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My son won't go to school.. im in shit for it

427 replies

Notoschool · 25/01/2022 10:31

My son is 14. He's been refusing school since around September. He's probably been 5 or 6 times since. He gives lots of different reasons such as he does not like the teacher . Or he feels anxious in the class. He hates the lesson. His reasons seem to change.

He has been self harming by cutting himself. He's been offered counselling at school.but as hes not going to school that's not happening. We have asked for help from camhs that was refused. So we have appealed. We found another counselling/support service for young people they are giving him 3 sessions. And that ends. As they are reducing their services. At the moment we have some support from early help but apparently that comes to a close in around 3 weeks.

My son has been very aggressive to the point he scares me. He's done things like smash up the doors in the house put holes in a partition wall. He's also verbally aggressive.

Recently the school offered him part time time table. To start at 11.15 . He agreed with this . Apart from the Monday where he wanted to start at lunchtime. The school refused this . But I really stood up for ds . As I thought this was better than not going at all. I agree its not right but surely a step in the right direction. His body language had changed and his tone. I really thought he was going to do it . So he went to school on the Friday. Come Monday He's refusing again I actually agued his point with the school so now it's made me look really bad and now he's made it impossible for me to have any valued say in a meeting that's going to happen in a few days.

Hes always asking for money to top his phone up. For food when he's out. Or just general things that teens often want . He wanted money Friday. I said once I know your at school I will transfer you money. Then on Tuesday as long as you have been to school on the Monday and Tuesday. I will top up your phone. But he did not stick to this agreement. So I have not topped up his phone. He told me how selfish I am . And said to me things like: "you only have to do a simple thing. It's like you want me to cut." He has said several similar things.

I'm actually frightened that because I'm refusing to give him money or top up his phone he's going to become very aggressive later on.

The school have told me there is going to be a meeting the local authorities will be there. I have been told I can get a large fine. Could get a tag or even go to prison . My son has told me he does not care. I'm told the law says its my responsibility to get him to school but no one can actually tell me how I can get him in school. He's 14 and 6ft tall I can't physically get him there.

I'm really scared of this whole situation. But I feel totally trapped in the situation and don't know what to do. My son just won't engage.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
HotPenguin · 25/01/2022 14:12

Op have you spoken to SENDIASS? They can advise you on how to approach this meeting and on what your rights are. Has your son seen the GP? I would have thought the GP could make a diagnosis of anxiety or depression and might be able to offer medication. If he's self harming I would consider medication at least until he can access proper help.

oakleaffy · 25/01/2022 14:13

@Notoschool
My word, Sadly your son has learned to manipulate you good and proper.
The threats
The violence

I’d call the police.
I know of two cases like this where the mother was at her absolute wits end, and in both cases they called police.

It definitely worked in these two cases.
Teens KNOW when they can manipulate, and you HAVE to start saying NO!

If your doors get stoved in, call the police.

Stop pandering to him.

The buck has to stop
You are the adult, he is the kid.

Assuming his dad is not on scene to provide firm boundaries?

It’s not easy.
Stop trying to buy him off.
He probably wants a strong parent.

That’s what one of the lads told me…
Good luck!

JustAnotherLawyer2 · 25/01/2022 14:13

Your child (and you) appear to desperately need an advocate to speak up for him and to put across clearly, succinctly and without emotion, what it is your child needs and how the school and other services can assist him.

You're doing your best, but it is difficult to get an older child to school if they do not want to go, and the teacher threatening you with prison, a tag and fines isn't going to help get your boy into school.

Google 'children's advocates' and try to find something local to you. Once you both have someone who will listen to what you both have to say, and then convey that to the school and others (and will be experienced enough not to permit someone else from talking over them), you will both start to feel heard and hopefully that will mean things can start to move forward.

jebthesheep · 25/01/2022 14:17

I’ve not tried this part of the organisation that run it, but this might be an alternative if the LEA would approve it and it is the school environment that he is having trouble with rather than the school work itself.
If you have to wait for him to be seen for his MH issues, it might provide a bridge.

Yesyesyesno · 25/01/2022 14:17

Hi OP, I’m speaking from the other side as I was once a teenager (not that long ago!) who refused to go to school.

