Why is food in schools so bad the U.K.?

[workwoes123]

This may count as a TAAT but it’s more a thread inspired by a thread .

I’m British, I remember fairly crap school dinners in the 1980s. fizzy juice on tap, chips most days. But that was 30 years and an obesity crisis ago.

I live in France now and my kids are in french schools. There are no snacks, no breakfasts, no vending machines, no play pieces. School dinner is a salad starter, a main course with meat / fish / chicken plus veg and carbs, followed by cheese / yoghurt and fruit / occasional dessert. That’s it, for a school day that starts at 8am and finishes at 4:30pm. Today the menu was:

Green salad / tomato pasta salad / beetroot salad
Beef stew / cod in curry sauce with mashed potatoes and mixed vegetables
Cheese or yoghurt
Fruit or isles flottantes (meringue on custard).

I’ve just been on a thread where children in a U.K. secondary school are being offered chocolate croissants for breakfast, bacon / sausage sarnies as a snack (a snack!), iced buns as an afternoon snack. Is this normal? All of this is in addition to a the actual school lunch? Why are the children so hungry that they need snacks as well as a meal?

Did Jamie Oliver not sort all this out? I had this vague idea that school food in the U.K. had improved since I were a lass - has it?

Underfunding. Cultural attitudes.

Michael Gove got rid of it all, the healthy schools stuff.

I think time is a huge issue.
Lots of schools have gone down from longer lunch times- like an hour, to 40/ 30 minutes. Notice to eat properly in that.

I'm in Scotland and that's not the norm in our local secondary schools

The food at my DS's school is brilliant. It isn't three courses, he doesn't need it, but he gets a hot, freshly cooked meal every day, and if he doesn't fancy the menu there's a large selection of salads, pastas, jacket potatoes.
DS has toast or sometimes pancakes for breakfast, but there's also cereals, yogurt, fresh fruit.

This was the menu in our school this week

Because that’s what the parents want. Jamie Oliver tried to improve it but parents by and large didn’t want to change it.

I don’t think they’ve massively improved. My primary school aged son often has school dinners and will get something like sausage roll and chips, pasta, hot dog, curry, chicken nuggets etc. Or if he doesn’t like the main course he can have jacket potato or a cheese or ham sandwich. Pudding is normally a cake or cookie of some kind. Up to Year 2 they used to get a piece of fruit or a carrot at break at least. He can take something in now but doesn’t normally bother.

Part of the problem is that smaller schools like his don’t have a kitchen so all food is delivered in pre-made. If the delivery van is delayed for any reason the kids have to just wait for lunch (one time it didn’t arrive at all and the teachers had to drive to a supermarket to buy bread and cheese and make the kids sandwiches)

The funding allocated for kids’ lunches is also a contributory factor. It’s much cheaper to provide a load of carbs and sugar than a decent amount of protein, fruit and veg. Plus the kids will eat it as culturally that’s what they’re used to

Parents wouldn't go for it for one, remember when Jamie Oliver started the food thing and parents literally pushed burgers and chips through the fences? I'm not saying everyone's that ignorant but there's a big majority of children that couldn't possibly eat salad.
Also underfunding at a massive level.

@dementedpixie

This was the menu in our school this week

OMG that is atrocious!!!

Depends on the school tbh. The food at my sons was lovely, they had home made soup as a starter each day, something like pasta bake, veggie crumble or curry for lunch. Every Friday they had fish and chips. There was a salad bar they could have as much as they wanted from and they had a dessert each day of either yogurt or cake and custard type affairs..... They actually cooked a lot of vegetarian meals but they were so tasty ds usually opted for them. I ended up begging for the veggie crumble recipe it was so good.

It's just a shame it isn't the same nationwide

I studied my undergrads in France.
Lunch and diner were served in the uni dining halls. 2.5 to 3 euros for each meal, went down to 1 euro if you were on benefits.

Each meal compromised of a starter, generally we had the choice between two salads.
A main dish with meat or fish (unless vegetarian), vegetables, potatoes rice or pasta.
Dessert was either a piece of fruit, a piece of cheese or a cake and water.

