My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

Join the discussion and meet other Mumsnetters on our free online chat forum.

Chat

My son won't go to school.. im in shit for it

427 replies

Notoschool · 25/01/2022 10:31

My son is 14. He's been refusing school since around September. He's probably been 5 or 6 times since. He gives lots of different reasons such as he does not like the teacher . Or he feels anxious in the class. He hates the lesson. His reasons seem to change.

He has been self harming by cutting himself. He's been offered counselling at school.but as hes not going to school that's not happening. We have asked for help from camhs that was refused. So we have appealed. We found another counselling/support service for young people they are giving him 3 sessions. And that ends. As they are reducing their services. At the moment we have some support from early help but apparently that comes to a close in around 3 weeks.

My son has been very aggressive to the point he scares me. He's done things like smash up the doors in the house put holes in a partition wall. He's also verbally aggressive.

Recently the school offered him part time time table. To start at 11.15 . He agreed with this . Apart from the Monday where he wanted to start at lunchtime. The school refused this . But I really stood up for ds . As I thought this was better than not going at all. I agree its not right but surely a step in the right direction. His body language had changed and his tone. I really thought he was going to do it . So he went to school on the Friday. Come Monday He's refusing again I actually agued his point with the school so now it's made me look really bad and now he's made it impossible for me to have any valued say in a meeting that's going to happen in a few days.

Hes always asking for money to top his phone up. For food when he's out. Or just general things that teens often want . He wanted money Friday. I said once I know your at school I will transfer you money. Then on Tuesday as long as you have been to school on the Monday and Tuesday. I will top up your phone. But he did not stick to this agreement. So I have not topped up his phone. He told me how selfish I am . And said to me things like: "you only have to do a simple thing. It's like you want me to cut." He has said several similar things.

I'm actually frightened that because I'm refusing to give him money or top up his phone he's going to become very aggressive later on.

The school have told me there is going to be a meeting the local authorities will be there. I have been told I can get a large fine. Could get a tag or even go to prison . My son has told me he does not care. I'm told the law says its my responsibility to get him to school but no one can actually tell me how I can get him in school. He's 14 and 6ft tall I can't physically get him there.

I'm really scared of this whole situation. But I feel totally trapped in the situation and don't know what to do. My son just won't engage.

OP posts:
Report
WarmSeaSwimmer · 25/01/2022 11:59

@SkepticalCat that sums it up perfectly.

Report
mummykel16 · 25/01/2022 11:59

Take the school out of the equation they are not interested in helping anyway
Find out what is available at local colleges for your son rather than try to force the school to act like they give a FF.

Report
Binthescales · 25/01/2022 12:00

@StepAwayFromGoogling

You do sound like you've been enabling his behaviour. Surely you shove him out the door with his achool clothes and tell him to get to school? You don't let him loaf about in the house all day. And you've still been giving him money to go out and top up his phone? So what have the consequences for him not going to school been up to now?

How in God’s name is she supposed to get a 6 foot grown man dressed in school clothes and shove him out the door if he is violent and refuses?
Report
Tomselleckhaskindeyes · 25/01/2022 12:03

i would personally get a solicitor OP. There are a lot of specialists who work with SEND cases.

Report
LumosSolem · 25/01/2022 12:04

@Itsalmostanaccessory I'm not derailing this for OP by an argument over how shit the provision is. It's just that posters like you who suggest that the OP has to find the money from somewhere seem so completely out of touch with what some peoples lives and finances are like. Sometimes there are literally no options whatsoever.

It would also cost nothing for the school to engage better and try to find solutions that will actually work for this boy, that he can have some input to- anything small that helps turn the tide could make a massive difference right now. The kindness and understanding of the senior leadership at the school I went to actually turned it all around for me. Secondary schools today horrify me- they seem to have become dictatorships compared to my experiences 20 years ago. And I went to a really well thought of state school at the time. Not indisciplined- very good results but not the prison mentality so many seem to have now.

Report
Tomselleckhaskindeyes · 25/01/2022 12:04

You might be entitled to legal aid. This is was
i have suggested to some people who come
to us do help.

Report
Notoschool · 25/01/2022 12:05

@Bunnyrun5

You have been saying ‘we’ in all your posts are you talking about your sons Father? In which case how supportive is he being with both you and your son, does he attend the meetings?
I am a counsellor and have worked with many young people presenting like your son. It takes time and unfortunately often privately funded, but your son needs to talk to someone outside of school, not related whom he can trust and then he can be honest about his readings for not wanting to attend school. I’m so sorry to hear you are struggling it is not an easy situation to resolve without full support from everyone in your sons life. I’m sure you will have tried this already, but when the moment is right and he is willing to engage us to ask him what he wants ‘you’ to do with current situation and work from that point,

His father is not about . I don't know why I'm saying We. Erm yes although counselling has been offered In school. I'm not sure how comfortable he feels with that. The fact that its in school could make him back off.

