Is my childminder allowed to do this?

[Blueberry00]

Our childminder announced to all the parents today on WhatsApp that due to the new Omnicron variant and the new government guidelines a child who displays any corona symptoms, even if it is just a cough, has to stay at home for 10 days and take a lateral flow test every day.

Another parent pointed out to them that the government guidelines are actually that a child with covid symptoms like a cough can prove their negative corona status with a negative PCR test and then leave self isolation and return to the nursery/childminder. Also that children under 5 don't have to do daily lateral flow tests.

The childminder then just responded that those are just guidelines and that they can make their own rules.

To me and my husband it just seems like they are taking the piss by implementing these rules. To us, it looks like they want to have an easy January. Children have a little cough all the time, so it looks to us like they just want to send children home left, right and centre for 10 days all the while still receiving the full fees from the parents.

We are just wondering if the childminder is actually entitled to do this or if there are grounds for not paying them the full fees?

Bet she'll change her mind once everyone gives notice!

I'd change to a nursery

You're going to end up with zero childcare if she implements this rule

Every time a child has a cough they have to stay home for 10 days?

Fuck that

And what would your employer think if you or your dh were off every time for 10 days? It's not workable.

She's either providing childcare or she's not.

She’s unilaterally varied the contract in a material way - you can terminate without notice. If this was official government guidance that would be a different matter of course.

Small children get coughs. You risk being out of work all winter if you stay with this childminder. A negative PCR should be enough. Asking you to perform daily LFTs on a young child as well as isolating for any cough is completely taking the piss.

As for the poster berating you for talking about her behind her back, she is a service provider, not a close friend.

Sounds like she is angry about catching covid.

She can change the conditions whenever she wishes but she does run the risk of alienating all her clients. You could terminate the contract due to this. It's also worth clarifying the fee situation as she CAN NOT expect you to have to pay in this situation. I would clarify on the WhatsApp group in front of all the parents so they are all aware they shouldn't have to pay either. Maybe the childminder will realise it's not financially sensible to work like this.

@NumberTheory

I would contest the new requirements with the childminder and look for another service. Personally I would look to withdraw without notice on the grounds the childminder has breached the contract by substantially changing the service she's providing.

This. I think potentially you don’t need to give notice period as she has changed contract terms.

The CMs we used always made up their own rules.
One reason why we moved to alternative provision.

While I do think this childminder has strange rules, which obviously need to be questioned, please try to understand why childminder may want to put tighter rules than the national guidelines in place.

Things we know about covid - under 5’a are the group most likely to be asymptotic and none of them have been vaccinated. It is very contagious with close contact and it’s pretty much impossible not to have close contact with a child under 5 (both at home and while with their childminder) According to government guidelines they are allowed to attend without testing.
Government guidelines don’t seem to be working to stop the spread.
Because childminders usually work from their own home they are in the unique position of having to close if any member of their household has covid.
If several members of a childminding household get covid one by one they could be closed for several weeks leaving parents without childcare and then without an income. In many cases they have had to do this more than once over the last year.
Some may feel that completely eliminating any risk of closure may be best in the long run.

My childminder has said a child with a continual running nose, as well as unusual symptoms needs to stay at home for 10 days or get a negative PCR.

Realistically if she wants to lose 10 days of income for a snotty nose that’s her lookout. I’m at the stage of just saying sod it lol.

*running nose, or the usual symptoms (that should say)

@CurryandSnuggle she's trying to avoid a complete closure, or maybe someone in her family is vulnerable. Either way, as you've pointed out she is missing out on income. Honestly, it's a complete nightmare for childminders.

@CurryandSnuggle

*running nose, or the usual symptoms (that should say)

At least you have the option of a negative PCR. The OP doesn’t.

I’d cancel the contract on the basis she’s changed it without notice, find a nursery. They’re more resilient.

If she does bring in this rule she can’t charge - I wonder if she’s thought of that

Yeah I get it, I’m just saying I CBA to get annoyed about it. Ultimately it’s her house. But if she wants to lose 10 days of income for a snotty nose, seems a bit odd but so be it!

I'm a childminder and I'll be brutally honest for providers we are being shafted left right and centre by some ridiculous rules meaning we have no other options but to try and apply common sense and instil our own rules not just for our own sake but for all of our families we provide a service too and to ensure the survival of our businesses.
Current rules are that should anyone in my household be isolating because they are a close contact but not displaying symptoms then I can remain open provided the person isolating has no contact with the minded children and has access to a separate bathroom.
If someone in my household is positive I have to close or work from alternative premises which is not easy so not even sure why they've allowed that option.
If any of my minded children have a positive in their household they according to the rules may still attend.
However my rules are that any positive in anyone's household they do not attend and a PCR would be required to ensure the child is in fact not positive before returning to the setting. I have a CEV husband and some of my minded children are CEV so it's not just for my benefit but for everyone. Thankfully my families have been extremely understanding and are working with me to protect everyone.

Check the contract - ultimately she doesn’t have to have the child but if it’s in breach of contract you don’t have to pay her.

@CurryandSnuggle why not just get a pcr? You'd prob only have to take a couple of days off.
I get it sounds ridiculous to exclude a child with a snotty nose but unfortunately that's often the only symptom for a young child. I expect your childminder feels equally annoyed at the situation

@OrlaPeely

I'm a childminder. We can set whatever rules we like re accepting unwell children, but cannot charge parents when we are sending home against government Covid guidance. Eg I had a sibling of a minded child test positive and said that the minded child needed to stay home (as was trying to avoid passing it on before Christmas) but refunded the fees paid as according to government guidance the minded child could still attend, even with a positive case at home.

I used to childmind (nearly 20 years) and as this current minder says childminders can set their own rules. They cannot charge though if they go against government guidelines. Also, OP, check your contract, you should be able to give a months notice, which you would have to pay for but could possibly offset this against your refund ?

Surely if she's changed her terms and conditions or policies and these are not to your liking , you can terminate the contract. I would have thought that ( I could be wrong though) you don't even need to give notice to end a contract if they've changed the terms of your contract significantly without your agreement?

Or if you still have to give notice you don't have to pay for it? I would keep them at home saying they have a cough if able to and refuse to pay them

I would reply that since she is acting against govt guidelines, you won't be paying her and consider her action to be a breach of contract, since arbitrary changes to rules were not part of what you signed up to. I would also tell her that o was giving her notice - since she is refusing to look after your child that is 10 days of the notice period that she won't be getting paid for!

They have changed their terms and conditions so you can leave the contract

She is entitled to implement her own rules, uts her business. You don't have to agree to it by any means.

Did you ask her about refunds as you would apparently be entitled to do should she do this with your child?