I hate myself for caring so much about how my DD does academically at school.

[Dickens222]

I've name changed for this because I feel like such an asshole.

My DD has just started secondary school. They've announced a baseline maths test in a couple of weeks to start streaming and I can't believe how much I care about her doing really well and going into the top set (even though they can move up and down through the year so it's not fixed).

The school take into consideration her current performance in class, data from old school and I guess SATS. She got 112 in SATS. I've got no idea how this compares to others, I never discussed it with anyone. Her final maths report was glowing, and she always did pretty well.

But she's also sloppy. Makes errors. She came back today and told me she'd got stupid stuff wrong in maths today. Reader, I CANT BELIEVE HOW STRESSFUL I FOUND IT TO HEAR THAT.

I felt awful, really awful feeling it so much. I know it's my own stuff, my academic schooling and my fear of her being judged - me being judged. But it keeps rising up and she knows it. She can see it.

I need to get a reality check, please! But I am here opening up so people can kindly get me back in line, but without judging me for being honest.

I completely feel like this and realise it's a result of my own upbringing. I was expected to do well and it put a lot of pressure on me that maybe wasn't healthy.

FWIW I was academic and did well but my "career" path has been less than impressive. It's ok, that's about it.

I want DD (yr 8) to do well and I may be a bit pushy at times. I have to reign it back. Luckily he feels the same and also wants to do well but I mustn't impose this on his possibly less academic (or less focussed) younger siblings.

I don't have any advice but I think recognising it is a good step. Also I bet many cultures would find it weird to worry about this and see it as their duty to push their children to succeed!!

Thanks all. Some really helpful messages. I might have even shed a tear!

I went to an incredibly - I mean, incredibly - academic school where I was very middling (but would have done exceptionally well somewhere else less Oxbridge orientated) and I think the 'I'm not enough' label has stuck. I'm very concerned about not giving that to my DD, but I know that I have work to do in this respect. I tell her all the time Im proud of her - for other values, like resilience and kindness etc - but I've also been clear that it's my job to help her fulfil her potential and I want her to do the best she can.

I need to get it right, though, and I probably haven't. Work to be done.

Great post OP, I love your honesty! I also have this issue and I try and find out if my concern is about me and my stuff or about my daughter. It is an ongoing thing and I don't always know. give yourself a break tho, at least you can see it in yourself!

And also, going to those schools sets you up to have certain internal standards - as much as I hated it. So it's those standards that I'm subconsciously holding her to, I suspect.

I was chatting to a friend about this today. I was super academic at school and became a lawyer and lots of my friends are lawyers and doctors but all of them are stressed and unhappy. It’s made me reassess the importance of academics for my own DD who sounds similar to your daughter.

Also, you said 'you need to get it right'. Are you being a perfectionist about doing this the right way too? Because there is no perfect in parenting OP, just good enough is ok. x

It's fine (indeed part of good parenting) to care about how they do at school. It's fine to want them to reach their potential, whatever that is. But this, OP, seems to be specifically about her getting into the top set - which, as PPs have said, is pointless if it isn't where she actually is currently (I don't know if that's the case, obviously). To you, this is about validation (or not) of you as a parent, and you need to work on that. The PP who asked what it would mean to you if she doesn't get into the top set (or gets into a low one) has written (IMO) one of the most important posts on the threads thus far. Reflect on that, work out what's going on for you.

The only response to 'I made mistakes' is to check that she actually understands the work/principle, then, presuming that's in place, 'how do you think you might avoid making those mistakes in future?' Then talking through techniques together. Practically, calmly and without emotion. I don't think I'd go down the route of 'it's OK, try again next time', even, as per a PP, because that implies that mistakes are unfortunate and to be avoided 'next time', when they're inevitable and, for most people most of the time, an essential part of the learning process.

I think it is good and healthy you can recognise this. If it helps, I had one academically high achieving daughter and one who was less academic and less driven by that. They are both lovely successful adults. The high school years can be hard, but the important thing is to have their backs so they find their own way. Non academic daughter pursued a vocational route, which was right for her.

