Why is my midwife trying to talk me out of epidural

[Melvin2021]

Hi I'm 38.5 weeks and I've been pretty certain from the off that I would like an epidural when in labor obviously if everything goes to plan. Mt midwife said I don't want one and to see how I get on? Has this happened to anyone else?

@MissM2912

It’s not about ‘being a better mum!’- it’s about optimising your chance of having a positive birth experience. The impact of having a negative birth experience can be huge- both physically and emotionally. Yes- you can have an epidural and have a fantastic birth- but many women, as seen in previous comments, do not have such a good time and the reality is you won’t know until you are in the throes of Labour how it will work out.

I’m part of two mums groups both spawned from the Mumsnet due date / month threads. One is smaller than the other (less than 50) vs a much larger (over 200) I can only go on the experiences of those mums, myself and my friends but I actually think you’re spouting quite dangerous misinformation there and in your other posts implying that epidurals are going to cause traumatic births and after effects (like postpartum depression). Lots of mums in both my mums groups had very traumatic births for various reasons as just as many of those were natural births as with any form of pain relief and interventions. ANYONE can have a traumatic birth and post birth complications or things like postpartum depression.

I’m just gonna say it - whilst there are a lot of excellent midwives it does seem to attar t some to the profession who are well versed in patronising women, refusing pain relief and generally making labour a miserable experience.

Be firm, it’s YOUR experience, your healthcare, you have a right to pain relief and make sure you get it!

Correlation does not equal causation. It isn’t clear whether women having epidurals are having them due to higher levels of pain or prolonged deliveries due to complications which would require intervention with or without epidural.

Unfortunately few people, professionals or otherwise, are completely impartial. Try to find a reliable source of non biased information and weigh it up. If an epidural is what you want make this clear early on, don’t be fobbed off as some midwives will leave it until it is too late.

Your midwife shouldn't be pushing you away from an epidural. She should be presenting you with the hot to date medical facts and then letting you make your own decision.

I'd be looking for a new midwife, but I don't know how it works in the UK. Maybe you don't get any choice in the matter.

That all sounds really good in theory but personally I prefer to take the advice of professionals such as midwives and doctors when knowing what is most likely to give me a positive birth experience, rather than someone comparing it to taking pain relief for a tooth ache.
I am not disputing that an epidural can be necessary- just that other options should be looked at and attempted first.

@MissM2912

The obsession with natural childbirth is because statistically the outcomes for both mother and baby are better. It’s not about oppressing women- quite the opposite!

Sorry, but this is kinda bullshit. “Telling” the OP she doesn’t want an epidural absolutely IS oppression. The pros and cons of an epidural should be discussed with the OP who can make an informed decision about what she wants and what risks she personally is willing to take. Dismissing her own choice because it’s “statistically better for both mother and baby” is patronising and ridiculous.

How do things actually work in terms of pain relief in hospital, though? Is it really a case of 'ask and you shall get'?

I mean, if someone went into A&E with a laceration and said "I want morphine", or "just put me straight on the ketamine", I'm pretty sure they're gonna insist on trying something milder first, aren't they?

SheWolfOFFrancee I am not disputing that anyone can have a traumatic birth- what I am saying is that an epidural increases the risk of needing an assisted delivery or a section.

@kittensinthekitchen I asked for epidurals with all 3 of mine and there was never any question of no. I had to wait for an anaesthetist to come chat to me / do it but otherwise. I was offered gas and air while I waited but no other pain relief options were suggested instead

If we take the advice of professionals, most of the women consultants I know have had elective CS.

I had epidural with baby number one & had emergency c section. Babies 2 & 3, pethidine & quick easy births.
Could you see how you get on in labour & have epidural if neede?

’Correlation does not equal causation. It isn’t clear whether women having epidurals are having them due to higher levels of pain or prolonged deliveries due to complications which would require intervention with or without epidural.’

This ^

@Totallydefeated what an excellent post!! I’m so sick of hospital management types speaking about female patients like they’re a bunch of dumb arses who can’t be trusted to make their own choices and gaslight them by telling them they’ll be happiest with a natural birth with minimal pain relief. Maternity care in this country is basically third-world standards and let’s not forget ‘hospital management’ will have a primary aim of keeping costs down, and when pain relief and c-sections cost big bucks why give women choice when you can bully them into the cheap option instead

I am bowing out- OP- good luck with your birth.
It really makes no odds to me whether you have a section if you think that is for the best.

