Urgent help - DS being threatened

[LotsOfNothing]

Posting in chat for traffic. Name changed for obvious reasons.

DS 15, at local comp. Decent school with a few bad eggs. He's had problems with a kid on and off, who is the younger brother of a boy who we know is caught up on gang culture. This kid has taken his lunch money a couple of times and tried to get DS to steal things for him etc but so far DS has managed to avoid getting involved.

Today this kid has told DS that if he doesn't give him £150 he will stab him. DS says this boy is a loose canon with something to prove so his threat is not to be completely disregarded. He told DS that if he paid up, that would be the end of it all.

Of course DS wants to pay but I think this will make him an easy (and lucrative) target and the demands will continue.

But obviously I want to keep him safe.

Talking to school is pointless. They can't keep DS safe outside of school and from what in understand regarding this boys family and acquaintances, the school would be completely out of their depth. Police involvement would instantly mark DS out as a grass to some very nasty people which is also a danger.

have worked with kids like this before so I understand the dangers and also, sadly, the ineffectiveness of police in this kind of situation.

DS is now crying and frightened and I am also worried. I don't care about the money and if I thought that would be the end of it, I'd give it to DS in a heartbeat, but I'm not sure it would be the end of it. I think there is a chance this boy would tell others where he got the money and DS would have more people trying it on.

I haven't told DH yet as he would definitely tell DS not to pay a penny and stand up toto this boy, but I am worried that this makes DS vulnerable and DS doesn't really get how this could escalate.

I want to punch the little shit and don't know what to do.

Any advice?

If you give a thug money he will be back to ask for more ad infinitum.

Go to the police as it's a credible threat.

My nephew was in a similar situation to this, spoke with school, police and had lifts everywhere and only went to places with trusted friends (getting picked up and dropped off). It took a couple of years. It was exhausting for him and his parents and he only really started to recover after getting away from the area and spending a couple of months living with me in a different part of the country over a summer. If you have a relative who your DS has a strong relationship with, tap them.

I can understand why you are hesitant to involve the police but I don't see that you have many other options. Obviously you can't pay it.

Can you keep him off school for the week (covid?), speak to the police informally and see what they can advise?

I'm sorry you're going through this, but I really can't see what you want people to say.

The obvious, and sensible advice is inform the school, and the police. And you've shot that down.

So what else would you like people to tell you?

Yes. Phone 111. Explain how scared you are and that you don't want to make a formal statement at the moment but that you need advice. They will have helped people in this situation before.
You also need to let school know. Even if you ask them not to say anything to the other boy, you still need to let them know

You do NOT pay the money.
This is a child, not a a drug dealer who's owed money.

School and police, now. Do not waste time.

Keep him off school.

If moving isn't an option you've got no choice.
You have to tell the police, I'm not saying that's risk free but you are out of options.
There was a boy in one of my DC year who was 'taxed ' for his trainers in yr8 they made his life a fucking misery until he dropped out just before GCSE he lost phones, coats, shoes, money, even his blazer and school tracksuit!
His parents wouldn't complain so he ended up sitting outside McDonald's all day, terrified.
it's so shit and unfair that it's your son but doing nothing isn't going to hel p.

Its easy to say inform school and police, if you don't know how this will work. They know the boy, in turn will know his family and where he lives. There will be many, many more involved. These gangs are big on retaliation , they thrive on it. They don't let things go.
I would move and I mean house and area.
My friend had to do the same and it was the only way.

Okay he's 15 so 1 more year at school? I'd definitely talk to the police, school, and do pick ups and drop offs for the foreseeable future.

This kid will do something stupid or get so far down a county lines rabbit hole in 6 months you won't see him again. Or the school will involve ss and he maybe given the help he clearly needs.

These things don't last forever but you do have to take a stand, and they'll move on and hopefully grow out of it or get so out their depth they stop.

when my son was being threatened with being stabbed, I said that it had gone too far and i went to the police, the head of the school and I kept ds home.

Obviously you dont pay it or he will just ask for more.
The boy has gone from bullying, to extortion and blackmail. Threatening to stab someone is seen as knife crime, even for just the threats.

If you think that telling the police or school is somehow a bad idea, then im not sure what advice you want. Move areas? change to an online school?

What everyone else has said, keep him at home (mainly because apart from worrying he will be hurt, I would worry he will start carrying a knife).

Make sure you put all your knives away somewhere safe and secure NOW - seriously.

You can buy stab proof vests (and yes tehy are not perfect) very easily if you are really concerned.

