Karen

[strawberrydaquiari]

The use of Karen as an insult isn't going away is it?
I'm fed up. I feel silenced. I can't stand up to the insult without being accused of acting "like one" and being shut down.
It's everywhere and I hate it.

don’t think it’s right to use the name ‘Karen’ but the type of behaviour that is associated with the name should 100% be called out.

Then do it without using misogynistic slurs which are an actual women's name.

I’m not talking about on the Internet, I’m talking about in real life. You know, the place where the phrase started in the first place….
Makes me wonder how many people have actually heard the word used in real life and in what context in comparison to seeing people throw the word around willy nilly on the internet.

Then do it without using misogynistic slurs which are an actual women's name.

A misogynistic slur? A slur, really? What is it about using a woman’s name to call out a type of behaviour makes it a misogynistic slur? @Ereshkigalangcleg I genuinely would like to know

But @babywalker56 the term is not used to describe people (as you put it) who are acting entitled. It is specifically used to describe women and, more importantly, to shut them down by condensing them into a nagging caricature. Men aren't called Karen's. Some pp's have mentioned Kevin as an equivalent, but it really, really isn't. Karen has become a catch all term for older women who dare to express any objection to anything or who stick up for themselves. It beggars belief that anyone can't see this as misogynistic. Might as well be done with it and call them shrews, because that's basically what people are saying.

A misogynistic slur? A slur, really? What is it about using a woman’s name to call out a type of behaviour makes it a misogynistic slur?

Oh stop pretending to be stupid.

You know as well as everyone else on here that it's been adopted as a slur meaning a bolshy middle aged woman who should shut up. Because it's a woman's name. Christ, we even know what her hair is supposed to look like, that's how much thought people have put into developing this stereotype. Nobody who uses it is righteously "calling out" anything. They're using it as a slur to shut women up, and only women. We've had women on here who leave the dentist in intense pain because they're so absolutely terrified of being a "Karen" by staying and requesting more treatment.

It's the modern day equivalent of "scold", "nag", "virago", "harpy", take your pick. Just the go-to misogynistic insult for thick people in the 2020s. You don't gain any points for "calling out" anything by using it, and you certainly don't get any for pretending that the whole thing is beyond your wit.

@ClinkeyMonkey

But *@babywalker56 the term is not used to describe people (as you put it) who are acting entitled. It is specifically used to describe women* and, more importantly, to shut them down by condensing them into a nagging caricature. Men aren't called Karen's. Some pp's have mentioned Kevin as an equivalent, but it really, really isn't. Karen has become a catch all term for older women who dare to express any objection to anything or who stick up for themselves. It beggars belief that anyone can't see this as misogynistic. Might as well be done with it and call them shrews, because that's basically what people are saying.

No it hasnt the 'karens" that are shown are bullies having a temper tantrum often with racial overtones. Not strong women trying to make a point being shut down.

“ They're using it as a slur to shut women up, and only women.”

Which women, may I ask? I’ve never heard it use to shut “women” up. I’ve only ever heard it used to call out certain white women and their crap. Most white wines are not called Karens and most are not afraid to speak up and be assertive when they need to be.

The only ones who feel they are being made to shut up and the very ones that need to shut up and stop harassing innocent people with their nonsense.

@Bigfathairyones

Not wanting to set the cat among the pigeons here but if you've looked an any of the 'classic Karen' clips being shown on social media, does anyone think that their behaviour is just 'standing up for themselves'? Every 'Karen' example I've seen is of a woman whose behaviour is well into the unreasonable bracket. I would be happy to have a 'Keith' category for unreasonable behaviour from men, but I don't think we should be accepting the behaviour, even if the term offends.

Yes, I must admit, I've never seen a woman who is politely and assertively speaking up for herself labelled one.

It's always some entitled cunt making a retail worker's life hell from what I've seen.

@FOJN

I don’t understand how abusing women called Karen can be linked to a lynching in Mississippi 66 years ago.

1st rule of misogyny: Women are responsible for what men do.

The women in question used her privilege, and sex. She lied and contributed to the death on an innocent child. Her despicable behaviour led to a outrageous outcome. But not for herself. Sounds familiar.

I understand your frustration, its such a brainless dismissal. I'm reaching the no more fucks left to give stage. Its liberating.

I tried to explain to my teenage DD that it is misogyny, that she will be a middle aged woman one day, and she just laughed at me. I felt very sad at that.

@emuloc, didn’t she eventually admit, many many moons later that she lied? That poor 14 year old boy was murdered in the most horrendous way. If you visit the Smithsonian Museum his casket and a photo of his disfigured face is a constant reminding of what Karenism is all about. There are countless similar stories all over the world, including here. It’s even a matter if f academic and interest.

