"Gold dust" school jobs

[Smartsub]

I am currently trying to recruit for support staff in school. I need kitchen, staff, admin and TAs. All term time only and all school hours. The jobs I've previously seen referred to on here as "gold dust".

We are getting hardly any applications and those we do get a poor. Admittedly the money is poor, but that's always been the case. Until a couple of years ago the difficult part was sifting through the 100s of applications we'd get for such jobs, now we rarely get more than a handful.

What's changed?

Sorry that was in response to the pp who said about trying to get sims experience

One positive way of looking at this thread is that it maybe indicates that the wider workplace is finally valuing the skills of women who've had a career break, and offering working parents the flexibility they need. We've got 6 people in my school admin team - 5 of them are degree educated, including 2 RG and 1 Oxbridge. Among our TAs, there are various ex teachers and ex other professionals, including 1 with a doctorate. Every one of them will be earning less than 15 grand a year, all because they want child-friendly hours, which they very often don't actually get, because they put in loads of unpaid hours outside their contracts. All of them women. If other industries are finally starting to see the value in flexible working and offering post-children women properly paid jobs, it's no surprise they're going to leave. I currently take home five times less than I did pre kids - yes, my hours are shorter, but not that much shorter! Unlike lots of you, I actually work in a school that really does value its support staff and treat them properly, but even so, the pay vs responsibility sum just doesn't add up any more.

Look at the long list of responsibilities a ta has ,the pay then something a receptionist has and the pay.

@Widgets that's very frustrating. From the local authority side it's not people being able to use SIMS it's having the skills to use it properly with good quality, timely data. Schools don't always help themselves, they don't often understand transferrable experience and what any job outside of a school entails. I think I applied for 10 clerks jobs before I got the one I did, same application but the business manager at the school that selected me was fantastic and switched on. I have no idea why the other schools rejected me but the recruitment process is a bit of a mystery I think instead of other places where it's more matching up competencies and experience rather than "they sound like the could work in a school."

Doesn’t really explain why every public sector job has a tedious application form. Assuming they will get a DBS check, what safeguarding need is there to do a big form?

WOW, how utterly depressing. I had asked to volunteer because aparently it opens doors if you want to become a TA, or gives classrom experience if you have a degree anbd want to do PGCE etc. Unlike you I have no relevant experience (unrelated degree) and promted by a relative of DH's I looked at dinner lady jobs only to find that now they pay even less than they did before for 6 hours so it was not possible to waste money on bus fares on top of that. AND even they wanted EXPERIENCE WITH CHILDREN. They are not willing to train. and they want everyone to have experience with SEN, whichever school I have looked at. I have no idea how eveyrone gets the training and experince to become a TA, do the admin or anything else. The dinner ladies at my children's primary where I was fobbed off speak bad english let alone have any relevant experience (my children had expained incidents in the past where they were trying to give them red slips for reporting being attacked) and have been there for more than 15 years.

And that's on top of never getting a job in my field as I didn't have the relevant experience.

I volunteered as a reader in my dc’s school for one year. I was shocked at how rude the class teacher was. I really should have said something to the head.

I also know parents with relevant experience in school admin whom the school never approached although they knew and now have to work as PT teachers (had to retrain) in other schools and juggle the school run while our office has got yet another member of admin. I never even see them being advertised (I wouldn't be qualified).

I think the pandemic has changed the dynamics.More people working from home .Also as others have said .responsibilities are very high for this role and money crap.

Recruitment is a challenge in all sectors

You are competing against many more employers now offering flexible contracts and wfh.

You will need to pay more to attract candidates.

Also when you say the ones you get are "poor" .Maybe give them a chance before dismissing out of hand .I appreciate its not your fault,but for a long while Women were expected to do these low pay /hard work jobs .Not many Dads applying for Lunchtime Supervisors/Stressful conflict resolution, between friendship groups of primary School DC!

This.

How do people get the training though? Our borough's college was clear that to train as a TA you must be already working as a TA or at least volunteer. Yeah, right, the only think they don't require is an MSc let alone let volunteers. The private colleges that match you with schools as very far way.

This is madness. I’ve learned how to do everything I need to do on SIMS on the job within the first few weeks. Had a 3 hour training course a few weeks in and already knew most of it. Of course there are more complex things for end of year etc but it’s madness that they wouldn’t take someone on because of that.

I agree it is madness! That’s why I posted, through sheer frustration! Hoping OP can shed some light on the recruitment process and ways to gain SIMS experience. Any ideas OP?!
thanks to others who have replied to my post too, looks like others share my frustrations

I think the problem some schools have is the heads don't understand SIMS so think SIMS experience is more important than it is. You're right, if you're halfway computer literate you'd pick it up quickly.

Personally, I'm not keen on taking serving school staff for admin jobs. If someone's moving from one school admin to another similar role, experience tells they usually come with baggage. Ex bank staff make excellent school office people IME or really anyone who's been used to working in an office with reasonably high workloads.

Volunteers are a nightmare in schools though. I can see why they're not keen to help in that way.

Are you suggesting you want school admin and support staff who can't write a sentence on their application or use capital letters?

Smartsub No thats not what I meant! I do feel though that many Schools seem to have a problem with recruiting Staff though ,as they seemed able to pick and choose previously .My friend went as a TA for a couple of years as she was a fully qualified Teacher ,but had had a break from the Classroom for a while .Another friend similar .Also unless School Admin or similar, how do kitchen Staff / Lunchtime Supervisors need English skills?

Then you ask at interview to fill the blanks. Which is what private sector jobs that need you to do a DBS for them do. Its part of the problem schools have - now you are competing for candidates with private sector roles that offer WFH /flexibility to work round dcs, then paying less and making it harder to apply to make your job in recruitment easier is putting off the better candidates.

It's an OFSTED fail for safeguarding if you don't have fully completed application forms. We're not allowed to accept CVs.

@ChocolateDeficitDisorder

Same. Gone back to adult NHS MH and it’s nice to work with professionals again and be treated like a professional. I don’t speak for all but some teachers don’t know the meaning of the word. Incredibly rude and often full of their own self importance.

Who on Earth would want to work in schools these days?

Yes indeed- while your hands may be tied I think pp are asking why public sector jobs have long tedious application forms which are practically non existent in the private sector.

What’s changed? The cost of living crisis, that’s what’s changed. I’m on a fairly decent wage and I struggle to see how people who work in these types of roles can afford to pay their bills and feed their families to be honest. Costs have gone up but wages haven’t kept pace. We are about the experience the fall out from this in a big way…

I applied for an office admin term time only gold dust job. I was asked to come for an interview but the process was so onerous that I turned the interview down. If I had to go through all of that for just the interview I dread to think what the job was going to be like!

For a barely above minimum wage job I was expected to take a whole day off work and attend a group interview, then several individual interviews with various heads of departments, produce all my exam certificates (from 20 years ago. Originals, not copies) and sit a competency and personality quiz. Apparently that was just a first stage interview as well! Not to mention the application form that needed to know the ins and outs of a gnats arse.

I get that they have to follow safeguarding rules etc, but I was working in a role for which I needed enhanced security clearance in the defence sector and they managed to employ me with a normal CV and half an hour interview.

Funnily enough they are still trying to fill the post eight months later.

I’ve also looked into NHS admin jobs within children based services (which is where my experience is) I’ve hit a brick wall there too as they all use a data base system called RIO?! For childrens health records.
do you have specific in house NHS databases?