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Original poster

Sharing Christmas, any family law specialists about?

36 replies

CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 06:09

A question about Christmas and sharing time with the kids and ex.

This is the second Christmas since the divorce and looking to be my second Christmas without my kids, one teen, one tween and a younger one.

Last year Christmas fell on his weekend, they went to him Christmas eve pm and came back to me boxing day pm. He did drop the kids to me for 4 hours Christmas day afternoon for presents but they had already had dinner with him and had plans for the evening food .

4 hours was not enough.

This year, unfortunately, Christmas falls on his weekend again. I had requested from him last year that I have Christmas this year as that is what the kids wanted but he ignored my request.

I have made a suggestion now that I have them Christmas eve and they go to him Christmas day teatime in addition to him having them extra nights either side of Christmas but he is not having it.

Kids are due back to me younget ones normal bedtime on Christmas day as it is a Sunday, again I miss out on all of the special moments with them.

This is the last year my youngest is likely to believe and I really would like them all over night Christmas eve.

I have contacted a mediation firm whos has said, in addition to the costs for hourly rates both ex and I would need to pay a £500 retainer. I know he would not be prepared to do this, also I am not sure I could afford all legal costs on my own.

Are there any family law specialists out there who can help me understand if I took this further am I likely to be granted Christmas this year?

Or is there anyone with any other suggestions on how I can make this work?

Thanks for reading and any help is much appreciated.

OP posts:
bluberries · 14/08/2022 06:13

Not a specialist but the default position is usually every other year

User354354 · 14/08/2022 06:18

Yeah the standard would be every other year.

Although I highly doubt you will get a court date before Xmas, and you'll need to have attempted mediation before hand- except on special circumstances.

The best thing would be to try and resolve with him directly for this year.

I know this isn't always possible, my ex would just enjoy seeing me hurt. Sounds like yours is the same.

Can the older 2 not speak to him.

lisavanderpumpscloset · 14/08/2022 06:25

If he's not prepared to negotiate, could you have Christmas at your house a day or two early / late and make it extra special, so the kids effectively get 2? I know it isn't the same but at least they'll see how hard you've tried to make it special for them

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about these subjects:

Christmas Events & celebrations Family law
Original poster
CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 06:44

@User354354 the older 2 do not want to upset him and feel very torn between us so I would not feel comfortable asking them to try.

Yes he is similar, will do anything he can to hurt me and makes out I am totally unreasonable in all situations and he is the fairest which is absolutely not the case.

@lisavanderpumpscloset an early Christmas is a good idea which i may just plan, however is makes me sad I will not get any more believing again, though I know that is not what it is all about but it is special and I was always the one in the relationship to make Christmas special whilst he just got drunk and moaned about everything I did before passing out.

OP posts:
lisavanderpumpscloset · 14/08/2022 06:50

How old is your youngest? Are they likely to believe Santa makes special early trips for children that have 2 Christmases so they can enjoy it with both parents? If they're young enough, you could send a 'letter from Santa' explaining as much, and there's also that app thing (can't remember what it's called) where you can take a photo of a room in the house and place Santa in the photo to make it all believable. Footprints etc too. Depends on their age.

I can't imagine how hard it is and your ex sounds like a douche but it will only come around on him

CornishGem1975 · 14/08/2022 06:53

As far as I understand it - there is nothing in law that covers Christmas arrangements and the advice is to try and sort it yourselves.

autienotnaughty · 14/08/2022 06:56

Holiday are typically different we alternated. 1 year I'd have them Xmas eve/Christmas daytime , the following Xmas day eve/boxing day. Tell him you will split it 50/50 then go back to eow. What's ur custody in theweek? If they are mostly with u point out that if he doesn't agree he will lose out next year and probably for about 3/4 years after that.

weekendninja · 14/08/2022 07:03

He sounds immovable.

Without court you are stuck and I wonder if the time/expense/stress would be worth it. Plus, you are playing into his hands giving him exactly what he wants.

I'd re-frame it in my mind. Christmas does not have to be celebrated on 25th Dec. For me it has been important to have a day completely for us, without the 'polluted' feel I often get when the DC return from contact. We still did the going to bed thing with presents in the morning. It still feels good with golden family time.

