could really do with some help, DS (21) car accident, not covered on insurance

[dizzycatdance2]

Hi

Yesterday my DS pulled out at a junction, got hit by another car.
Coming back from work to walk his dog.

Put claim through on insurance, turns out only had insurance for pleasure and social.

What can he do ?

Its going to cost £1,000s isn't it

MIB will not deal with this. That's for when you're hit by someone completely uninsured, not RTA or Article 75 insurers.

We had similar with my son. He’s 21 and so I left him to do the insurance calls. They were so unhelpful and told him he wasn’t covered. I then sat with him and we rang back and I spoke on his behalf. Issue solved. Yes their old enough but sometimes in life you need someone in your corner. Phone back and don’t take no as an answer. Escalate as far as you can go.

I really dont understand why this involves you so much?

It's his car. It's his insurance. He spoke to the insurance company himself and they told him that he is not covered. What exactly is it you are scared to tell him? He knows it all. Has he not figured out for himself that he needs to pay the damages?
What is it that you need to tell him?

@TheWoleb

I really dont understand why this involves you so much?

It's his car. It's his insurance. He spoke to the insurance company himself and they told him that he is not covered. What exactly is it you are scared to tell him? He knows it all. Has he not figured out for himself that he needs to pay the damages?
What is it that you need to tell him?

It involves her so much because shes his mom, he lives at home, has had his first car accident and is asking her for help and advice and she wasn't sure what advice to give him. Relax...

@girlmom21

It's concerning the amount of people who don't realise that 'commuting' and business insurance are different and that 'social, domestic and pleasure' doesn't cover commuting!

It's concerning you think that all insurance is the same. My insurance is social, domestic and pleasure and does cover commuting. The only other option available to add was business, which is not commuting but actually business use.

@ManifestDestinee generally insurers will give you all the options or they'll give you a choice of the more inclusive options, like yours.

Some people will only have options that include commuting but you won't ever only have options that exclude commuting.

I haven't misunderstood anything there...

I don’t suppose you or someone in your family is with a union? I have free legal cover for myself and family members included with my union.

OK.
Firstly your insurer will deal with the other person's claim. They are obliged to by law. In theory they could then pursue your son for reimbursement. But they are unlikely to do this seriously if he has little money or assets
However, you are not there yet.
Under the CIDRA rules, in order for them to void the policy they need to prove thar your son misrepresented the facts recklessly. IE he knew the truth and deliberately concealed it.
If your son was careless, ie didn't bother to check his understanding then they should offer to deal with the claim on a proportionate basis. Fundamentally they will assess how much premium he should have paid,calculate the underpayment and settle the claim for his car on that basis. Sometimes ( rarely now) they will deduct the additional premium. Critical to this though is that they must have been willing to insure the risk. Ie if they can prove that they would never have quoted him for commuting, they have a get out of jail free card.
You need to read up very carefully indeed and take the matter through the entire complaints procedure and then on the Financial Ombudsman Service. Do not accept what the insurer says if they offer you anything other than a proportionate settlement.
Have a look at the FOS website which might give you some guidance.

Insurers will cover any claim presented by the other driver in the first instance as per their RTA obligations.

Whether they will seek to make a recovery is likely to depend on whether they take the view that OPs son has deliberately taken out cover at a lower level, in the knowledge this wouldn't cover his usage (they would look at any info supplied online, in calls etc). Also another factor is whether SDP & C cover would have been offered to him by that insurer - if it is not a risk they would have taken given age/ occupation then again he might be in difficulties.

The above won't affect them paying out the TP claim but it may mean they seek a recovery. They could also cancel his policy if they feel he's acted deliberately and this could mean he faces increased premiums in future (as you are required when taking out insurance to advise not only of any accidents but also any policies cancelled or refused).

His best bet is to be as honest with his insurers as possible and hope they accept it was a mistake, and are able to extend cover subject to payment of an additional premium.

If he has a receipt or proof of purchase from the shop he went into he may be covered. The commuting part was travelling from work. If he stopped at a shop first and then went on to home that section of the journey is no longer commuting from work. Has he got anything?

I would do the same as lateSeptember and call on your ds’s behalf. I know this is an easy mistake. But the onus should be on the insurer to make clear commuting to a place of work is not included. It definitely used to be years ago.

thanks again for al the advice , it will all work itself out, a lesson learned, but its going to be an expensive one. but, no one hurt so , I , and he, will continue to count our blessings

@dizzycatdance2

thanks again for al the advice , it will all work itself out, a lesson learned, but its going to be an expensive one. but, no one hurt so , I , and he, will continue to count our blessings

It may not be any more expensive than replacing your son's car.

