Asylum seekers to the UK sent to Rwanda

[Dodie66]

What do you think about the governments plan to send all asylum seekers that come to the UK to Rwanda to be processed. I think this is inhumane. A lot of them have come from places like Syria, Iran etc and travelled across the channel with all the associated risks only to be sent 6000 mile to be processed. What about the cost to do this? I think it’s a big mistake

@Spinachtastegud

Well it doesn't change my opinion.....a boat can only rescue so many people before it sinks itself. If saying 'no more' is an issue because you don't want to appear selfish then you'll have to deal with the fact that you all sink and drown...and then you'd be responsible for something far worse imo.

Do you think we should have better and safer ways to encourage people to apply for asylum whilst they are in the camps in Europe?

Or do you just think we shouldn't have anymore refugees because we are full?

We aren't very good at having safe routes for refugees. We could do better

In fact I believe the plan is that for those who qualify for asylum the UK government are paying the Rwandan government to set them up for a life there. No one will be coming back here. At least that's what Sky News is reporting tonight

So if they get a valid asylum claim, then they can build a life in Rwanda
I wonder what happens if their claim is rejected?

Ah, ok @MasterGland I found your previous post and sorry for missing it/not connecting the two.

Certainly big and important questions that have no easy answers. However, in the short term, having a government that properly funds services and and provides adequate and affordable housing, funds more gp surgeries and healthcare, schools that aren’t for-profit MATs etc, would be a fairly decent place to start.

Apparently there’s no money for that, but this government seems to find magic money trees all over the place so that’s not as believable as it once was.

The bonus being of course, that when people aren’t fighting for housing, school places, to be seen at a gp, they stop seeking asylum seekers and refugees as enemies “stealing” a precious resource.

[quote MasterGland]@bewarethelibrarians. Yes, I am against it. I said so in an earlier post, in which I also said that we still need to have a proper dialogue about migration in this country.
We need a nuanced debate, without resorting to name calling of racists or do-gooders by either side. Our political life is so polarised now that everyone is lurching towards the extremes on every issue. This is very dangerous.[/quote]
Re your pp I don’t know what the answer is to the big issues we’ll start to see. Am I missing something that could be a way to go?

It’s at the back of my mind but I can’t think of what we’ll do

Well it doesn't change my opinion.....a boat can only rescue so many people before it sinks itself. If saying 'no more' is an issue because you don't want to appear selfish then you'll have to deal with the fact that you all sink and drown...and then you'd be responsible for something far worse imo.
What's that then?
What is the something far worse that will happen if we continue to process claims here?

All laudable aims, but I doubt the existence of the money tree. The UK also has a problem with low wages, of course, and the cynic in me suspects that a massive crackdown on migration (as well as refusal to address childcare costs etc.) is to force a much earlier flatlining of population growth than previously predicted. This would send wages, and therefore the tax take, higher. This would be in line with the ideology of the more right wing of the government.

I believe they are not being sent there to be processed. They are being handed to Rwanda but the UK will pay Rwanda what we would have spent on them in the UK - we do not then consider their applications to the UK so it is different from the Australian system and they are free to move around Rwanda etc

We have 1m illegal immigrants in the UK and think Rwanda are expecting to take about a few hundred so it sounds like this is just window dressing . If we were going to send the 1m there that would be a different matter.

@marshabradyo gosh, I have no idea what the answer might be. I think the rise in nationalism around the world is an indicator of the direction in which things are currently heading, unfortunately.

It's genius.
Rwanda is a beautiful and fascinating country.

@Xenia Do you have a source for that 1 million? The UNHCR gives the following numbers:

According to UNHCR statistics, as of mid-2021 there were 135,912 refugees, 83,489 pending asylum cases and 3,968 stateless persons in the UK. The vast majority of refugees – 4 out of 5 – stay in their region of displacement, and consequently are hosted by developing countries. Turkey now hosts the highest number of refugees with 3.7 million, followed by Colombia with 1.7 million.

www.unhcr.org/uk/asylum-in-the-uk.html

“Illegal immigrants” is not one of the official terms used to describe refugees or asylum seekers, nor should it be. As has been covered on this and similar threads, it’s not illegal to seek asylum in the UK. Do you perhaps mean people who have overstayed their visa? A source and the correct terminology would be appreciated.

@Alonelonelylonersbadidea

It's genius. Rwanda is a beautiful and fascinating country.

Copied from the other thread, but these people certainly didn’t think there was anything beautiful or fascinating about there experience in Rwanda as an asylum seeker.

From Israel’s “voluntary resettlement scheme” to Rwanda:

“All interviewees testified that upon landing in Rwanda the travel document produced by Israel, the only identity document in their possession, was taken away. They were transferred to a guarded hotel and were prevented, under threat, from leaving. None of them were given the opportunity to apply for asylum. Lacking identity documents and exposed to robberies and threats they were forced to embark on dangerous journeys.”