As a mother of daughters, the most important thing for me was that they would be able to stand on their own 2 feet and earn their own living. You actually don't need stellar academic results for this - a far more rounded set of life skills matter once you leave school.

So put those maths sets in perspective - it will not determine your daughter's future. Your total support for the person she is and the path she chooses to take in life will help her so much more than being in the top set for maths.

A good school will adjust initial sets when they see how they work out. DD1 changed sets for all 3 of her setted subjects during y7. It will become obvious if a DC is sinking in a set or finding the pace ridiculously slow.

I know what you mean. I found myself telling DD in her first term of year 7 that she should do GCSE music?! Thing is, in fairness to your projections, it would be a good thing for her to try and get into the best set she can so she is around like-minded people. But if that for her is set 2, you need to work in that being OK for you too. I had an academically pushy mother, not helped by a straight A older sister, and it was hard work and I found myself pushing back against it rather than feeling encouraged.

I'm going to go slightly against the grain here and say that actually, wanting her to do well when you know she has the skills and capabilities is not a bad thing. I mean, feeling like the set she's in is the only way to determine value or that you/her will be judged if she's not in the top set is definitely not good. But if she clearly has the ability to be good at maths and she's doing less well because she's careless and not paying attention, then yes, I'd want to address that.

Not being good at maths is not the end of the world because opportunities that involve maths are automatically closed to that person. But having the potential to be good at maths ad not putting in the effort means that person is losing the opportunity for themselves.

I struggle with this. I'm high achieving ASD and I can't fathom my kids don't get simple maths stuff. It's been a learning curve. They are not me though and need to learn in their own way.

Why is it never parents whose kids score average (or below) in SATS who say they don't know the score compares to others?

Praise and genuinely value effort, not attainment.
It took me till child 3 to actually do this.

There is nothing wrong with caring about your child’s education and wanting them to do well. I think parental interest and engagement can be a big factor in them doing well.

I do think it needs to be about putting in the work and effort though rather than being the best. I’m very average academically but I would say the effort I put in to my exams all those years ago was probably similar to my dses but they excelled and got amazing grades, I barely scraped passes at GCSE!

My parents really cared how I did at school because I was seen as "academic" because I was a bookworm. I got into a super selective independent because I got 100% on two of the tests (I flunked maths but the other two exams balanced out). They didn't pressure me directly but I always knew they expected great things and would be disappointed if I didn't do well.

I grew into an anxious people pleaser who at 43 still cares way too much about my parents' opinions, I am afraid of failure. I also have ADHD which is a recent discovery, I just thought I was chaotic and scatty. My parents don't believe in ADHD. I haven't told them.

My sister was clearly not like me at all in personality or attitude to learning and has never had any expectations placed on her, she isn't a people pleaser at all and has much better boundaries than me.

It's really hard to get it right.

I'll never forget my DF opening MY O level results as I was round at a friends and telling me how disappointed he was that I got mostly Bs. With DS for his Nat 5s ( we're in Scotland) we tried to encourage based on efforts, but luckily for us that did translate into results.

I guess it's part of the process of trying to step away to provide more of a sounding board and general support when required, rather than being more hands on when they're younger.

It's really hard when you've been to an academic school and are average for that school. I am probably above average than the majority of the population in terms of straight academics (exam grades) but because I was in bottom sets for everything that was streamed I felt stupid until A levels when I got almost top grades.

They seemed to focus on the oxbridge hopefuls and doctors. The rest of us muddled through. But yes, internal standards are set early on.

30 years later that self doubt has stayed with me. Definitely holds me back. Thankfully the eldest child who I talked about early has a more laid back personality which I hope will stand them in good stead.

Watching and reading with interest OP @Dickens222

I have a feeling I am like you. Similar feelings of always wanting to do well and be neat and perfect when I was at school.

DD who is primary is very bright but I think sloppy, takes no pride in her work, consistently gets the same things wrong and it makes me feel embarrassed for her.