Posted too soon!

However, that depends on whether the insurer repudiates and acts as RTA insurer, and if they do this properly.

Your DS needs to not just accept this.

My sympathies, OP, and I hope all goes smoothly and as painlessly as possible.

Thanks, @gobbynorthernbird. DS already checked the policy. There is no definition of SDP, commuting etc in the policy.

We had the same issue with there being no definition of "student accommodation" in our household insurance policy that ended up having to be referred to the underwriters for clarification.

If you've ever used a comparison site to get an insurance quote, they do ask the question. What type of cover do you need, it's one of the options.

I really haven't ever been asked about commuting when getting quotes by phone, BarbaraofSeville, so I could have easily fallen into the same trap as OP's son and assumed that SDP includes commuting as some insurers do include it (and they all used to I am old). I always read the policy but as I just said, DS has checked his, and it doesn't actually define SDP or specifically mention commuting.

it can be very confusing , especially , as another poster said, when its all online there isn't any one to say " so , you don't use it for work ?" etc etc

I used to travel to schools as part of my own business years ago and only got the correct policy by talking the scenario through with a real person e.g. not "using" my vehicle for my work but using it to GET to various places of "work". That just isn't covered on an online form.

@chesirecat99

I had no idea and neither did DP but we both WFH. Commuting certainly was included in SDP last time I commuted. I have never been asked about commuting when I've changed insurer either...

I hope all works out ok for your DS, OP. You may have just saved my similar aged DS from the same mistake. He needs to start using his car to drive to university work placements so he is going to check he will be covered tomorrow.

Would you have any idea, @Nookable? He is in full time education but needs to drive to multiple different work placements as part of his course for the next 2 years. So, for example, 2 weeks driving to one location 3 or 4 times a week, then maybe no driving for a month, then a month driving to a different location daily, followed by a couple of days a week at another location etc He gets paid travel expenses but isn't paid for the placement, so it isn't work in that sense.

Sorry to @ you, Nookable, it's just that I suspect the insurance company may struggle to understand the situation exactly so he might need to use the correct terminology. It took me weeks to get the same company to clarify whether the university cover on our household insurance covered students in private rentals as well as university halls as they couldn't grasp the concept that some most students rent properties on the open market.

My DD was recently in a similar position. She spoke to her insurer (Admiral) and she did need to add business use to her policy, but it was actually very cheap - something like £20.

The placements you describe are slightly different though. DD was a full-time student on an NHS placement, so driving to a healthcare setting every day, and then on to care homes/patients' homes and then back to her student accommodation each day.

As others suggest, it's worth speaking to the insurance provider and making sure the person making the call has a thorough understanding of what the placement entails.

Many years ago I was with a well known insurance company and took out my policy out over the phone. I received a cover note about a week later but never received my full policy. After several months of nagging them my full policy arrived but said that I was not covered for journeys to and from work. ( They said that I had agreed to this over the phone- I definitely had not! ) Exactly the same thing happened to a work colleague at about the same time. I would never buy any insurance from this company ever again and , from what I have found out subsequently, they had a bad reputation for this.

They usually request the person pays the increased premium that they should have been paying in order to settle the claim. I doubt they’ll say he’s uninsured, it’s a fairly minor issue. I used to do insurance claims- the real problems were people driving very modified vehicles, or dad saying they were main driver not the 17 year old who had just passed his test.

Thanks, @TranquilityofSolitude! You have answered my question perfectly. DS is a medical student on clinical placements at different hospitals/GP surgeries, although he doesn't need to make home visits like your DD, and it won't be every day, only the locations where public transport is difficult. The insurer is Admiral too.

I'll help my ds talk to the insurers tomorrow, armed with your excellent advice, MN at its finest, in addition , if this thread has highlighted this issue to others with young drivers then at least some good had come from my DS's naivety.

How can you think the fact that he stopped at a shop on the way home from work makes the journey not a commute?

I was one of the posters who didn't realise commuting wasn't a standard part of a policy. I have just checked mine as a result of this thread and I have the category: 'social, domestic and pleasure - including commuting'. Phew.

I have had to insure my car for business use before now, so I knew about that bit, but had no idea you could take out a social and pleasure policy only.

Every day is a school day.

Hopefully your son will be able to pay the difference to amend his policy and the insurers will be sympathetic. Horrid all round really.

I'm not sure if this will be helpful/reassuring, @dizzycatdance2, but DS just asked Admiral what cover he needs for his clinical placement travel and they said he needs to add commuting cover to his SDP policy. However, it cost the grand total of £0 . The premium stayed the same.