As children we used to get a three course meal too, although we did have breakfast (baguette with butter and jam tartine or occasionally a croissant or pain perdu (French toast made of baguette).
Dinner would be made at home and would be very light, probably just soup.

I think in the UK dinner tends to be the main meal and lunch a light one. It quite surprised me when I first came here

School food must vary wildly. DS' school has a hot meat/fish meal with veg, a veggie option and a choice of sandwiches, plus fruit or no-nut cereal bar.

The last three have been lasagne & salad, roast pork with potatoes & broccoli/peas, and breaded haddock with chips, peas & hollandaise.

DCs are allowed to take a snack for morning break, which can be anything as long as nut-free.

Oh and we did have snacks! Generally ‘fun’ cheese like string cheese, babybel or does tiny breadsticks you dipped in Philadelphia or The Laughing Cow cheese or chocolate biscuits

Every Friday they had fish and chips

You write that like it’s a good thing: am I missing something here? It’s tasty yes, it’s also a portion of protein encased in fried carbs, with fried carbs on the side isn’t it? Shouldn’t that be a once in a while, treat lunch? I think we get chips once per term here.

@whattodo2019

My daughter's is very similar to that menu tbh

But why is it like this? When there is an obesity crisis in the U.K.? Isn’t it an obvious thing to target?

@workwoes123

But why is it like this? When there is an obesity crisis in the U.K.? Isn’t it an obvious thing to target?

My husband told me most of the food he got when he was at school was pizza, fries or deep fried chicken/fish.

He was so shocked when he saw what we used to eat at school.

This is why we are the most obese country in Europe. We have just got used to eating that way.

I would assume because the govt really doesn't give a shit about the average child's health and long term well being. Schools budgets are decimated. I don't know how the food funding works exactly, but if it's like anything else in education then the people at the top signing off the catering contracts are making a nice fat profit while the school head and bursar desperately juggles everything to ensure they can afford both food and staff.

What you describe is dreadful.

I'm 72 and school meals were appalling in my day. Horrible, tasteless stewed meat with fat and gristle, no seasoning. Mashed potato with great lumps, stinking cabbage and swede. Liver and bacon in flavourless gravy. The only day we had anything edible was Friday when fish and chips was served. There was pudding with watery custard. Everything smelled awful. What's more, we were forced to eat it (though I managed to avoid much of the time). I can remember girls crying at the table with a teacher standing over them, making them eat.

I was glad to take a packed lunch after a while.

You'd think education authorities would have learned by now.

@blyn72

What you describe is dreadful.

I'm 72 and school meals were appalling in my day. Horrible, tasteless stewed meat with fat and gristle, no seasoning. Mashed potato with great lumps, stinking cabbage and swede. Liver and bacon in flavourless gravy. The only day we had anything edible was Friday when fish and chips was served. There was pudding with watery custard. Everything smelled awful. What's more, we were forced to eat it (though I managed to avoid much of the time). I can remember girls crying at the table with a teacher standing over them, making them eat.

I was glad to take a packed lunch after a while.

You'd think education authorities would have learned by now.

That’s appalling

@MintJulia

School food must vary wildly. DS' school has a hot meat/fish meal with veg, a veggie option and a choice of sandwiches, plus fruit or no-nut cereal bar.

The last three have been lasagne & salad, roast pork with potatoes & broccoli/peas, and breaded haddock with chips, peas & hollandaise.

DCs are allowed to take a snack for morning break, which can be anything as long as nut-free.

What you describe sounds really nice, Mint. Your son is fortunate to be served such good fare.

DC at secondary school. FSM. No menu available for parents to view, can only see choices made afterwards, in an app.

Lunchtimes are short and staggered so if a 1.30pm break (I'm told), there's not much choice left.

2 different types of cheese and tomato pizza available. One at break, one at lunch. My child often has both in one day .
As an alternative will pick a cheese and tomato panini (same thing).
Occasionally chicken burger or tuna baguette.
Once in a blue moon fish and chips on a Friday.
Occasional iced bun, toasted teacake or butterscotch tart,

It's total rubbish. Suspect there are better alternatives but not chosen by my D.C

@NoSquirrels

Underfunding. Cultural attitudes.

That’s it.

The amount to spend per child is shocking.
Children won’t eat half of it.
Parents support the children in not eating it.