Plus, when you have a DC that still believes there us do much you can do to share in that magic before the day.

Celeryfavour · 14/08/2022 07:11

Is contact court ordered, or agreed between you? PP is right, Christmas doesn't fall on a weekend again until 2027, then 2032.

cexuwaleozbu · 14/08/2022 07:17

He sounds loke a total arsehole but that's sadly not unusual.

Do you normally have them in the week? If you cam bear this, consider just giving in this year because 2023, 24, 25 and 26 will all be Christmas day on weekdays so you will have more Christmases with your kids overall if there's no special arrangement for Christmas.

Or alternatively you can use this as a negotiation start point - either he agrees alternate christmases now, rather than sticking with the normal schedule, or he will find there's years at a time when the normal schedule doesn't give him any time with the kids and the boot will be on the other foot.

ForfuckssakeEXHstopbeingatwat · 14/08/2022 07:21

Absolutely do it a day early. Tell your believers that Santa understands when children have two homes so he makes special extra trips and do and exact copy of what you would normally do on Xmas Eve /Day. It's absolutely not worth getting into debt and a nasty, draining stressful court process over this. The least interaction with your ex the better. Also, if they're with you during the week the next 5 Christmas days will be with you if you just follow your normal contact, yes? The believing thing is sweet but last year was the first that mine definitely didn't and it was so much less hassle!!

Afonavon · 14/08/2022 07:22

He sounds like hard work. I would have an early Christmas the weekend before Christmas, ‘arranging’ with Santa if the youngest will accept this version.

We have had Christmas on different days to the 25th a couple of times. They feel like real Christmas for us. Christmas films, food, gifts, Santa comes early.

hashbrownsandwich · 14/08/2022 07:29

If the arrangement is not court ordered, then technically you can do what you want, but then so can he.
I think you are overlooking the fact he gave them the 4 hours on what was his Christmas time with them.
Can you offer the same deal if he's willing to let you have them this year?

Original poster
CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 07:31

Thank you for all the suggestions so far.
In answer to some of the questions, the youngest will be 8 and has been questioning for some time if father Christmas is real so I know it won't last a further year.

Contact is not court ordered, it was agreed between us but I stupidly did not discuss special dates with him.

The kids go to ex 1 set night in the week so the way it all works with Christmas over the coming years is I will get Christmas eve 2023, him 2024 them me 25 and 26.

I would never have dreamed of saying it falls on my days so you can't see them, I would have made it fair but I gues he has now set the precedent...

OP posts:
warofthemonstertrucks · 14/08/2022 07:33

When dealing with an ex like this there is no option but to get court ordered arrangements. Otherwise you will have tears of fuckery to deal with-it starts With Christmas and ends up being every decision that needs to be made about the kids. Expensive but worth it. Too late for this Christmas probably but I'd get a solicitor we're I you and make a start.

Original poster
CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 07:34

@hashbrownsandwich my suggestion for this year was I have them Christmas eve then they go to him teatime Christmas day and he has boxing day, i think that is fair?

OP posts:
warofthemonstertrucks · 14/08/2022 07:35

It would great fair. But he isn't going to be interested in what's fair probably.

Stag82 · 14/08/2022 07:37

not A specialist, but we do every other year 6pm Xmas eve until 6pm Xmas day. It’s not my year this year so we will celebrate Xmas on Boxing Day. Will chill from 6pm and get up in the am like it’s Xmas day. Birthdays we are a bit more relaxed on, and it tends to be whoever it falls on. again if they are at ex’s I just do a day close too. Sometimes ex girlfriend will do a tea party and I’ll go along. N

Lilypickles1 · 14/08/2022 07:40

100% go to court, it costs about £200/300 if you represent yourself… which will be fine. Court will agree with alternate, no court would say no to that and I’d do it quick so it’s done in time ☺️

hashbrownsandwich · 14/08/2022 07:49

CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 07:34

@hashbrownsandwich my suggestion for this year was I have them Christmas eve then they go to him teatime Christmas day and he has boxing day, i think that is fair?