This we (Me and ds) got told such as help will be refused unless hrs in school. Probably made things worse.
OP posts:
Report
tardissimus · 25/01/2022 12:05

Please don't rush to deregister yet. There is help available, but you may have to fight to get it. These resources may help:

Emotionally based school refusal

Mental health and behaviour in school

www.youngminds.org.uk/parent/a-z-guide/school-anxiety-and-refusal/#Helpingyourchildwithschoolrefusal

If CAMHS are refusing to see him, go back to the GP and get them to refer again. Talk to them about your son's anxiety.

Ask the school SENCO what resources are available. Ask them for an urgent referral to the educational psychology team. Put everything in writing (email); if they phone you back then send an email confirming what was said in the conversation.

Don't be fobbed off by waiting lists. Keep fighting.

Report
NotAQueef · 25/01/2022 12:07

No real advice, but offering support. My 11 yr old (Y6) is going through this a little at the moment and it's so hard. People telling you to just shove them out the door/drag them in, simply don't get it. I hope you manage to get the support you need.

Report
itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 12:08

@Notoschool

Thank you for all your messages. With the mental health side of it. All I Keep getting told is he does not have a diagnosis. And I can't discuss it with her because she talks over me. Also I'm sure she knows as well as we all do on this thread that it can take years to get a diagnosis.

She also told me that ds can't go to a different school because in year 10 its near impossible and Another school or college will not take him due to his attendance.

When I have spoke to ds about leaving the school he has said the school he's at is a good school.

I will definitely look at that Facebook group thank you 😊

My son had a diagnosis of school anxiety from camhs and referral to tier 4 support.

His senco told a judge on ehcp refusal to assess hearing that she didn't agree with it "because the school didn't ask her opinion" HmmConfused

Is this school an academy? Ime they are worst for pastoral care and I also wa spoken over frequently and patronised. In fact they gas lighted me until my own MH was suffering almost as much as ds'.

Best thing I did was secure a managed move for my son. He was on trial when we had the ehcp tribunal and he stayed there for 4 years with it. They were fabulous with supporting his MH and he's a completely different young man now at 17.

My ds has autism (plus a genetic neuromuscular condition) so there were other issues at play.

But they have to understand how he won't get a diagnosis of any MH issues until he has an assessment by camhs and you aren't able to secure that. So ask them how they'll support you securing this to support your son moving forward.
Report
VickyEadieofThigh · 25/01/2022 12:10

@ElftonWednesday

School refusal anxiety is massively misunderstood. Parents should not be fined for their child's mental health issue, and you can't just make a teenager do something, like a toddler you bundle into a pushchair. Even if you have sanctions, they will take ANY punishment to avoid school.

Engage with the school, GP and local NHS trust and keep records and you should not be in trouble for this.

retired secondary headteacher here - just want to agree with this comment. It's far too easy to tell a parent it's "their responsibility" to get a teenager into school - but how? If a 6ft young man is refusing (and is aggressive about it), how?

It's not as simple as trying to talk to him about what his alternatives are, how he hopes to get a good job, etc, either - I've known a number of young people like this in my time, where the parents are tearing their hair out - because as like as not, his answer will be that he 'doesn't care'.

Some young people, for a range of reasons, find school intolerable. It can be a mental health issue (and we know how easy it is to find help for that), such as anxiety. This can arise for seemingly no apparent reason, but for a young man who previously showed no signs, the pandemic might well have triggered a mental health issue.

As others have said, OP, attend the meeting - be open and honest about your difficulties and ask them what help and advice they can give you under these circumstances. Ask about other, off-site provision that might be available.
Report
itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 12:11

Itsalmost cosy there is your own little world is it? There are families going without food or heating due to not being able to afford it.
Do you begrudge them subsidised heating through the schemes available because if they want it they should pay?

Not only is that totally unrealistic but this pandemic has made people struggle further.

Report
itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 12:12

@itsgettingweird

Itsalmost cosy there is your own little world is it? There are families going without food or heating due to not being able to afford it.
Do you begrudge them subsidised heating through the schemes available because if they want it they should pay?

Not only is that totally unrealistic but this pandemic has made people struggle further.


