I regret moving (back) to Australia

[GreenestGrass]

DP and I are both Australian. We did the typical young person thing of living in the UK and had the opportunity to extend our stay through work sponsorships and make it a more permanent move. For various reasons we decided to come back home to Australia, but as time goes by both of us feel increasingly regretful of our decision for a few reasons:

-Lower cost of living. I'm not saying living in the UK is cheap but my goodness, Australia is expensive. It really hit home for us when we moved back and were hit with prices for things.
-Lifestyle - we absolutely loved being able to travel easily and the access to different parts of the world. Australia feels so far away from everywhere and again, travelling internationally from here is super expensive. Cities in Australia also feel quite 'samey' and lacking character in comparison to the UK.
-Professional opportunities - with the much smaller population size, professional opportunities here in Australia just can't compare to what we had over there.

These are just a few of the reasons but overall we just preferred living there to here, and now there's not much we can do about it as it's unlikely we'd be able to start over again and also get the work permissions we'd need to legally work in the UK again.

Has anyone ever felt similar regrets? I'm doing my best to enjoy the things life in Australia has to offer but it does feel like we missed our chance a bit here :(

No such thing as Australia as you describe here, it's states and territories, so what happened in Sydney, and came so close to happening in Melbourne is down to states, sometimes cities.

Brisbane is also a bit of a nanny state if you want to divide it into states and territories. Each state and territory has its own set of
patrimonial tendencies, so collectively yes, Australia is relatively a nanny state compared to most of Europe.

People dont speed ? I had a clean license in the UK for twentyyears and actually got banned in oz because i couldn’t get my head around 60kmph on the motorways 🤣

@echt

Compounded by the fact that in Australia (and in NZ) You. Drive. Everywhere. Nowhere is within walking distance and cycling is considered a bit weird

Simple not true, especially the bit about cycling.

Absolutely true compared with an average part of the UK, probably due to the low urban density and the sheer distance you have to travel in comparison.

I've traveled on Melbourne public transport. It trundles along quite charmingly but I wouldn't want to commute on it.

Compounded by the fact that in Australia (and in NZ) You. Drive. Everywhere. Nowhere is within walking distance and cycling is considered a bit weird

Simple not true, especially the bit about cycling

I live in NZ and don't drive. Stangely enough I manage and rarely need to rely on anyone with a car. Agree about the cycling - thousands of cyclists here, it most certainly is not considered "a bit weird".

@echt

Compounded by the fact that in Australia (and in NZ) You. Drive. Everywhere. Nowhere is within walking distance and cycling is considered a bit weird

Simple not true, especially the bit about cycling.

Ha, true. I think a lot of the views on here regarding Australia are several decades out of date. It's got a long way to go, but there are cycle lanes appearing everywhere.

I think it’s easy to think “when I visited this happened/it was like this and therefore it’s still like this”. Like the racism thing - Australia used to be awful towards indigenous people but that seems to have totally changed these days and you would be given very short shrift if you referred to “bloody abbos” these days.
Plus of course the people who just get things wildly wrong. Eg the speed limit on motorways is not 60kph, it’s 90 or 100 (although I do agree that they are very strict on speeding/parking fines but it’s easy to avoid them if you just follow the rules).

@SquirrelG

Compounded by the fact that in Australia (and in NZ) You. Drive. Everywhere. Nowhere is within walking distance and cycling is considered a bit weird

Simple not true, especially the bit about cycling

I live in NZ and don't drive. Stangely enough I manage and rarely need to rely on anyone with a car. Agree about the cycling - thousands of cyclists here, it most certainly is not considered "a bit weird".

Australian and New Zealand cities are, with the exception of Wellington, low density and generally made up of single-story detached houses with a bit of garden. In recent years there has been infill housing in some of the older (ie pre 1990 neighbourhoods) but the infill is also generally single story. Outside the very centre of cities or in some very small towns the only shop within walking distance of the average house will be a dairy (what would in the UK be called a newsagent) and some fast food takeaways. The nearest supermarket will be about 5ks away and the bus will be every 30 minutes.

