The fairytale of New York, do you find the lyrics offensive?

[Sfuandtired]

I’m Sat listening to the usual bleeped out version of the song on one of the music channels, and thinking as I usually do why do they not leave ‘those’ parts in? Surely it’s just a song? Does anyone actually find it that offensive?

@AmazingBouncingFerret

Good God, could we at least get the “Halloween is begging” and “fireworks should be banned, my pet goldfish shat itself in fright” threads out of the way before fairytale of New York. It messes with my internal clock.

No, my mother's family were Irish, and it was always the case that we would be called' a lazy faggot'. It was just a word to mean someone who was untidy and slatternly in their habits. I realize that words change their meaning but sometimes looking at where words are from would resolve so many issues.

@Fenelladepompom

Not offensive to me, but I'm ancient so accept others will feel differently. "Young Girl" otoh, how the hell does that still get played occasionally?! Great tune, but seriously ...

I sort of understand that but really isn't that song about a man being responsible? Realising a girl wasn't of age so stops any shenanigans?

Young girl? I always believed the song was telling her to stop going after him sort of victim blaming

@LoislovesStewie

No, my mother's family were Irish, and it was always the case that we would be called' a lazy faggot'. It was just a word to mean someone who was untidy and slatternly in their habits. I realize that words change their meaning but sometimes looking at where words are from would resolve so many issues.

^ This.

There's no way that my Irish relatives were calling kids cheeky faggots in the homophobic sense, over 50 years ago. It was likely derived from the "useless/lazy" etymology. Like the usage screenshot here, from the Oxford English Dictionary.

It as an insult for a long time in Ireland and Britain with no homophobia - it was originally a misogynistic insult directed at women and sometimes extended to men, animals, children (though more affectionately that way). It was in use in that sense from the 18th century (maybe the 16th) until at the mid-to-late 20th century, which fits with the timeline of the FTONY characters.

From the OED (meaning 8):
. Chiefly Irish English, Scottish, and English regional. derogatory. A woman, esp. one considered to be troublesome, useless, or slatternly; frequently with modifying adjective, as old faggot, lazy faggot, etc. Often as a term of abuse or contempt.

I can understand someone taking offence if they haven't done their homework, but most haven't.

I don't find it offensive but do agree that it's a complete pile of shite and would happily never listen to it again.

...and the OED meaning for when it's about a child:

. English regional (southern and south-eastern), Scottish, and Irish English (northern). A naughty or mischievous child, esp. in young faggot, little faggot, etc. Frequently as a term of rebuke or reproach.

I don’t find it offensive however I can understand that others might and therefore can see why they censor the f word. Slut I am completely unbothered by in this song.

As an aside, it’s October! Why were they playing Christmas songs?

No.

But then I'm heterosexual so can't speak for whether it is offensive for gay people.

Yes I do. The word fa* has no place on the radio today when used as a homophobic slur. Also don’t want my kids hearing the word arsehole on the radio tbh

Love the song, hate all this beeping parts out.

@AmazingBouncingFerret

Good God, could we at least get the “Halloween is begging” and “fireworks should be banned, my pet goldfish shat itself in fright” threads out of the way before fairytale of New York. It messes with my internal clock.

Here, here!

It's one of my favourites. My mum's too. We've been to New York at Christmas time and the song goes nicely with our memories. I find Cliff Richard far more offensive. He should be banned at Christmas, not Fairytale of New York.

If they need to beep that what would they do with this.

I'm a man and that word could be used against me. Yes it is homophobic. I've been out at christmas and when that song comes on a large number of people in the pub/bar scream "Faggot" at the top of their voice at that bit. They're either doing it because they're upset at an old Irish word... ...that's bollocks. They're doing it because they don't like LGBT people.

This thread is a lot of people who aren't in a protected minority telling people who are that they're wrong to be offended by a word. Not a good look.

I love the song. It's my favourite Xmas song. Not offended.
My family had faggots for dinner last week
YABvvvvU to listen to Christmas songs in October.

It’s of it’s time. I can only wonder what will be deemed offensive in another 30 or so years time.

Why is everyone courteously leaving it up to gay men to be offended?

Has anyone even mentioned "slut"? We are allowed take offence on our own behaves rather than meekly make sure everyone is is happy first.

That said no, the words are used in a story, and two drunks fighting at Christmas is in no way aspirational.

I don't think people thunder out the faggot word because they like the excuse of getting a dig in at the LGB crowd. You hear the same with songs that have any other curse word in as well. People just like bellowing bad words.

Not offensive at all. My favourite Xmas song.

Not remotely offended by it but after all these years I'm just bored of it.

It doesn't offend me at all in the context. I actually think it's a great piece of characterisation - the roughness of the characters with each other and his ultimate affection for her. The last verse is really touching.

Offensive to my ears, god awful song. I have no idea how it became so popular.

I love this song, never get bored of listening to it.
No, l don't find it offensive.

I'm not bothered by the song but this is great!
"you scumbag, you maggot, you taped over Taggart..."