PIP Turned down - decision is based on absolute opposite of what I said! Help!

[ItsDisneyBitch]

I had an hour call with PIP Assessor for DD, the DLA has been stopped as of this month.

The summary given has completely glossed over all the problems DD has! And contradicted all the points I have made.

Has anyone appealed successfully?

Definitely appeal but yes in that example you’ve said she can cook. Even getting the cereal is an example of her being able to cook (which seems ridiculous but that’s how they’ll read it).

I get the highest rates of pip ongoing / indefinitely. I have a lot of weird and rare conditions and provided a lot of medical evidence but I think what really clinched it was just being very “no I can’t do that - if I tried to do that I’d be in pain for days and have to be on bed rest” type stuff. Obviously it depends on the conditions your dd has (my son receives dla for autism so I know the forms aren’t always good for neurological conditions as they’re more geared towards physical ones) but I think you just have to be really blunt about things.

Incidentally one of the things I didn’t score anything on was help with nutrition even though I often have days when I can’t eat solid foods - they see a liquid diet as absolutely fine and not an indicator of health needs even though I’m under a specialist relating to it.

It so difficult. We had dps last year. His Consultant gave us lots of advice.

Including, saying something like you said there is (to them) saying she can cook.

Its so so difficult.

On my mums, they blatantly lied and said her epilepsy medication was something she just bought over the counter. Mum took her medication to the meeting and gave it to the woman to write down. So it wasn't that she got it wrong.

They also said they observed mum. Walking unaided unto the building. They didn't. Dad pulled up outside, got her to a bench and then parked the car and came back for her.

She couldn't take her walker as they do assessments in an old listed building where they can't make changes to make it accessible for people with disabilities.

I had the same problem - as everyone lies and exaggerates in order to get anywhere you have to do the same. Very annoying.

You'll need to put in for a mandatory reconsideration. If that fails you'll need to go tribunal. It can take months and months.

We did this for my best mate a few years ago, and went from a zero award to medium for care and high for mobility.

Of course, she had her most recent phone assessment last week, so we made it very clear we'd go to tribunal again if they tried this again. We'll see.....

The one time she tried to cook I had to talk her through the oven and leave visual aid and a FaceTime to help

That needs to be left out, you need to describe how things are on the worst day,so no she's can't cook.

@DuchessofAnkh22

I had the same problem - as everyone lies and exaggerates in order to get anywhere you have to do the same. Very annoying.

I see things the other way round.

They pick and poke at what people say. They take the upper end of what people can do on the rare occassion they have a really good day. So people have to stick to only what happens on their worst days. And not mention anything else.

I vast majority are not lying or exaggerating. They just can mention a very good, but rare day. That's nor because others are lying or exaggerating.

I've appealed DLA twice and went from nothing to middle rate care and low mobility. On the MRs I was very specific about what my daughter couldn't do and what I'd expect a typical teenager to be able to do.

She's now on enhanced PIP but the report was completely incorrect. It reads that she has no problem with communication, despite the fact that they never spoke to her because she's mute most of the time, and certainly couldn't handle a phone call! She should have got at least 10 points for that alone, if not more. She did, however, manage to scrape the minimum amount of points for enhanced, so fortunately I didn't have to go through MR again.

The system sucks, the assessors lie, and they make it incredibly difficult for disabled people. It needs a huge reform.

Saying that she can cook with a visual aid and a facetime, is sadly saying she can cook.

Instead say no, Dd is unable to prepare or cook a simple meal. I cook for her as she is unable to. If I didn't cook she'd only be able to eat bisucits/crisps/dry cereal.

They consider a simple meal something something like soup heated on the hob.

It's important to read up on the descriptors they use, and there's a couple of great facebook groups that have loads of info and support on them. Eg it only counts as she can do something if she can do it more than 50% of the time, safely, reliably, and in a timely manner (or something along those words). And look up what they consider a meal, cereal doesn't count, it has to be certain types of food cooked from scratch, and at least twice a day if I remember correctly. This needs done for each descriptor, it's exhausting but worth it, and the facebook groups will make it easier if you can join them

And it's also worth checking with any charities to do with her condition(s) as sometimes they can give advice or even help with the forms

I've sat with a couple of people as they've done the assessment and each time at the beginning we've said. I hope you don't mind, but we'll be recording the assessment.

A couple of times when they've rambled a bit, I've asked them to clarify - so "June, in summary, can you confirm to the assessor whether you can cook a meal (not heat up a meal) unassisted."

Request a copy of the report. The next step is mandatory consideration.

If she takes medication put a copy of the medication in with the appeal
If she is not capable of making a meal it stands to reason that she would also not be capable of taking her medication safely and reliably either and needs someone to give her medication for her safety and reliability.

It does not stand to reason!

I can't cook or hold anything hot due to the documented risk of burns (because of my disabilities). I take my many, many medications promptly, reliably, safely etc.

Please don't assume things about people with disabilities just because YOU think something stands to reason. We are all different, and all human.