Shows there is truth in the fact the gap between haves and have nots is increasing. The have nots should just not have - because they can't afford it - apparently.

Forget all the NI and taxes we pay to fund these services. Which we will be paying more to fund very soon.
Report
WarmSeaSwimmer · 25/01/2022 12:13

Another point is to consider asking the school to apply for an EHCP Needs Assessment, lots of information about this on the IPSEA website. School might resist as they are often under pressure from the LA to limit applications, but you can apply by yourself without the school's support if necessary. As part of the needs assessment the Local Authority will have do an Educational Psychologist assessment, amongst others, to come up with a support plan.

The baseline for applying for an EHCP is much lower than most people think and the fact that your son is not able to attend school is enough evidence to show his needs are not being met.

Report
Itsalmostanaccessory · 25/01/2022 12:15

@itsgettingweird

I'm a single parent to 2 children and my business was decimated by the lockdowns. Which I've discussed on here plenty of times.

But I dont see you coming up with an alternative?

The free help isnt there. That is a fact. Her son is not going to get counselling provided in the way he needs it. The choice is to pay for it or go without.

That's not a comment in whether or not it is right. But it is the way it is right now and fighting for changes and more funding isnt going to help the OP. That's the way it is.

I just dont see he point in living life and pretending it will all be OK and help will come and blah blah blah. It wont. It isnt there. They arent going to fund it more. This is how it is.

Either pay for help or dont get it. That's the shitty way it is right now. Or do you know something we dont?

Reading comprehension is going downhill, but saying how something actually is at the moment is not the same as saying that it should be that way so just bugger off.

Report
FairyLightQueen · 25/01/2022 12:15

@Notoschool

Thank you for all your messages. With the mental health side of it. All I Keep getting told is he does not have a diagnosis. And I can't discuss it with her because she talks over me. Also I'm sure she knows as well as we all do on this thread that it can take years to get a diagnosis.

She also told me that ds can't go to a different school because in year 10 its near impossible and Another school or college will not take him due to his attendance.

When I have spoke to ds about leaving the school he has said the school he's at is a good school.

I will definitely look at that Facebook group thank you 😊

This is so frustrating because if CAMHS saw him then he would have a diagnosis! The mental health support for young people in this country is really, really lacking.

So sorry you're going through this. FWIW I was a school refuser for what would have been my GCSE years (I'm in Scotland). I managed to scrape by and made my own education path a bit later, and now I have a lovely life.

Mental health with teens is such a tricky one to navigate. There has been some brilliant advice here (apart from the unhelpful 'just force him' comment). I hope that something works soon and he is able to get the help he so obviously needs Flowers
Report
Itsalmostanaccessory · 25/01/2022 12:17

@itsgettingweird

That's not at all what I said. Not at all. Learn to fucking read.

Report
Cindie943811A · 25/01/2022 12:19

I’m afraid I have no useful advice for you OP. I do hope the support groups suggested can provide practical help. I can’t think you will be sanctioned by the law if you provide the information you have given here.
The problem is that the authorities have put legislation and regulations into place that are totally unrealistic without provision of appropriate resources.
Social workers are expected to “make” young people “behave” yet are as powerless as the parents . The constant refrain is “but you are the social worker” When this country values it’s young and provides adequate resources for their physical and psychological care things might change. They can find the money for all sorts of vanity projects like bridges and railways and private jets yet say there is not enough for mental health services etc. and to alleviate child poverty.

Report
FairyLightQueen · 25/01/2022 12:21

@itsgettingweird @Itsalmostanaccessory I'm not sure arguing on this thread is going to help the OP navigate what is clearly a difficult time. Not to be rude but could you please take it to your PMs if you must have it out? This is a really sensitive topic and there's no point cluttering up a thread with a pointless argument.

Report
Changingtides1234 · 25/01/2022 12:21

Can I ask- is he gcse now? Year 10?
If he is - you mentioned he refused to do work during lockdown and school refusal started after this.
There’s a couple of things here;
If he is in year 10
And he did refuse to do work last year and year before (remember he hasn’t had a normal year since year 7 if he is in year 10)
And he started self harming around this time

You may find the reason for the refusal is because he feels he’s fallen completely behind and can’t cope so is now refusing.

The school should be well versed in post lockdown anxiety and school refusal. It’s so easy for us to forget students in year 9 haven’t had a normal school year since year 6!
I would, in the meeting bring this up

Point blank ask your son (particularly if he is year 10) do you feel you’ve fallen behind- you can’t access the learning.

