State retirement age is too old for working class people

[Spiceup]

An observation from some things I've seen lately. I'll explain.

I work in a public sector organisation that employees highly qualified and very well paid professionals alongside support staff on not much more than minimum wage and those in between.

Part of my role is managing sickness absence. What I am seeing lately is that the professional types, despite doing what are generally accepted to be stressful jobs, on the whole, stay well until well into their sixties, although many do retire earlier simply because they have the kind of pensions that make that possible.

People in the more lowly jobs are often genuinely finished by their mid-late 50s. Just worn out and suffering from multiple health problems. Perhaps because of their lifestyles or maybe from just having harder lives (not necessarily harder work lives, but getting by is just generally harder for them). To have to go on to 67 is just absurd and very few do, with ill health retirement common (so the state is paying anyway).

I can't begin to imagine how similar people manage in genuinely physical jobs, in construction for example.

Is it more common for working class people in their 50s to be worn out, or perhaps more comfortably off professionals retire before they get to that point so I don't see it?

Yeah we had a cleaner at work at 59 who was not up to the job anymore but work kept her on because she had worked there for decades - she had no private pension so early retirement was not an option. Luckily she could then retire at 60.
Public-sector pensions are now tied to state retirement age. A total con.

@MorningNinja

State retirement age is too high for those who have made no pension provision.

I'm sorry OP but for most, unless there are extenuating circumstances you have a long time to save for your retirement - working class or not

Do people not hit 35 and wonder to themselves if they can do that job in another 10/20/30 years? Just because you start with a physical job in your youth doesn't mean you need to do it for the rest of your life.

I say all of the above as a woman that has been a single mother/on a low income/claimed benefits/worked a shift pattern that includes night shifts.

We need to take personal responsibility for our own careers and retirement - its hardly a new concept!

Except people had been told for years they would retire at 60 on a full state pension, and then the goalposts changed. The other thing everyone forgets is that older women were paid less than men. In the first job I got in a factory, all the women were automatic as new starters were given a lower paid job than the same age new starters men. That was very common. We simply didn't have the earnings to save as much money for a pension. And to add to that, we were told that if you had an employers pension your NI would be slightly reduced to encourage you to pay into a private pension. Then recently the government said those who paid less NI receive a smaller state pension. We have been conned, totally conned.

And yes I know the idea is we should all move into more suitable jobs as we get older. Honestly, it is hard getting a job in an area you haven't worked in before as you get older. Most employers want to hire young people for entry-level jobs.

@julieca A quick google tells me that women were made aware in 1995 that the retire age would change from 60. They gave at least 15 years notice of this.

Despite women earning less, I still believe that any contribution, however small throughout a person's working life needs to be made.

There have been times where myself and my DCs have really gone without, but despite this I have continued to make my pension contributions.

As for most employers hiring young for entry level jobs, that's not my experience. Retraining isn't always easy but it's often an option.

@ftw163532 I totally agree. I know a 65 year old man who is waiting for a knee replacement. Hes always done physical jobs. Which is why he needs a knee replacement now.

He was always quite fit but has now put on weight while waiting.

@MorningNinja Does that include the key workers we were encouraged to clap like seals for. They cant eat applause.

@MorningNinja that isnt true. That is when it was first talked about in parliament. Women were not individually told. Anyone who did not follow discussions in parliament did not know till later.
I have retrained, I am in my later sixties. I can tell you that although I have got a job, some places will not look at an older employee doing an entry level job, they simply wont.
And no there is no point in a private pension unless it reaches a certain level of payout. Otherwise benefits will make up your income anyway. People with very small private pensions are often worse off than those with no private pension.

@MorningNinja okay you are right law changed in 1995. We still all have a long history of lower pay than men. I started full-time work at 16 and as I said earlier was paid less than 16-year-old boys in the same factory. We always had less disposable income to pay into pensions.

@julieca My DM paid something called "half stamp" thats what she called it. A con is what my dad called it.

Yes half stamp was a con.
But I am not talking about that. I would have liked to have paid my full NI, I couldn't. If you were in an employers pension you got reduced NI contributions. It was said at the time this was to encourage people to save in private pensions. Then about 5 maybe more years ago, the government said these people were entitled to less pension as they had not paid full NI contributions, with no option to make them up. I saved in an employers pension and will have less state pension as a result. There is zero I can do about it. My friend who has barely worked will get more state pension than me.

@MercyBooth It includes everyone - I say that as a key worker myself.

@julieca, thankfully things have significantly improved. The workplace is so much better for women in 2021...although more improvements can and should be made.

@MorningNinja yes they have. But older womens pensions are affected by that discrimination. The pay gap used to be much higher and we didn't even have a minimum wage.
But suddenly we have an equal pension age with men as if we had an equal chance to build up a pension. We didn't. Its why most poor pensioners are women.
I know nobody cares though. I am resigned to working till 67 and struggling on and being poor in my old age. My loved ones will care but no one else gives a shit about poor older people.

I have had a few ordinary jobs in my life, some requiring hard and difficult work. I worked until I was 68, and I am now 79, and just receive the state pension.

I am in no way worn out at this age, and in good health, and not visited a GP. for about 28 years. I spend a lot of time, doing up my little old house here, and gardening, and also do a garden for another person. I just live alone, well with three cats.

I took early retirement from a stressful job in the public sector. I wasn't on my feet all day doing a physical job but, my god was it stressful. I think people underestimate how awful it is to feel constantly stressed. I used to hope that something would happen to me so that I didn't have to go to work, well something did happen, I became ill mentally and that put paid to being able to work.

I agree completely that 67 is much too old for retirement. I now have severe arthritis and I would never have been able to work the way I feel physically.
BTW, if I hear one more person say 'I thrive on stress' I will scream. And another thing, it's the government's fault that they couldn't sort out investing the NI contributions so that the state pension self funds.

All very well telling people to "take responsibility" when they can't fucking afford to.

Retail is widely accepted as a low paid job - can't see how someone couldn't do that in their 60s so I think your logic flawed

I think you are right OP. But the Governnent would rather people work until they drop dead.

Hi OP. I saw some stats on the difference between life expectancy and disability free life expectancy according to socioeconomic status and region of the UK. Some people in some areas are not necessarily living significantly shorter lives, but are, as you are observing, living with disabilities from an earlier age.

And some are living shorter lives. Life expectancy varies by ten years depending on where you live in the UK.

i believe my colleague has 2 years to go,
it is so tough for her,
her hands ache

other colleagues nearing retirement also make mistakes which are not helpful to the rest of us

My interpretation of the situation is that government want folk to pop their clogs before state pension entitlement age so that's one less person to cough up for. That's why they keep raising the age of retirement. First 65, now 70, next it will be 75 then 80.....

@ElftonWednesday

I think you are right OP. But the Governnent would rather people work until they drop dead.

This