How does my DD (11) help her friend who cries regularly and won't talk about it

[Goldenbear]

Dd has a friend who she likes but she frequently gets upset about seemingly nothing in particular. She will suddenly start crying, drop her head and refuses to communicate with anyone. This girl is very quiet and almost whispers most form of communication but does have a laugh and joke with her friends. Dd just has no idea how to help when she is in one of these moments, does anyone have any advice or experience with this kind of situation, perhaps phrases or things that DD can do to help?

kimfox, luckily DD has a group of friends, in fact this is another issue as the friend who cries feels like the girls leave her out, I think as a group they are all out of their depth and don't know how to help, what to do.

MrsSkylerWhite, I wasn't suggesting my DD offers support that is way beyond her years, I meant practical tips in those moments where when they are walking to school the friend has walked ahead and DD is left following, there is a nervousness on my DD'S part. I think talking to the parents may offens them but then again, the Dad does seem to want to talk about it, he seems a bit desperate about it all sometimes.

I would contact the school myself and mention it as a safeguarding concern. Your daughter just needs to be the friend she's being, she sounds lovely. Perhaps tell your dd to tell her when her friend gets upset that if anything really bad is happening then she'll go to a teacher with her.

I'm not trying to diagnose i just really feel for this child, tbh I find it upsetting that there is something glaringly problematic but nothing is being done to help her. I find the parents frustrating- their inaction sad and want them to help their daughter, we (me and another Mum) know the Mum well and we are all always on the cusp of saying something but back down. We want to help the child and be kind.

Ok given the updates you need to contact the school and tell them to back the hell.off your dd. They are putting far to much on her already.

They are being paid for this. Your dd isn't.

Shes not there to absorb everyone else's problems

This. You need to ensure that the people who are responsible for the child deal with her and look after her, not your dd.

I have learned this lesson too late in life, but it’s so important.

@coffeeisthebest

I agree. You can't and don't have the full picture, so please stop trying to diagnose someone else's child.

You are right. I focused far too much in the other child when actually this is about the OPDD.

I would have been the child taking on all my friends problems. Definitely lacking boundaries...

The pp are right, she can signpost the friend for help but don't let her become a crutch. Tell your DD to let her be "in her moment".

If she does have a neurodivergence, then a transition to high school may be very difficult. Same for trips too.

Don't be letting them blame the chatty child tho, not fair.

Whatwouldscullydo and others who have highlighted this- thanks you, I have been brought up to mostly put other first and I think I'm edging towards passing on that bad habit to my DD, DD is a grounded and kind girl so takes situations in her stride but people like that tend to be put upon so I think it is right to take a step back.

MrsPelligrinoPetrichor, yes that is good practical advice.

My first thought from the first post was that it could be a safeguarding issue. But then talking about being overwhelmed, behaviour on the school trip etc I thought it started sounding more like ASD. If this crying is the equivalent of a meltdown due to being overwhelmed then nothing anyone does will help which is probably why the teacher is at a loss as much as your dd. What needs to happen is for the friend to have things in place to help prevent her becoming overwhelmed - but if no one is aware she is on the spectrum how is that ever going to happen? (or maybe they do know but they just don't know how to handle it). You certainly can't go to school and say you think the friend may have ASD and I wouldn't suggest it to the mum either unless you're very sure she will take it ok.

What I would tell your dd is that her friend probably just needs to cry and that's her way of dealing with things and she doesn't need to feel she has to try to get her to stop crying or make her feel better because that's what the crying is doing all on its own. Just suggest she accept that the friend needs to cry when she's overwhelmed and when she feels ready friend will stop crying and they can move on and have fun. If your dd is happy to do it then suggesting going somewhere quiet and calming would probably to be helpful to friend, or if there is somewhere friend feels safe. This is what I would suggest whatever is wrong with friend but particularly if it is ASD.

Signpost is a good way of putting it to DD. Yes, the chatty girl is lovely in the group, the parents of the crying friend really had a downer on her on the day of the party and seemed to want to blame her for their DD's upset at her own party. I stuck up for chatty friend and pointed out that she just has an energy and enthusiasm for life and she doesn't mean any harm at all IME. They were offended that I didn't agree with them but I just find their negativity so draining. The Mum of crying friend will talk about her job loads, how stressful it is etc and I will mention my work once, which is quite dull to most as it is in IT and she will visibly roll her eyes. She says she can't stand another Mum's husband in the group as he just talks about himself but the irony is she talks loads about her work, her life and how overwhelmingly stressed she is to everyone.

If your dd is happy to do it then suggesting going somewhere quiet and calming would probably to be helpful to friend, or if there is somewhere friend feels safe. This is what I would suggest whatever is wrong with friend but particularly if it is ASD

This will merely just isolate the dd though. With the frequency this is happening the dd will be constantly faced with the choice of sitting alone somewhere with this child or staying with her group of friends.

Its not a position that will end well.

Staynow, I know I can't go to the school and say she has ASD but as you say if no one has picked up on this and I don't think they have then isn't this friend just going to flounder. I have noticed with age things have worsened not improved- the episodes have increased not reduced. She hasn't grown out of it.

Yes, I have advised her to give her some space. When I helped with chatty friend's disco party, I offered to take crying friend outside to get away from the noise. She wouldn't talk to me really but eventually I talked to her about something else completely unrelated, a dog we could see in the distance and she said a few words, then I asked her if it was too noisy in the party, she said yes and so we remained outside. The Mum knew she wasn't going to enjoy the party but sent her anyway, I find things like that frustrating as she knows I was helping and she knows crying friend is comfortable around me whereas Chatty friend's Mum is not really around the girls much accept my DD so she was in shock with the crying, she kept asking me what was wrong with crying girl, why was she crying.