Would recommend a site called Work and Benefits. About Fifteen pounds for a year. Loads of info. They have a lot of experienced people on there who work as advisers and know the system.
Basically you are are playing a game blind and they made up the rules and are happy to cheat you. This site will help you play on a level field.
You should be able to trust the government to play fair and you cannot.
Get copies of your medical records to prove you are on painkillers etc.
One time they blatantly broke their own rules on a home assessment, I involved my mp and they changed immediately.
Disgusting that people with problems have to spend weeks on this nonsense
Before anyone says it Iknow they have to be careful and ensure that the right people are paid. Ur you cannot defend the blatant lies told a ou op, myself and many others. On my appeal I had a home visit from a lovely compassionate assessor and was awarded maximum rates for maximum time. What a waste of time and money to get so many wrong
Keep strong and organised and you will win, my heart goes out to those not strong enough to fight the system

I help with applications and appeals. I tell people not to use the word won’t but to say can’t or doesn’t instead. Won’t can be taken as could but doesn’t want to. Whereas what you actually mean is due to her disability she can’t make food (whether thats for physical or mental health stopping her)

@Adeleskirts

I think you’ve tried to be too honest and given too much info. The example you’ve given is basically you have answered yes she can cook.

You’ve said you left her some pics showed her how to use the oven, left her alone and she cooked you just FaceTimed her, but she did it. So saying she can cook isn’t contradictory, I’m sorry. After that response it would be wrong of the assessor to say no she can’t.

The question also wasn’t will she or not. It was can she, and you’ve responded with yes, with thr right support she can. If you had just said no, it would have left no room for ambiguity, but I’m not sure no, is factually correct, as you have said you showed her how to use the oven, left some pics and she cooked, if she wasn’t able, you’d not have done this.

Agree with this. She has done it with an aid. PIp looks at whether someone can do an activity reliably, repeatedly, within a reasonable timeframe and safely.

@MrsPelligrinoPetrichor

The one time she tried to cook I had to talk her through the oven and leave visual aid and a FaceTime to help

That needs to be left out, you need to describe how things are on the worst day,so no she's can't cook.

You do not just describe a worst day !!!

@ItsDisneyBitch

An example is this; can she prepare a meal. My answer was she won’t eat or eats cereal unless someone can cook for her. I am the only person allowed near her food or she won’t eat. The one time she tried to cook I had to talk her through the oven and leave visual aid and a FaceTime to help.

They took this as she can cook and handle food. Well she can’t!

Your answer wasn’t very clear. You should have said that she cannot cook or prepare a meal and goes hungry or eats cold cereal until one can be prepared for her. That she has attempted to cook with visual aid, face time and supervision by you in the kitchen, but was still unable to prepare a meal.

If she was able to cook with aids and supervision, you say that. You still get points if can only cook with supervision for safety reasons.

I agree your answer says she can cook or prepare a meal with aids.

@MrsPelligrinoPetrichor

The one time she tried to cook I had to talk her through the oven and leave visual aid and a FaceTime to help

That needs to be left out, you need to describe how things are on the worst day,so no she's can't cook.

No! You do describe worst days but you have to describe most days as PIP is largely based on how you are most days. Only describing worst days, if they occur less than half the time, can lead to being done for benefit fraud. As in if you say you cannot walk 200m and then you’re caught walking your dog three times a week.....

I distinctly recall saying she never dresses appropriately for the weather and has to be reminded to wear clean/appropriate clothes.

They have come back saying she has no problem with clothes and dresses appropriately.

I know I never said this!!

I called them, got cut off have drafted an appeal letter and requested a copy of the report.

The thing is OP that there is a difference in scale between things. You are saying she can't cook, yet she you stated she actually can with aids, and without someone there. There has to be a difference between her capabilities and someone who cannot ever be left alone for a minute let alone in the kitchen. You say she finds choosing appropriate clothing difficult, but she can and will get dressed physically, and that's different from someone who wouldn't be capable of even realising that you need to get dressed or be able to put on an item of clothing, whether it be due to physical or mental difficulties, or both. So in this case saying she has no difficulty wasn't correct, but saying no, she can't dress herself wouldn't be either.
I understand that it's frustrating but I don't agree with simply saying no, or saying someone can't do something because occasionally they can't. I believe wholeheartedly that there should be money and appropriate support available to those who need it, and it sounds like you do, but it has to be on a sliding scale, and it isn't, or shouldn't be a case of knowing how to work the system to get the most out it.

@Turningpurple She couldn't take her walker as they do assessments in an old listed building where they can't make changes to make it accessible for people with disabilities.

That is absolutely infuriating. There is no shortage of empty commercial property in this country and absolutely no excuse to choose an inaccessible building in which to carry out assessments of people with disabilities. It's impossible to see how this isn't a deliberate strategy to trip people up.

They do this all the time and rely on people just accepting it.

You need to appeal and you need to inform them you will be recording everything.

My advice for everyone having their pip review is to record it.

Never just rely on them recording what you've said.

Pls go to this website

www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/forum/10-dla-esa-queries-results/138780-pip-tribunal?utm_source=iContact&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=Benefits%20and%20Work&utm_content=V2%2023%20March%202022%20newsletter