know this government have no shame and haven't had for many years now.

RainStalksMyWashing · 16/10/2022 13:26

Blackmail - if you want this payrise, you can only have it by making redundancies (thereby further stretching teachers) and/or cutting services (impacting on kids and schools).

LondonQueen · 16/10/2022 13:27

I'm a teacher, I don't want to strike but if the government won't fund the increase then education for the children will suffer. There are similar support staff ballots looming too.

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:28

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:23

So again, what's your solution?

Force people to teach against their will?

There isn’t a solution. We live in a country where people don’t want to work for the most part.

I know how challenging teaching is - I don’t deny that. But it’s disingenuous to suggest you haven’t had a fair pay rise, when the pension rise is astronomical.

MrsCHeeler · 16/10/2022 13:28

I can’t support this strike, although I agree it is wrong to expect schools to fund it themselves.

Its not going to work. It stands no chance whatsoever.

MrsHamlet · 16/10/2022 13:28

MrsCHeeler · 16/10/2022 13:28

I can’t support this strike, although I agree it is wrong to expect schools to fund it themselves.

Its not going to work. It stands no chance whatsoever.

Why can't you?

Pumperthepumper · 16/10/2022 13:29

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:28

There isn’t a solution. We live in a country where people don’t want to work for the most part.

I know how challenging teaching is - I don’t deny that. But it’s disingenuous to suggest you haven’t had a fair pay rise, when the pension rise is astronomical.

Ah well, guess we’ll just not educate the kids then! Bad luck for them, but better than attempting to retain teachers.

MrsCHeeler · 16/10/2022 13:35

Why can’t I support it? Because it won’t work.

I realise the replies here are in the main supportive but the first poster was right. That won’t be reflected by the public. Teachers will be seen as greedy, demanding, discontent with their lot and so on.

A lot of parents haven’t forgiven schools for the lockdowns. I know it was hard, but some schools did miss the mark with posting photos of their child’s teacher relaxing in the garden and baking and so on. I think there is still that shadow lurking.

Even so, teaching strikes don’t tend to be effective.

Postapocalypticcowgirl · 16/10/2022 13:38

EYProvider · 16/10/2022 13:28

There isn’t a solution. We live in a country where people don’t want to work for the most part.

I know how challenging teaching is - I don’t deny that. But it’s disingenuous to suggest you haven’t had a fair pay rise, when the pension rise is astronomical.

It's not about fair, or unfair. It's about whether it's enough to keep good quality state education in this country, and demonstrably, it's not. If you want to live in a capitalist society, this is how it works. When a skill becomes a shortage, the people with that skill get to demand more money.

There are schools that struggle to recruit due to the cost of living in that area. A pension increase doesn't help them. There will be schools who can't fund the 5% increase, and will lose staff to schools that can. A pension increase doesn't help them either.

You can think it's unfair all you like, but the way the country is run as a whole is unfair. The only bargaining power we have is our labour- I'd personally rather withdraw that in the short term and try to improve things in schools, than end up withdrawing it in the long term because the job has become unsustainable.