I had my daughter 13 years ago I asked for the epidural when I was about 2 cms.. it completely slowed down my labour I was also given a pump that I could use to top up. I felt nothing! No contractions, no urge to push and I couldn't feel my legs.. when it came time to push the midwife told me I was pushing wrong but I couldn't feel anything so how could I push properly! I ended up having an episiotomy and I had back pain for months probably because I wasn't allowed move from the bed after having the epi for 10 hours.. It is amazing pain relief bit it comes with lots of side effects

AsYouWishButtercup that simply isn’t true and incredibly insulting to the people working in maternity services.
I know many many excellent midwives and service managers whose sole driver is improving services and ensuring babies arrive safely to mothers who have a positive birth experience.

Oh and I had a vaginal delivery with DD, no pain relief - not on purpose, I was refused it then labour progressed so quickly that there was no time. It was fucking horrendous and I had retained placenta which caused a huge blood loss (3.5 pints) which required surgery.

You can tell women to do everything a certain way and it still goes tits up because giving birth is never 100% safe. So why don’t we do what is important: giving women choice, listening - actually listening, not hearing - to their concerns, and trusting that a positive experience is doing whatever they say is right for them.

Women up and down the country are bullied and pain relief is withheld during the most painful prolonged and traumatic experience they’ll ever go through. This doesn’t happen on any other ward, only maternity - ask yourselves why that is. What is the common dominator in these patients that make the NHS think they can silence their choice and treat them like shit? What could it possibly be?

I think stick to your guns OP

You can always change your mind later re an epidural it's not set in stone, and as others have posted, it's not always that quick/straightforward to get one

To the poster writing about the highest birth satisfaction being those with unassisted vaginal deliveries, I don't see how that kind of statement is helpful?

I'll go against to say- I had 2 elective CS for maternal request and I was most certainly over the moon to get the birth experiences I wanted!

I had absolutely NO bloody desire to have an unassisted vaginal delivery "experience" thanks very much

@MissM2912

That all sounds really good in theory but personally I prefer to take the advice of professionals such as midwives and doctors when knowing what is most likely to give me a positive birth experience, rather than someone comparing it to taking pain relief for a tooth ache. I am not disputing that an epidural can be necessary- just that other options should be looked at and attempted first.

You’ve talked a lot on this thread about a positive birth experience- and everything you’ve said makes me think you’ve not had a baby yourself yet. As a previous poster had said, women have the most positive birth experience when they feel listened to, heard and involved in their care. Their actual experience can be very positive regardless of their outcomes or interventions. What you’re prescribing as the most positive experience actually wouldn’t be the most positive experience for every woman. Deliberately withholding pain relief and forcing someone to have an unmedicated natural childbirth when it’s absolutely not what they want could (and does) cause trauma that can lead to PTSD. It’s just cruel and unnecessary. Let’s treat grown women like grown bloody women and let them choose what’s best for them!

@MissM2912

AsYouWishButtercup that simply isn’t true and incredibly insulting to the people working in maternity services. I know many many excellent midwives and service managers whose sole driver is improving services and ensuring babies arrive safely to mothers who have a positive birth experience.

It’s absolutely true - or do you think every single glow midwife is excellent? Even the ones who were neglectful in Barrow whose incompetence led to the deaths of loads of women and babies?

Tell me - what kind of HCP allows somebody to be in crushing pain when they can help? And you say many want a woman to have a positive experience - then why wouldn’t you just give her the pain relief she wants?

@MissM2912

That all sounds really good in theory but personally I prefer to take the advice of professionals such as midwives and doctors when knowing what is most likely to give me a positive birth experience, rather than someone comparing it to taking pain relief for a tooth ache. I am not disputing that an epidural can be necessary- just that other options should be looked at and attempted first.

See, because I value myself, I’d rather go on what I want, what instinctively I know what’s right for me, and I just wish more women would do the same rather than be gaslighted into being in agony because they’re told ‘it’s the most positive thing for you’

My point about natural birth leading to increased satisfaction is to highlight the potential negative impact of needing an assisted delivery or an emergency section.

@DropYourSword

Here here!

Amen to all that you have written there!

@kittensinthekitchen

How do things actually work in terms of pain relief in hospital, though? Is it really a case of 'ask and you shall get'?

I mean, if someone went into A&E with a laceration and said "I want morphine", or "just put me straight on the ketamine", I'm pretty sure they're gonna insist on trying something milder first, aren't they?

That’s very different to childbirth where there is a 100% chance of being in total agony, and a set of specifically identified pain relief to deal with labour pains.

@DropYourSword excellent post!