“Their lack of identity documents exposed them to robberies, threats and arrest, leading them to embark on a dangerous journey that included passing through South Sudan, Sudan and Libya in search of protection. Throughout the journey, the interviewees were subjected to human trafficking, incarceration, the threat of forcible deportation to Eritrea, harsh conditions of starvation, violence, slavery in torture camps in Libya and a dangerous crossing of the Mediterranean Sea from Libya to Europe.”

“The testimonies here portray a clear picture: the promises made by Israel to those ‘voluntarily’ departing to Rwanda and Uganda, which included granting legal status and protection in Rwanda and Uganda, were not kept.”

www.law.ox.ac.uk/research-subject-groups/centre-criminology/centreborder-criminologies/blog/2018/10/moving-under

No doubt Rwanda is a beautiful and fascinating country, to visit voluntarily, in the knowledge you're going home again. Are people being deliberately obtuse?

I also wondered whose pockets this scheme would line… one of their friends’ no doubt? Possibly a company that doesn’t exist yet, again? Terrible that this has even been dreamt up by our government. Also serious ethical questions over Rwanda & corruption- tax payers money flowing into a corrupt government? The whole thing is insane. Minor point in comparison to the suffering this scheme will cause- global warming & we will be flying people over there? It’s really insane.

The UK has far fewer asylum applications than EU countries. But so many people don't want to believe this.twitter.com/AlexTaylorNews/status/1514720698685603855?t=6O8uzET_PnzP-ahuFnhN6g&s=19

Absolutely @midsomermurderess
I was just pointing that out in the other Rwanda thread. This UNHCR link is a good summary.

www.unhcr.org/uk/asylum-in-the-uk.html

Relevant info here:

In the year ending September 2021, Germany received the highest number of asylum applicants (127,730) in the EU+, followed by France (96,510). When compared with the EU+, the UK received the 4th largest number of applicants (44, 190 – including main applicants and dependents). This equates to 8% of the total asylum applicants across the EU+ and UK combined over that period, or the 18th largest intake when measured per head of population.

Germany, France, Spain and Italy accounted for around 70% of all first-time applicants in the EU-27. These figures include all asylum applicants, not just main applicants (i.e. including children and other dependents). World-wide around 85% of all refugees live in developing regions , not in wealthy industrialised countries, and 73% of refugees displaced abroad live in countries neighbouring their countries of origin.

People who don't like immigrants never bother to read the statistics about asylum seekers as then they would have to come up with a new narrative about why they don't want them here (which is usually racism but they don't want to say it).

Well, yes, @artisanbread, I think that is indeed the case.

It’s an absolute fucking disgrace. An occasion when those phrases like ‘appalled’ and ‘outraged’ are actually necessary.
Shame on us.

A disgusting proposal. Cruel and inhumane. Look at its inspiration in the off-shore "processing" of asylum seekers by the Australian government. A stain on the country's reputation.

www.hrw.org/news/2021/07/15/australia-8-years-abusive-offshore-asylum-processing

@Viviennemary

I think it will deter others from coming. We can't take everybody. If you rocked up on a boat into Australia or NZ you would be sent packing.

This. Would be a deterrent -why pay the people smugglers a fortune to them be shipped to Rwanda.

@ChiswickFlo why are you flagging up your local hospital poor statistics all the while agreeing with thousands more coming into the country????

@cakeorwine
Your statistics are totally irrelevant.
England is the most overcrowded large nation in Europe.
Why is this fact never addressed?
The UK is one of the most nature-depleted countries in the world and with no end to population growth in sight, pressure on wildlife, housing, public services and resources will continue to grow.
Net migration plus asylum seekers and refugees has been the main driver of population change since the 1990s.
The government estimates the UK needs 200,000 new houses a year to meet growing demand. Some experts say 300,000.
An extra 750,000 school places will be needed in England by 2025 because of growing population.
Health care funding has not kept up with population growth and mortality rates from preventable and treatable causes are higher in the UK than in other European high-income countries.

Good grief. The levels of racism in this thread are outstanding. Anyone who thinks this is a good idea should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.

Woah! So because some agree with taking action to control population makes us 'racist' ? Time to stop playing that card and face the truths that if we carry on seemingly 'doing good' we will be denying our own children and grandchildren the opportunities we worked so hard to create....

@Spinachtastegud

Woah! So because some agree with taking action to control population makes us 'racist' ? Time to stop playing that card and face the truths that if we carry on seemingly 'doing good' we will be denying our own children and grandchildren the opportunities we worked so hard to create....

If it isn’t an issue of race, why aren’t Ukranians being flown to Rwanda? Why is no one asking for them to also join this scheme?