Youd be amazed, how many boys (sorry to stereotype) I see refuse to enter classes/get into fights/ school refuse simply because they feel they can’t do it (the class/learning)

Report
cherryonthecakes · 25/01/2022 12:23

I wouldn't deregister him as that would surely result him being forgotten by the system and he'd end up an adult without GCSEs which really restricts choices and employment possibilities.

There are children who don't go to school because of parental laziness but that's not school refusal and the services should know that.

I have no practical advice but lots of sympathy OP Thanks

Report
itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 12:23

[quote Itsalmostanaccessory]@itsgettingweird

I'm a single parent to 2 children and my business was decimated by the lockdowns. Which I've discussed on here plenty of times.

But I dont see you coming up with an alternative?

The free help isnt there. That is a fact. Her son is not going to get counselling provided in the way he needs it. The choice is to pay for it or go without.

That's not a comment in whether or not it is right. But it is the way it is right now and fighting for changes and more funding isnt going to help the OP. That's the way it is.

I just dont see he point in living life and pretending it will all be OK and help will come and blah blah blah. It wont. It isnt there. They arent going to fund it more. This is how it is.

Either pay for help or dont get it. That's the shitty way it is right now. Or do you know something we dont?

Reading comprehension is going downhill, but saying how something actually is at the moment is not the same as saying that it should be that way so just bugger off.[/quote]
Actually I don't agree.

I secured all my sons entitlement to free help by knowing the saw. I could quite most of sendcop (all 292 pages!).

I was persistent. But I emailed everyone and quoted the law and asked how they were going to exercise their duty to meet those. At that time I couldn't afford to pay. (I could now if needed).

I even got an independent panel to hear my case made up of councillors within my county but not my la who had an interest in the issues I was experiencing.

One grown man cried and apologised on behalf of the government system for such failures.

It won't happen tomorrow and may take a few months. But it'll happen. And there really is no choice if you don't have the money to pay.

The problem is the school thinking a threat of prison will solve the mental health problems of a clearly troubled teenager.

In fact the only person who was less than helpful through all this was my own MP. She actually stopped me years later in town around the time of the GE and asked if I'd vote for her. She didn't bank on me publicly but politely explaining exactly why I would not.

Even less so banking on coming to our local special school for a publicity stunt a little later and walking in to find me working there. I smiled very sweetly Grin

And if you've been through losing businesses you of all people should understand how guilty parents feel for not being able to provide things for their children. OP really doesn't not need anyone else making her feel bad right now.

Report
itsgettingweird · 25/01/2022 12:24

[quote FairyLightQueen]**@itsgettingweird* @Itsalmostanaccessory* I'm not sure arguing on this thread is going to help the OP navigate what is clearly a difficult time. Not to be rude but could you please take it to your PMs if you must have it out? This is a really sensitive topic and there's no point cluttering up a thread with a pointless argument.[/quote]
I'm not arguing. Plenty of posters have pointed out that making a parent feel guilty for not being able to pay for what should be a free service isn't helping.

Report
SoTiredNeedHoliday · 25/01/2022 12:27

@Notoschool I would welcome the meeting with the local authorities as you are doing absolutely everything that you can do and the school and camhs are not helping you or you DS in the way you need.

I think the meeting might be a good step forward for all involved as you can't keep going on as you are and despite DS being difficult there is clearly a reason and you need proper support to find out what that is.

Don't worry about the fine, I think you will have every reason there is to appeal a fine if it is issued as you don't have the means to control what happens on a day to day basis with a son who is stronger and taller than you. Additionally the school and Camhs are also not providing the help you and your DS need.
He must be feeling all sorts of anxiety and other emotions, poor boy. Obviously at his age these will come out as aggression and anger and refusal.

Have you heard of things such as the below, might be worth studying up on them (and anything else you can find) for your meeting with school and the local authority.
The local authority will be used to dealing with this issue and they will be (should be) very understanding. Importantly have someone with you so that you have another perspective on the meeting too.
University technical colleges 14 to 18 years old
Or
or www.oxmindguide.org.uk/minditem/11413/

Report
Scotmum83 · 25/01/2022 12:28

I hated school so much, I was incredibly shy with social anxiety and was off all
The time. School can be so stressful for kids and if there is something underlying that is making it harder for him like adhd, dyslexia or bullying etc you need to get to the bottom of it. Is there anyway you could apply for homeschooling instead to take away that pressure on you that he’s not attending. It might Get his mental health in a better place so he can get back to doing his schoolwork.

Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.