I had horrific anxiety, agoraphobia, self harming issues and point blank refused to go to school. I was a little different to your son because I wasn’t asking for money as I wasn’t going anywhere. My Mum would manage to get me into the car most days but getting me out of it was almost impossible. It’s very easy for other people to say “just make him go”, “push him out the door” but how?

My Mum couldn’t make me go. It was a horrific time. I ended up in a pupil referral unit and it was the BEST thing that ever happened to me. I cannot stress this enough. Not everyone is fit for mainstream school and that’s okay. The PRU was harsh, a lot of troubled kids in there. They were able to physically restrain kids if they were kicking off. It humbled me a lot. They sent a van to the house and made me get in it and took me to school. I was actually in the medical unit due to mental health problems and we were mostly contained to one classroom. Kids came and went but there was never anymore than 8 of us. A few pregnant girls, some with mental health problems/anorexia.

My PRU had kids from age 4-16 and I saw all kinds of kids with all kinds of issues and at least they were getting some sort of education. There were a lot of kids there with school refusal so they were used to it. I recently finished my Masters degree so it hasn’t held me back educationally at all.

You’ve done good by appealing the CAMHS decision. If you are scared of him I would look at contacting social services too. Obviously not to have him taken out of the home but they can offer help and advice.

jebthesheep · 25/01/2022 14:18

Bugger, sorry forgot the link
academy21.co.uk/school-refusers/

thedefinitionofmadness · 25/01/2022 14:18

[quote oakleaffy]@Notoschool
My word, Sadly your son has learned to manipulate you good and proper.
The threats
The violence

I’d call the police.
I know of two cases like this where the mother was at her absolute wits end, and in both cases they called police.

It definitely worked in these two cases.
Teens KNOW when they can manipulate, and you HAVE to start saying NO!

If your doors get stoved in, call the police.

Stop pandering to him.

The buck has to stop
You are the adult, he is the kid.

Assuming his dad is not on scene to provide firm boundaries?

It’s not easy.
Stop trying to buy him off.
He probably wants a strong parent.

That’s what one of the lads told me…
Good luck![/quote]
^IGNORE THIS OP

Notoschool · 25/01/2022 14:20

@JustAnotherLawyer2

Your child (and you) appear to desperately need an advocate to speak up for him and to put across clearly, succinctly and without emotion, what it is your child needs and how the school and other services can assist him.

You're doing your best, but it is difficult to get an older child to school if they do not want to go, and the teacher threatening you with prison, a tag and fines isn't going to help get your boy into school.

Google 'children's advocates' and try to find something local to you. Once you both have someone who will listen to what you both have to say, and then convey that to the school and others (and will be experienced enough not to permit someone else from talking over them), you will both start to feel heard and hopefully that will mean things can start to move forward.

We do have somone from early help who is trying to get my son heard/help. He will be at the meeting in a few days. So I think I will see then how helpful he is. He seems kind and I thin he's listening and seems to understand so I'm hoping he will help us at the meeting
OP posts:
SoTiredNeedHoliday · 25/01/2022 14:21

Seconded OP. They are speaking rubbish.....

Imitatingdory · 25/01/2022 14:22

Don’t deregister, many find it easier to get help when on a school’s roll even if not attending. Crudely you are someone’s problem, whereas it’s all too easy to sweep DC’s needs under the carpet if you EHE.

As others have said, do apply for an EHCNA. The needs assessment can include MH assessments having to sit on waiting lists. The threshold for assessment is relatively low - a) has or may have SEN, and b) may need SEN provision to be made via an EHCP.

As well as applying for an EHCNA push for EOTAS provision under section 19, the Education Act 1996 in the meantime. The LA have a statutory duty to provide education to those ”who, by reason of illness, exclusion from school or otherwise, may not for any period receive suitable education unless such arrangements are made for them.” If the LA refuse threaten to begin Judicial Review proceedings.

I don’t think moving school is the best way forward, but if you did want to move school, and the you wanted is undersubscribed there are limited reasons the school can refuse. You can find more information in the admissions code here.