I try to hide like you and i think i do but the mask slips from time to time.

I tell myself she is a person in her own right and will find a way. She is different to me and that is OK. There is plenty she can do and does do better than I could at her age. She has a good heart and hasn't been tainted with my upbringing of judgement and fear of failure too much yet.

I remind myself of this constantly.

Highly academic DD who has always been perfectionist and excelled. Yes I enjoyed the fact that she was doing so well academically I will admit. She had a very bad patch of mental health in part linked to her perfectionism (I have never pushed her ever) but she is very driven.
What I want to say is after a few hideous weeks where I was worried she would do something drastic, sleepless nights and so on I have dropped all care of her academic success.
Yes I want her to achieve her best for her but not at the price of anything else. Not saying this would happen to your DD but if she strives to please you it will put pressure on her even if you don't mean it to.
Praise her working hard and doing her best never the marks. I try to say " that's a brilliant result you worked hard are you pleased with it?"
Really in terms of moving on to A Levels etc they only need good grades in the things they enjoy so for example my DD doesn't want to pursue her French so there is no need for her to stress and try and get 7/8/9 just do her best and see what she gets.
No one cares about GCSE'S when you have moved onward and upwards after school.
I also don't say anything to anyone about DD's grades except close family if she says it's OK. You don't need to tell people her grades you just say she's doing very well and working hard thank you.
I suppose I'm trying to say you just want a happy healthy child and you don't want to make her feel she's letting you down at any point. But yes it's understandable to want them to do well we'd be lying if we didn't get a little buzz from good marks or top set or whatever.

You sound like my mum
It's not a bad thing, it depends on the child.
I rebelled and left school to work in Iceland ( the supermarket not the country!)
My brother went to uni and now has multiple degrees and a 6 figure salary

The parents who worry are the ones whose kids get 112 but they want 115! The parents who don't worry are the ones whose kids are getting 90 and could be doing better if they applied themselves. You are right to tell yourself to stop worrying. What will you be like when she actually does her GCSEs? And yes, she will pick up on this and the pressure will make her more likely to underperform on the test.

OP, when I was the same age (30 yrs ago), a similar test placed me firmly in the bottom set for maths. And there I sat, until my parents managed to persuade the school to move me up a set. I hated maths, didn't even try, was content to languish in the set I once overheard a teacher describe as the 'remedial lot'. However, I did scrape a C for GCSE, but that was thanks to invested parents, a tutor, and my eventual realisation around Year 9 that maths is actually a pretty important subject and I'd need it to go to a decent University.

I guess my point is, even if she doesn't get into the set you'd hoped for, it's not the be all and end all...as you pointed out, things can change and if she has parental support, then that will really help.

I do understand your frustration though. I love reading and am sad that my DD just isn't as interested in it, at her age I was devouring books whilst she just would rather play games.

I have read all the messages and appreciate everyone's input. I know i need to really sort myself out in this respect - there is a thin line between supporting her to fulfil her potential and damaging her with my own expectations. And as my DP says, if she doesn't get into top set (and she will want to and be upset if she doesn't), it might motivate her to work hard and care about making less mistakes.

Ultimately, though, I need to keep reminding myself of the (lack of) importance in the grand scheme of things. And she's wonderful, with so much to offer. AND IS HER OWN PERSON AND IS NOT AN EXTENSION OR REFLECTION OF ME

As others have said, it's good that you care and that you're aware of passing on too much anxiety around it to your daughter. I'd think of the worst case scenario and what that would actually mean and realise that it isn't that bad: Someone who does badly at school can do retakes when they're more ready and or motivated, life experience is just as important when chasing that dream job.
Just concentrate on being her relief from all the stress that's already put on her by her teachers and herself, not to mention the social pressures of being a teen. Don't be yet another source of stress for her. I went to school with a girl whose long blonde hair fell out due to exam stress and never grew back. I would be very surprised if none of that stress came from parental pressure.