In the bigger urban areas flats are going in, and there is little doubt that it represents a big cultural change because it's something people comment on. A comment I've heard very often is how intolerable it is that cities are running out of space. I suspect these people are likely to believe their cities are as crowded as those in the old world.

But with the probable exception of Wellington, which is built in steep sided valleys the cities remain very low density compared to just about anywhere in Europe. Lockdown in 2020 was quite tolerable for me because I could relax in my (by UK standards very large) garden.

As for cycling: infrastructure has improved over the last 20 years. I even read that Auckland had some of the best in the world. It was an American survey iirc. The reality is that ratepayers hate spending on cycle infrastructure and Auckland isn't safe to cycle round other than on those paths. I should know - I did it long enough. Cycling is generally a sports pursuit. There may be thousands of people who occasionally get on a bike but once again, in comparison with the UK / Europe it's not common. Frankly I'm a bit lucky to be alive.

Driving is how people get around here. I also know people who don't drive. There aren't many of them.

The car is king in the Antipodes. That's the reason why both Australia and NZ are such high per-capita polluters. I know - I've lived here long enough.

@TomPinchyou’re generalising quite a bit! In melbourne I’ve lived in the north and several south east suburbs and I’ve never lived anywhere I can’t walk to 2 supermarkets, not this ‘dairy’ word I’ve never heard of and I’m melburnian.
Also, you not wanting to commute on public transport doesn’t change the fact that most people I know commute. I work in the city, so why would I drive there? Out of my team at work of 5, regularly cycle into work, coming from completely different compass points. That’s normal life in melb for me, I know people without a car.

There are a lot of people commenting on this thread who are giving very out of date or plainly wrong information about Australia.

@boronia

There are a lot of people commenting on this thread who are giving very out of date or plainly wrong information about Australia.

I know. 😂

Cycling is generally a sports pursuit. There may be thousands of people who occasionally get on a bike but once again, in comparison with the UK / Europe it's not common. Frankly I'm a bit lucky to be alive.

It may not be common where you are, but I can assure you it is quite common in some parts of NZ. Where, incidentally, are all these people who are cycling in the UK? The number of threads on MN where people are told they HAVE to drive, it is impossible to live without a car, suggests otherwise. I have several friends in the UK - not one of them has ever mentioned riding a bike!

I live in a suburb 10 ks from the CBD in Melbourne. I can walk to the chemist, doctor, supermarket, vet, library and loads of restaurants, cafes and specialist shops. I take the train to the city to work.i have a car but only use it every few days.

Don't worry it will good.
I know two friends who lived in UK for 4-5 years and then moved to Australia. They are happier there probably because of the weather and they can do lot of outdoor things. One of these friends even went under depression in London because of the cold and damp weather most of the times. Yes there are lots of other good points also but weather can really effect someone's mental health.

@TomPinch

Absolutely true compared with an average part of the UK, probably due to the low urban density and the sheer distance you have to travel in comparison.

I've traveled on Melbourne public transport. It trundles along quite charmingly but I wouldn't want to commute on it.

It depends on where you live in Melbourne and where you need to go, I suppose. My DD has lived there for 4.5 years and and doesn't have a car. The public transport system has been great for her.

@SquirrelG
Nearly everyone I know owns a bike! Most kids round here cycle (or walk/scoot) to school. We have really good cycle lanes along the coast and also inland, with beautiful views away from the road, so it’s very accessible. My dc learned to ride their bike aged 3 which isn’t uncommon amongst they friends. Cycling is def big in my town! (UK)

@Redmountain356 - it's good to hear that kids, and adults, are riding bikes. My original post was actually in reply to a poster who said that cycling is considered a bit weird in Australia/NZ and I was saying that I have never met anyone who considered it weird. Another poster who appears to live in Auckland doesn't seem to understand that what happens in Auckland may not be representative of the whole country! I don't cycle myself, but I walk a lot, and would far rather see kids walking/cycling than being driven everywhere.

I think there are benefits both ways but it is easy to feel the grass is greener. I've got two friends who returned circa 5-6 years ago from Aus and so bitterly regret doing so. They were starting to look at returning but Covid intervened. They are still looking but the time that has passed is making it harder due to kids ages, although they are still thinking of returning.