This is so hard. The girl sounds very much like my son.
He has ASD and finds everything completely overwhelming at the moment.
On top of that it is a time where their hormones are changing/ starting high school etc etc. Throw autism into the mix and you have one very distressed child.

My son tends to isolate himself from others and spends time alone.
I think as regards your DD's friend, it's obvious that she needs more support from the ADULTS in her life, in particular school staff.
No way should the responsibility fall on any of the children.

I felt she sent her as she knew I would be there to babysit really. I think the parents need to think what are we going to do to help DD rather than running away from the confrontation or getting frustrated or cross with her.

Yes, the hormones thing i think is a possibility or adding to the woes and infact I suggested this as I think my DD is getting a bit overwhelmed with hormone changes and she is small, doesn't have a chest yet as opposed to her friend who looks more 13 than 10/11 and the Mum despite seeking an explanation dismissed my suggestions and said her DD is definitely not there yet.

Its very sweet you are so concerned about this child but ultimately if she's not asking for help her self and the parents are in denial there's nothing you can do here.

Making it even more vital that you advocate for your dd here. Keep on the teachers' cases until they leave your dd out of it. And force those bounderies until your dd recognises them and can assert them herself.

In the long run it Will probably trigger more support. Because once their safety blanket of your dd is removed the teachers will have no choice bit to step up and start dealing with the child and her parents.

The more you allow your dd to be involved the more it will.mask all the.issues.

That's a very good perspective to take and certainly rings true in this friendship group, the girls and adults are unknowingly complicit in normalising things as there is a bit of cajoling and a bit of a cover up. The girls but mainly DD tend to drop everything to ensure she is ok when this happens but the frequency is taking a strain on tje friendship group now as they don't know how to help. My DD is even showing irritation but I am just going to guide her in to backing off. If the adult friends mention it I don't think the Mum will take it well anyway so will probably avoid us then.

She doesn't. She steps away and makes new friends, this is not her problem, not her responsibility.

Speak to dd about it. About dd's self worth and about Deciding whether our friendship is worth it.

Email HoY about it. Re the effect it's having on all the girls as a group, the head of year should be concerned about this and then you will feel better about having done something constructive.

Yes, that is constructive, I'd rather talk to him though than email or anything, think it is better in a conversation..

There are a lot of traits of ASD there, the trouble is that needs to be on the radar of the parents and teachers to then go through appropriate investigation/ diagnosis (or identify any other underlying reasons for this behaviour)

That's one reason why it's important for DD to keep putting it back on the radar of the teachers.

DD is also too young to deal with this herself. She has her own emotional and social development needs. TBH anyone at school is too young, and no friend should compromise their needs to "fix" other people. That's not the same as abandoning a struggling friend, just learning healthy boundaries and making sure your own needs are met.

I had a complex friend with a lot of issues, and with hindsight, suspect that she may have been autistic. The friendship ultimately ended because she required more than was healthy to provide to her and expected me to be her only friend. Things like giving an overwhelmed friend space can be a good strategy, but they need to be able to have reliable social outlets and not entirely revolving around their friend's needs.

In the meantime, get her to keep telling responsible adults every time as soon as is practical
Give the friend space if needed and be there quietly if appropriate
Remind her she doesn't need to fix her friend
Make sure she has other healthy friendships

This.
Your DD is her friend and for a sad confused child that's probably very welcome.
DD can help by seeking appropriate support or just being alongside her. She doesn't need to fix anything.
Emotional support can be too much for kids to provide though, so she needs to be aware that she needs to look after herself first. If it's making her sad or anxious then it's fine to step back.

You don't know there is "nothing going on behind the scenes". You need to help your daughter learn to set boundaries so she isn't left to care for this little girl.

And stop jumping to conclusions about what the issue may or may not be - it could be any of a long list of things; most of them are really not for your to be made aware about.

Well I'm pretty close to the Mum and Dad tbh and she will ask me if I think her behaviour is something to worry about, the Dad will say stuff to me when we've been invited around their house socially. It is frustrating as they ask but don't listen to your advice.

I can't really expand as it is too outing but needless to say you sometimes don't have a choice in your involvement. There are things they could do to improve the situation instantly and they make everyone involved from their inaction or own behaviour. For example, with the disco party if the chatty friend, the Mum of crying friend was putting the party down to me suggesting it was an awful idea, her idea of hell, she said all this in front of her DD. Her DD is exactly the same and she knows she would hate it and be overwhelmed but as I was going to help chatty friend's mum who is my friend, she knew I would be there to effectively babysit her child, she knows me and is comfort with me and she knew she'd cry and stand outside for an hour. How is that action not making it my business. The Dad is very critical, I have said to him to accept his Dd for what she is rather than trying to change her. What longlist of things could it be, what is on this long list? I know the parents well and they have openly talked about the school offering counselling or other help they may pay for privately but it is never ever acted upon so yes I do feel sorry for this kid who most seem to be letting down. Do you think if someone is being assessed for autism then perhaps it would be helpful for her friends to know so they stop.getting frustrated with behaviour that is beyond her control? If she is going to leave my DD and walk off on the way to.school but at the same time they want my DD to walk to school with her so that she actually will go with ease, do you not think that is something I need to understand at least. You can't have it both ways I.e nothing you need to know about but at the same time carry on walking with our DD to ensure she is easy to.get up and out.

It's very odd that both the parents are discussing this girl's possible (likely) issues with you, yet not actually attempting to access help for her?
Your advice to accept her for who she is instead of trying to change her is a bit off!!
But then, they shouldn't be either asking or taking your advice on the first place.
Very odd dynamic.