SoTiredNeedHoliday · 25/01/2022 14:22

@SoTiredNeedHoliday

Seconded OP. They are speaking rubbish.....
That is the comments from @oakleaffy. @thedefinitionofmadness is right
Iusedtoliveinsanfrancisco · 25/01/2022 14:22

Like a poster above says consider a PRU. I’ve worked in one for years. it’s intense. Is there one near you call them and find out how to get entry

cookiemonster2468 · 25/01/2022 14:23

counselling has been offered In school. I'm not sure how comfortable he feels with that. The fact that its in school could make him back off

Just wanted to pick up on this. There must be a creative solution here.

Is he open to the idea of counselling generally?

If so, that is great, and you need to jump on that and get it in place for him one way or another. A lot of counsellors are offering phone/ virtual sessions - is there any reason why they couldn't do this for him?

Would it be an option for him to come to school ONLY for the counselling session, and then go home?

At this point, I would be going for a very small level of engagement as a win, and if the only thing he's engaging with is counselling, that is still an excellent step. Celebrate any small achievement.

CurtainTroubles · 25/01/2022 14:24

This reply has been deleted

Withdrawn at the user's request

itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 14:24

@cookiemonster2468

counselling has been offered In school. I'm not sure how comfortable he feels with that. The fact that its in school could make him back off

Just wanted to pick up on this. There must be a creative solution here.

Is he open to the idea of counselling generally?

If so, that is great, and you need to jump on that and get it in place for him one way or another. A lot of counsellors are offering phone/ virtual sessions - is there any reason why they couldn't do this for him?

Would it be an option for him to come to school ONLY for the counselling session, and then go home?

At this point, I would be going for a very small level of engagement as a win, and if the only thing he's engaging with is counselling, that is still an excellent step. Celebrate any small achievement.

Excellent points here.

Surely school could do counselling via zoom? It's not like schools don't have online access after these past 2 years.

It's more important someone listens and helps him than the where and how.

Notoschool · 25/01/2022 14:25

18thedefinitionofmadness

oakleaffy

@Notoschool
My word, Sadly your son has learned to manipulate you good and proper.
The threats
The violence

I’d call the police.
I know of two cases like this where the mother was at her absolute wits end, and in both cases they called police.

It definitely worked in these two cases.
Teens KNOW when they can manipulate, and you HAVE to start saying NO!

If your doors get stoved in, call the police.

Stop pandering to him.

The buck has to stop
You are the adult, he is the kid.

Assuming his dad is not on scene to provide firm boundaries?

It’s not easy.
Stop trying to buy him off.
He probably wants a strong parent.

That’s what one of the lads told me…
Good luck!

IGNORE THIS OP

Ok 🤣

OP posts:
52andblue · 25/01/2022 14:26

@Embracelife

Go o the Facebook group " Not Fine In School - " Public Page - School Attendance Difficulties is on Facebook. To connect with Not Fine In School - Public Page - School Attendance Difficulties
This. Your child is self harming and needs MH support in a way he can access. You are engaging and supporting him and are being threatened with prison. The system is truly awful.

I have a 14 y/o who cannot cope with School more than 50% timetable. She has ASD dx. PDA (not on dx but clear).
Far worse when children is stressed. You cannot wrestle a person bigger than you into clothes and out the door!

tulips27 · 25/01/2022 14:27

I can't read the whole thread (not enough time) but I was the kid in this situation once. What happened was that there was a separate reason for not attending in the first place, but once my "name" was tarnished the act of going back became totally unbearable because the teachers would be mean and single me out for comments all the time, all day. Once I changed schools it was all resolved because I had a new start somewhere else. When I look back I really wonder what those teachers thought they would achieve by saying "oh you decided to make an appearance today, did you" and much, much worse.

Iluvfriends · 25/01/2022 14:31

Sorry this is long.