I mean, personally I think it's fair but he obviously doesn't.

I think you need to do a written communication to him stating why you want to do things this way. Allow him to respond in writing.

Mediation is a good idea, albeit costly.

bluberries · 14/08/2022 07:56

CatsShinyWhiskers · 14/08/2022 07:34

@hashbrownsandwich my suggestion for this year was I have them Christmas eve then they go to him teatime Christmas day and he has boxing day, i think that is fair?

Do you live relatively near each other. The one thing my DSC asked for aparantly was that they don't split xmas day as they didn't want to be sat in a car. It also means they don't feel they have to sit through two christmas dinners etc if it's not planned well enough and if they are worn out by the evening they can just mooch with no pressure.

JenniferWooley · 14/08/2022 07:58

Regular contact schedules are usually suspended over the festive period & you either split the day or have alternate years.

We tend to split the day but we are amicable.

I have older kids & he has younger kids but only DS together so the default position is DS stays Christmas Eve in the home where there are other children. DS is 14 so no longer believes & because his younger siblings were born the year after he stopped believing I got all the Christmas Eve's when DS believed & ex was fine with this as he wanted DS to spend the morning with his sisters, but now ex gets every Christmas Eve as my older kids are adults & he has toddlers.

Swap over time is 2pm - we figured with a 6am start & 10pm bedtime that gave us half the day each, but again this is flexible depending on dinner plans & where DS would rather be for dinner if any of us are going to our parents.

We've had a couple of years where DS spent the whole day & night with one parent & neither of us particularly liked it so we try not to unless it's necessary.

If he can't be amicable then you'll have to go to court & have holidays/birthdays/weddings etc written in to the agreement - before you go make a list of everything because if you forget you could end up without the kids on Mother's Day if it falls on his weekend.

Soontobe60 · 14/08/2022 08:14

I would see if you can get a court date before Christmas, and book in mediation.
Meanwhile, email him about the issue so you have evidence.
eg “Hi ExH, with regard to Christmas this year, as you had the DC overnight on Christmas Eve + Christmas Day last year, for fairness I will have them the same this year - I will collect them at 6pm on Christmas Eve and you may have them between 12 noon and 4pm on Christmas Day if you wish. They will have Christmas dinner with me after you return them. You may then pick them up at 6pm on Boxing Day”
When my dd was young, we split Christmas and birthdays equally regardless of who’s contact it was. For example, if it was my week to have her (we did 1 week on 1 week off) she would see her father on Christmas Eve day until 5pm, I’d collect her and she would stay with me until Boxing Day morning - usually 10am. She would then go to her fathers until the following day at whatever time was agreeable. We just worked it that she had 2 Christmas days in effect as when she wasn’t with me we didn’t do anything at home, but had a party on Boxing Day when she was with me. She loved it because she had 2 christmases in reality!

midgetastic · 14/08/2022 08:24

You get an email
... oh my it's from Santa
... it can't be?!

He just needs to check the dates for stockings in your house ... his system is showing 22 dec can you confirm ?

itsgettingweird · 14/08/2022 08:45

cexuwaleozbu · 14/08/2022 07:17

He sounds loke a total arsehole but that's sadly not unusual.

Do you normally have them in the week? If you cam bear this, consider just giving in this year because 2023, 24, 25 and 26 will all be Christmas day on weekdays so you will have more Christmases with your kids overall if there's no special arrangement for Christmas.

Or alternatively you can use this as a negotiation start point - either he agrees alternate christmases now, rather than sticking with the normal schedule, or he will find there's years at a time when the normal schedule doesn't give him any time with the kids and the boot will be on the other foot.

This is actually good advice.

Just make sure you have it in writing that he will not negotiate alternate Christmases and uses the period as usual contact time.

Then if he wants christmases in future he can pay for mediation and court costs.

I know that doesn't get you what you want this year but sometimes you have to lose the battle to win the war. Which is what he wants - a war.

Also is the youngest young enough to not even know the date?

Would they be fooled into thinking the 23rd is actually 24th and xmas Eve and would the select go along with that?

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