Misogynistic my foot. It’s only misogynistic when it affects certain women who never ever show solitary for any other women. They only have one image of a woman and only jump on their high horses for women who fit that particular image.

Which women, may I ask?

Whichever ones they want to shut up, of course. That's how these stereotypes work. Shut up and don't argue with me or you'll be a .

Bollocks is it used for the virtuous calling out of racism. That's just nonsense to try to give it an air of moral righteousness. Black women are called Karens all the time, we had a black woman on here talking about it (her nephew had used it on her).

If you can't make your point without weaponising sex and misogyny, it isn't worth making. Learn new words.

@Why2why Is it maybe a regional difference? I’ve only seen it used in your sense on Twitter. IRL I’ve only ever heard it in the other sense- eg my daughter and her friends calling a bob a “Karen cut” (meaning middle aged).

@DrSbaitso

Which women, may I ask?

Whichever ones they want to shut up, of course. That's how these stereotypes work. Shut up and don't argue with me or you'll be a .

Bollocks is it used for the virtuous calling out of racism. That's just nonsense to try to give it an air of moral righteousness. Black women are called Karens all the time, we had a black woman on here talking about it (her nephew had used it on her).

If you can't make your point without weaponising sex and misogyny, it isn't worth making. Learn new words.

I’ve never been called a Karen, it does not bother me in the slightest, I am assertive and speak up. Yet I’ve never been labelled a Karen. And I am a woman. No one else I know has been called a Karen or feels in danger of being called such. They too are extremely assertive. More so than me. They are women too.

We just don’t do the sort of Karen things that some women do.

The example upthread of a woman being called this at work when she asked someone to clear their papers from the photocopier is:

a. An example of the term being used in real life.
b. An example of the term being used outside the context of shopper/retail worker

@Why2why but being assertive is why people are now called a Karen , and how do you know you haven't people don't always do it to peoples faces

@emuloc

So the men who actually lynched Emmett aren’t in any way to blame?

I still don’t see the correlation between that incident 66 years ago and abusing women called Karen now. We all know atrocities have been committed throughout history up to and including the present in Ukraine. I can’t see how it helps to abuse women because of their name.

Gosh @Why2why if it hasn't happened to you or to anyone you know, then it can't possibly have happened. We can just end this thread now. Ta very much.

If someone's being racist, you can call them a racist arsehole or a shithead or a witless cretin or a hateful emetic. Look up the Shakespearean Insult Machine, it's a classic.

There is something pathetic about clinging to a misogynistic slur and complaining that people don't think you're morally righteous in using it. If you truly can't think of any other words to describe racist behaviour (as if that's what the Karen slur is generally used for, do me a sodding lemon), then take the opportunity to widen your vocabulary. There are much better insults out there that don't rely on misogyny.

I’ve never been called a Karen

Neither have I. So what?

@Why2Why, Yes she did admit to lying years later. Even then she did not seem too bothered or remorseful that her disgusting actions led to such violence on a poor black boy. I cried when I first came found out about it years ago. I could not believe that people could be so cruel to a child. I see the outrage and frothing on here regarding the use of the name Karen. How many people on here are okay with the term "Woke" being highjacked and turned into an insult though, eh.

@EV117

And yet on this thread we have a woman being called a Karen for asking a colleague to take his stuff off the photocopier.

Plus, trying to pretend that social media isn't real life is a bit (lot) silly.

[quote Squills]@emuloc

So the men who actually lynched Emmett aren’t in any way to blame?

I still don’t see the correlation between that incident 66 years ago and abusing women called Karen now. We all know atrocities have been committed throughout history up to and including the present in Ukraine. I can’t see how it helps to abuse women because of their name.[/quote]
Never mind, as Why"Why pointed out, you probably never will see the connection. Anyway of course the men who murdered Emmett, were to blame as well.

[quote Why2why]@emuloc, didn’t she eventually admit, many many moons later that she lied? That poor 14 year old boy was murdered in the most horrendous way. If you visit the Smithsonian Museum his casket and a photo of his disfigured face is a constant reminding of what Karenism is all about. There are countless similar stories all over the world, including here. It’s even a matter if f academic and interest.

Misogynistic my foot. It’s only misogynistic when it affects certain women who never ever show solitary for any other women. They only have one image of a woman and only jump on their high horses for women who fit that particular image.[/quote]
You make no mention of the men who actually killed Emmett.

I assume you’re American and life in the States is very different to the UK. Things have obviously changed considerably for black Americans since that terrible event in 1955… you had a black president which speaks volumes of what can be achieved.

You seem to want to lay the blame for past atrocities at the door of ‘certain’ women though. You mention solidarity yet surely the Karen insult is divisive.

@emuloc

If the connection is so blindingly obvious to you why don’t you share it?