Is my childminder allowed to do this?

[Blueberry00]

Our childminder announced to all the parents today on WhatsApp that due to the new Omnicron variant and the new government guidelines a child who displays any corona symptoms, even if it is just a cough, has to stay at home for 10 days and take a lateral flow test every day.

Another parent pointed out to them that the government guidelines are actually that a child with covid symptoms like a cough can prove their negative corona status with a negative PCR test and then leave self isolation and return to the nursery/childminder. Also that children under 5 don't have to do daily lateral flow tests.

The childminder then just responded that those are just guidelines and that they can make their own rules.

To me and my husband it just seems like they are taking the piss by implementing these rules. To us, it looks like they want to have an easy January. Children have a little cough all the time, so it looks to us like they just want to send children home left, right and centre for 10 days all the while still receiving the full fees from the parents.

We are just wondering if the childminder is actually entitled to do this or if there are grounds for not paying them the full fees?

If they have to stay at home then there is no need to do LFT?

It does seem rather unreasonable of the childminder as you have presented it.

But I do think you need to go back to her for further clarification. Possibly in the group WhatsApp so that all parents get the same information (and possibly have the same reactions as you have).

Childminder, please could you clarify - do we have to keep a child at home for ten days and do daily lateral flows even if we can produce a negative PCR test? If we have a negative PCR test, can child come back straight away?
If we have to keep child at home, even with a negative PCR, will you provide a refund as your requirements are more stringent than government guidelines? I am aware (thanks to Mumsnet) that other childminders are doing this.

@yellowjellytot

I think in a situation where nobody else in the family had tested positive and your child was having a PCR because they had symptoms there would be no reasonable reason for them to be excluded if that was negative. If every child had to take a week off every time they got a cough or cold none of them would attend!

Exactly, it doesn't make any sense.

One of the childminders actually tested positive for corona shortly after she closed for the Christmas holidays.

That is why they had to cancel their planned New York getaway over Christmas and New Year.

They actually said in the whatsapp group (names changed): "With Lisa testing positive for Covid, us not being able to go to New York and me not being very well over Christmas myself we have to be extra careful".

At the end of the day it's not our fault they were stupid enough to plan a long haul flight and holiday in a global pandemic. They also have no evidence that any of the children gave them corona.

@OrlaPeely

Please don't talk about your childcare provider behind their back. Your concerns are totally reasonable so be confident that it's ok for you to ask questions. Ask if you can meet or chat on the phone. Say that you are not clear on what her new policy means and ask her to explain it to you. Have your questions written down to prompt yourself and keep it neutral. Your childminder will have a reason for asking this and if you work together and are willing to try I'm sure they will listen to you and appreciate your honesty.

WTF?

Are you the childminder?

She is posting on an anonymous forum, for a genuine (and perfectly politely-phrased) problem. What a nasty way to twist that.

@yellowjellytot

I'm also a childminder and yes she can set any rules she likes but this does seem a bit strange to me. Why not have a chat with her to check you've understood fully what she's saying. Your contract will tell you how much notice you need to give if you can't resolve the situation.

Bare in mind that childminders are in a very precarious position. If anyone in their household has to isolate they will have to close for 10 days and this will be unpaid. Many of us have already had to close a couple of times already which is why we may have rules that may seem OTT. I'm personally telling parents that children cannot attend if anyone in their household tests positive and a few of my clients aren't happy about it.

‘ I'm personally telling parents that children cannot attend if anyone in their household tests positive and a few of my clients aren't happy about it.‘

@yellowjellytot are you giving them a refund for this? Essentially you are withdrawing your service from customers who are able to attend?

I think Orla meant don’t set up a WhatsApp group with all the other parents to discuss the childminder, as someone suggested.