They have a whole list of what is wrong with the U.K. (many of them true) but of course you have described other things negative about Aus

@Fraaahnces

Sorry but Australia rejects ideas. All ideas get sold overseas. Virtually all of our intellectual future is lost from the moment they graduate as there are no prospects here. Most of our drinking water is owned by American companies (above and below ground), most of our beef is Chinese, Canadian and American-owned. Our arable land is almost entirely built on thanks to the ever-increasing need for identical McMansions and we don’t have lakes and river systems in the middle of the country to keep going. Just a giant, fucking desert with a big rock. We’ve fucked the rivers we do have in the name of “progress” and we’ve doctored the electoral system to ensure that democracy will never be a thing, we’ve ignored all advice regarding climate change, we have the hole in the ozone layer circling over the southern cities and causing serious impacts on our health system, we make token efforts to acknowledge our Indigenous people at every football match, but we’re not really doing much to catch up with the rest of the western world and sign a treaty and ditch the farsical celebration of the day of invasion that has only been a national holiday since 1994 anyway.

Unfortunately a lot of this is true.

Many pastoral landholdings such as Cubbie Station are owned or part-owned by foreign companies, so even tho the beef is Australian-grown much of the revenue from its sale goes offshore. Coca-Cola Amatil has a big share of the soft drink market, including local mineral water such as Mount Franklin. McMansions -- don't get me started. In the past 30 years Melbourne has lost almost all its market gardens to treeless housing estates. Melbourne's tree canopy coverage is less than 13 per cent.

Australia Day aka Invasion Day seems like some ghastly bogan-fest from the Crocodile Dundee era.

Australia has much to recommend it, but when it comes to looking after people and managing our resources we could be doing a lot better.

Thank you OP for starting this thread. I’ve lived here in the UK for 15+ years and, with covid killing off the main advantages (easy travel to mainland Europe, and that I’ve not been able to get back to Aus) I’ve been feeling really resentful about living here.

It’s been really helpful to see the grass isn’t always better (ain’t never gonna be greener in Aus!). I’ve already accepted I’ll probably never feel at home in either place. Whilst missing a lot of the cultural references that friends here grew up with, so much has changed back home that I’d struggle to easily fit in there, either.

There's a lot of info online about cycling friendly places in world. Neither UK, USA nor Australia get close to commended.

Netherlands, Japan, Germany, Denmark are places with truly lots cyclists. Cycling share by female% is especially indicative of a cycling culture: highest in NE & JP. I doubt it's coincidence that 3/4 of those countries also have much less obesity than other high income nations. ps: Japan is hilly, rainy and hot.

Yes to Invasion day. The ignorance of Aussies waving flags about around bbqs on a day when the slaughter and dispossession of Aborigines began.

@Bringonthebloodydrama

Yes to Invasion day. The ignorance of Aussies waving flags about around bbqs on a day when the slaughter and dispossession of Aborigines began.

Literally not one person I know celebrates January 26. It's a day of shame and sadness. Please stop labelling everyone in Australia as being the same.

My local council has a healing ceremony by the river every year on Jan 26th. Led by Aboriginal elders, it is a very moving time of reflection. I look forward to it every year to help make sense of the day. Despite our awful federal government things are moving and changing in Australia.

@lljkk

There's a lot of info online about cycling friendly places in world. Neither UK, USA nor Australia get close to commended.

Netherlands, Japan, Germany, Denmark are places with truly lots cyclists. Cycling share by female% is especially indicative of a cycling culture: highest in NE & JP. I doubt it's coincidence that 3/4 of those countries also have much less obesity than other high income nations. ps: Japan is hilly, rainy and hot.

What kind of cycling are you talking about here, though? Recreational cycling? Cycling to work? Kids' cycling? There's a difference between the culture of these and how an urban space might be set up to suit.

You've never been near or around the Church nightclub in Clapham on Oz day then, which starts at 10am and usually ends up with Aussies rolling about in their own vomit.