Make sure you know the first aid for a stab wound and make sure your DS knows as well.

Talk about what to do if anything does happen - Ie run to the nearest door, scream like hell to get attention etc.

So sorry OP, this is truly terrible. Your poor DS! Can you just take him out of school, sign him up somewhere else? drastic but then so is the situation, I’d probably consider moving but perhaps that’s an over reaction. I’m afraid I don’t have much advice or experience, apart from knowing some pretty violent people in my youth. Only thing I can think of is getting him the hell away from the situation.

Also, might seem a bit trivial but some self defence or fight training might help him feel more confident and secure. Some deescalation instruction could be useful too, but I think you really you need some serious expertise weighing in on this.

I can understand the worry about getting parties like the police and the school involved when you are not 100% they can protect your son. It’s a tough one. Are there any organisations who deal with gang violence specifically? Might be worth getting in touch with them.

I'd want to kick his fucking head in personally
I'd go in and speak to the police, it's harder to brush you off when you are standing infront of them
Keep evidence, take him & pick him up from school and ask him to kerb his social life for a bit
I'd look into body cams too
Not fair I know but his safety comes first

He needs a bolt hole far from you. It's sad, really sad, but get him away to friends or family at least 100 miles away. Then decide if you want to involve the police - is this likely to affect your older son? The school will have to know, obviously, because he won't be there anymore.

It’s 101 first of all, not 111.

Absolutely do not give him any money. All that will do is make your son a target for every scally locally. I think your son needs to try and keep his cool along with you doing everything you can to keep him safe.

i would simultaneously approach the school and the police. Do you have any written evidence of the threats or just verbal?

OP so sorry this is happening to your ds, he must be out of his mind with worry. I would speak to the police for a start, tell them you don’t want them to act just yet as you are worried of reprisals but that you would like advice, I’m sure they will have more practical advice.

In the meantime arrange for your son to be picked up and dropped off, and maybe to do online learning for the foreseeable future until this is dealt with.

Op missing people are worth calling. They work with a lot of young offenders on the cusp of starting out in gang life and are very familiar with this pattern of behaviour - it's possible that this lad has been sucked into county lines and this is his 'initiation'. Missing people don't just work with people who are missing and part of their remit is to stop county lines involvement at this sort of stage rather than try to extricate people after they are completely entrenched. I did sone work with them on this a couple of years ago and they're very knowledgeable with lots of resources and support available.

Here is a link that might be useful: www.missingpeople.org.uk/get-help/help-services/exploitation-and-county-lines/safecall-form-refer-yourself-or-your-child

Absolutely do not pay this vile boy.

It will make him more inclined to ask your DS for more money.

Contact the police. Right now.

You have to tell the school and the police. Your DS is already in a precarious situation. Keep him home. It's nearly the summer holidays anyway.

You also need to tell your DH.

Unless you have rival gang contacts - which you don't - then the only other avenue is authority. And yy I've worked with DCs in gangs. I'd still be going to the school and police. Extortion on threat of stabbing isn't something you can ignore.

@LotsOfNothing further to my previous couple of posts here is the number: 116 000
And more info on county lines exploitation and how to handle it if your child is being threatened: www.missingpeople.org.uk/get-help/help-services/exploitation-and-county-lines/what-is-county-lines

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I would consider keeping him off school while it is dealt with. I wouldn’t consider giving the money as it will make him more of a target.

Thank you for all the advice and links

DS gets hysterical when I mention school/police as he is afraid of reprisals, but I have am trying to make him see that this isn't something we can deal with in isolation.

I am not sure if taking him out of school is going to help. This boys is local and if he wants to find DS, he can. The only upside might be 'out of sight, out of mind' - it's an option - a shit one as he is Year 10 - and as I say, wherever he moves (if we could even get somewhere) would be equally local.

He has asked me to hold off reporting over the weekend whilst he has one shot at 'talking' to the boy. I am not sure but giving him this one opportunity and I am going to take him to school tomorrow and collect him. He plans to tell this boy that 'all the threats in the world doesn't change the fact that he doesn't have money or access to money, so now what?' The boy will know DS is scared and the fact that he still isn't delivering might convince him that he is barking up the wrong tree... If this doesn't stop it all dead in his tracks - I am going to school and will also take police advice.

It feels a bit flimsy and I am not sure but if we can prevent it from escalating any further, then we'll take that. I will also be telling DH and will just have to make him realise that this isn't a 'punch the bully on the nose' situation....

Hmmm do not let him anywhere near the boy!!

Please don't allow him to do this, it's insane.