I think you have given a bit too much info about them tbh. Nevertheless, I agree that their policy is unworkable and probably not acceptable to most working parents. It certainly wouldn't work for me. They could request a PCR and that would be fair enough. Not accepting a PCR is unfair and is contrary to the guidance and to what other workplaces such as care and education are putting in place. I would be looking at a nursery. Yes, they can set their own rules but I would expect the rules to be somewhat consistent with the rules in the rest of the country.

@HermioneGrangersHair - yes, I'm not charging them

I would contest the new requirements with the childminder and look for another service. Personally I would look to withdraw without notice on the grounds the childminder has breached the contract by substantially changing the service she's providing.

She can't make you do lateral flows on your child, but she can refuse to take your child for 10 days if she wants. Whether you choose to continue using her service is your choice.

Also, how easy would it be to find an alternative childcare provider in your area? Perhaps start looking before the other parents do....

Start looking for alternative childcare and, once you have a provider lined up, give your current provider whatever notice is stipulated in your contract (four weeks is fairly standard but do check).

God so unfair you'd have to pay her 4 weeks. I'd be taking legal advice. Seems like breach of contract. But then I have solicitor friends who would help me with this. Cost of legal consultation could be prohibitive

Fuck that, give notice and find a more reliable setting. It’s all very well some people saying you won’t be charged, but that’s still not much help when you need childcare to work.

I think they're being pretty unreasonable TBH. I run a childcare business, and like many covid has forced us to rethink our contracts/T&Cs as when we created them a fucking pandemic wasn't really taken in to consideration and so the situation we found ourselves in just wasn't properly covered. But when we made changes then we a) weren't totally unreasonable and making stuff up as we went along, B) gave adequate warning and C) offered to waive notice period for anyone who wasn't happy with the new conditions.

This approach seems unrealistic, excessive and totally unfair if they intend to charge. It's one thing if you are required to isolate by the govt (which is basically the same as the child being sick, the space is available but you can't use it), but them refusing to accept a well child is a different matter IMO. I'd be protesting and looking elsewhere if they didn't back down.

All common sense has gone out of the window!

My children currently have a lingering cough.weve not long had covid but all caught a raging cold this week..negative pcrs.

Im a teacher and i use common sense when sending children home.. honestly it gets ridiculous the way some staff act! "So and say shes feels sick.." ok well keep an eye on them "shall we send them home?" No!! Ffs!

I wouldn't be taking any chances of catching it if I was a childminder. It's her livelihood - imagine having to look after loads of children if you get long covid.

My youngest child coughs all winter, every winter. Has done since she was a baby and got a lung infection (and apparently its just one of those things...)
And yes... she has had a PCR! And LFTs..

Sometimes it seems that people have forgotten about other illnesses...

I’d withdraw my child and prob find a way of not paying the 4wks notice- must be something about her changing the rules that negates the original agreement

@waltzingparrot

I wouldn't be taking any chances of catching it if I was a childminder. It's her livelihood - imagine having to look after loads of children if you get long covid.

Imagine doing with long covid, they aren't the only exposed or self employed people out there.

This sort of stuff happens far more with CM than nursery. I never thought I would want DC in nursery but as soon as I switched her (due to this sort of nonsense) I never looked back. Rules and regulations and National guidance actually followed.

Not just bizarre covid rules but the relying on one person would stress me out (couple of friends had bad experiences), so I'd agree with previous posters and go with a nursery.

@Blueberry00

Our contract with them runs out in June.

Are we still allowed to give them notice before our contract runs out?

Would this be considered a material change to the contact and allow you to end it early?

Where she is entitled to set her own rules, it seems strange that she is going against what the government are saying is a balanced approach to covid risks?

I agree, breach of contract which is against government guidelines. Tell her she can either accept a PCR test or you will be withdrawing immediately without payment.

Then use a nursery, you can get a lovely nursery with the child minder fees you will be paying. Mine love nursery I woukdnt dream of childminder....having seen them at our local playground chatting for hours while kids look cold and bored.

Sorry, no offence to child minder on here who are very good...just saying my local few are not!!