I also went through school refusal with my eldest. Not the aggression or self harming. Half way into 2nd year (age 12/13) he started making excuses to come home from school. This escalated into refusing to go at all.
School were brilliant actually, i had multiple meetings with them to try and sort it. They offered a reduced timetable which didn't work, then got him into a college course 3 days a week, to no avail. They tried everything but the school environment was the issue so there was no bargaining with him.
One day the school attendance officer turned up at my door, ds shut himself in his room and refused to see or speak to her. She said she would be getting the campus police to come and forcibly take him to school.
She went back to school and reported him as missing because she didn't actually see him.
Ds heard everything she said. Next morning he had bolted before the police came to the door.
Re the college placement....he did go to an initial meeting in the college to find out about the course and i went with him. The person we were meeting was late arriving and with every second that passed ds was becoming more and more uncomfortable being there to the point he walked out the college.
The school environment was the issue with ds. And college was no different according to him.
We were put in touch with several agencies, Action for Children and Tigers eg) that really helped. They got him on courses in the workplace rather than college and he got to try different things, Mechanics and Landscaping eg.
That was 6 years ago, he now has a job and is very happy in it.

As hard as it is just now op there is light at the end of the tunnel.

bendmeoverbackwards · 25/01/2022 14:35

They send parents to prison for non school attendance?? Just what kids with mental health problems need 😢

aldilemonade · 25/01/2022 14:37

I have been through this with my son it was awful i was threatened with court fines prison etc
my son was seen by camhs who diagnosed severe anxiety
I was told i had to get him in
I have been tripped up, slapped hair pulled shoved into brambles punched in the street with my son begging me not to make him go in
He started running away from school and eventually i told the school it wasn't happening anymore in their eyes its your problem you have got to get them in.
My son is now home schooled and honestly for him it has been the best thing i have got a relationship back with my son
I know its hard i had every excuse from the education department was i spending enough time with my son was i giving him what he needed to just force him in until i told them that i was not going to be physically attacked anymore
i tried bribery, blackmail, spending time with him, giving him space nothing worked
I even had the school asking me to consider foster care

aldilemonade · 25/01/2022 14:43

Ignore the stupid comments about the police the school brought in the police to my son it did not make one bit of difference.
His anxiety about school was greater than his fear of the police

Notoschool · 25/01/2022 14:45

I just looked on the gov website and the first thing it talks about for EHCP is evidence.

OP posts:
LuluBlakey1 · 25/01/2022 14:46

@Mischance

There is clearly a problem in school - this needs sorting and you need to badger the school (and the governors) until someone accepts that they need to take action.
No there isn't clearly a problem in school. Often school refusers have reasons nit to go that are nothing to do with school. I came across teenagers who: Were going out at night with a group of teenagers they had met who were not friends who attended school, were staying out late and simply wanted to stay in bed until lunchtime and play on games in the afternoon. Had got into a habit, for whatever reason, of not attending school, not doing and work, not having to do what they were told, follow any rules etc and quite liked that and didn't want to go back . Had become involved in other things outside of school - alcohol, drugs, crime and school was of no relevance Had mental health issues exacerbated by things at home, relationships, boundaries and did not want to face any aspect of life that put pressure on them.

Teenagers learn how to manipulate their parents, how to press buttons to get the response they want. This young man clearly knows exactly how to do that. 'I'll hurt myself unless........You are making me hurt myself.........You must want me to hurt myself or you would have'.

Would be interesting to know how many nights a week he goes out to meet his friend, the times he is out eg 4pm-midnight, 6pm to 8pm, and also what he is doing . If OP said 'Ok do what you like. No pressure. You don't have to go to school again' what would he do and would the self-harm stop?

There may be a problem at school but I m not convinced by what I have read.

It is very hard to be the parent in this situation- how do you make a 6ft 14 year old boy do what he refuses to do when he threatens, and carries out, self-harm if you try?

Would he engage with an employment and training programme? It's a possibility in agreement with the LA - so he might do a part or full-time mix of college study and work exp leading to a vocational qualification?

TitoMojito · 25/01/2022 14:47

@LumosSolem

This is the other thing isn't it- if an adult is struggling that badly with mental health, very often they will be signed off of work. Where is the actual recognition that kids and teenagers might not be able to carry on with everything as normal when they are struggling? A PP said about her son who hated PE- well why can't that be taken into consideration and worked around at least temporarily?

Teenagers must feel so completely trapped and without options. No wonder it is so difficult for them sometimes.

Absolutely this. I was one of those teenagers who found school a mentally damaging experience. But trying to find a single professional who gives a shit is near impossible. Teenage mental health isn't taken seriously at all and it's awful.
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