UK has lost 83% of its department stores?

[NotSure1542]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58331168 interesting article. As someone who is a massive fan of John Lewis - I would hate for them ot go bust! What do you think the reason behind this is?

Consumers clearly prefer online, and pandemic has just accelerated that trend.

My main concern is Amazon’s unfair advantages vs competitors of all sizes.

Our local JL which was purposely built has closed permanently. It was constantly busy so I'm not sure what happened. Their customer service was shit the last time I bought a large item though so that maybe a factor

Department stores are an outmoded form of commerce.

It takes me 30 minutes plus to get to John Lewis, parking in city centre is a hassle and expensive. They didn't have the vacuum cleaner I was eager to buy. I went home and got it online.

We've lost John Lewis and Debenhams here. It's a shame for the staff but I never went in them (although debenhams was good for the odd xmas present)

I too am an avid fan of John Lewis. I recently moved and 90% of the stuff I've bought for my home is from John Lewis . Admittedly, I also bought pretty much everything online bar a few things from their [John Lewis] website after going into my JL local branch to see what it looks like as I get more air miles through an online portal than I would if I were to buy it in store. Maybe that's part of the reason? I often feel quite bad for buying online as I think I'm part of the reason for the demise of the High Street.

I've always thought that department stores in city centres are a bit silly. I think retail parks are the perfect example of how a department store can thrive. M&S have left my local town centre in favour for the out-of-town retail park and it's heaving constantly. Birmingham's John Lewis was plocked in the middle of a busy railway station - so most of their footfall would have been railway passengers. How many of them would really be buying anything awkward and taking it home with them on the train? Also parking there was so expensive - it's no wonder they closed down. I personally would have never bought anything from the Birmingham branch as it's just too awkward to carry anything from the store to my car.

I hate, hate, hate buying clothes online. I like to try things on as sizing and cut can vary hugely, l like to feel fabrics and see how they drape, and I find that colour is often hugely misleading on screen (I also find sending things back a huge faff).

But I don't think I'm representative of the clothes buying market any more.

I guess for other stuff it's the same, and I'm certainly guilty of getting an idea that I want some household item, going straight on my phone and ordering from Amazon so I'm definitely contributing to the death of the high street.

I'd be gutted if we lost our John Lewis, but I probably had only been in Debenhams once a year if that in the last few years.

I stopped using them years ago. They were from a past era where you had plenty of time to browse and wonder around, and simply not suited to the modern world of shopping in your lunch hour or being restricted by the car park limits.

The last time I went into one, Debenhams I think, I just wanted a pair of "normal" jeans. I had to trail from one "franchise area" to another, to look at each's jeans selection. I kept asking staff if they had any "normal" jeans, but just gots lots of blank faces and vague suggestions of trying x franchise. After about an hour of not finding any "normal" simple jeans, I'd lost the will to live and headed out, and just out of the corner of my eye, I saw a random rail of jeans in a corner behind a pillar - they were the "normal" jeans, barely visible. That's an hour of my life I lost!

The other thing is the lack of stock. 20 or 30 years ago, the High Street stores would be packed to the rafters with stock, usually 2 or 3 levels high. I remember having to got shop assistants to get ski jackets down for me from the top racks in C&A - more like the Sports Direct shops today with floor to ceiling racks. Now High Street stores have very little stock, so even if you find something you like, the chances they have your size and preferred colour is very slim indeed and the staff just tell you to order online anyway.

I thought it was more than 83%, to be honest. Department stores have not adapted to the end of style in the UK and the preference for things to be as cheap as possible.

Actually, one thing I noticed the last time I was in JL and M&S looking for clothes was a very poor range of sizes which made taking a trip in to see/try on clothes in person pretty moot.

The place was full of signs telling me that I could buy online if they didn't have what I wanted in stock...

They haven't adapted to online properly.

There's a reason Amazon is popular.
No crowds, fast delivery, first class customer service, often lower prices, subscribe and save and they'll make a charitable donation on your behalf with their Smile program.

So, let's say I need a bag of cat food, a pair of new shorts, 4 pack of beans and new kettle.

I can get those at a department store sure... But would I go to one when I could get them at just Tesco or Asda? Better yet would I bother getting a bus, walking from the stop to the shops, carry everything, worry about people barging me and such...

Or have a nice cuppa and a sit down for 20 minutes and browse Amazon, could have it in my hands tomorrow and a couple quid on its way to a charity.

This is sad.

I love department stores but if I am honest, I rarely buy anything there but makeup. I buy my clothes online because I can never find what I want in store even if I like looking at the clothes; but it's easier to find sales items rather than riffling through a rack. As for home items, they are often far too expensive. I bought a posh knife from Zwilling (online) at £54 for my hubby's birthday, we saw a similar looking knife from the same brand in Selfridges and it was around £100. I am not sure if it was the same knife but the store definitely didn't sell any £50. We spend ages browsing the John Lewis on Oxford Street and usually walk out empty handed or with a bunch of Waitrose groceries...

@Godwits

Department stores are an outmoded form of commerce.

It takes me 30 minutes plus to get to John Lewis, parking in city centre is a hassle and expensive. They didn't have the vacuum cleaner I was eager to buy. I went home and got it online.

Speak for yourself. I can be in my city centre and parked up in 15-20 minutes. I love a mooch around the shops when I’m in the mood. I’m lucky to live in a city which has lots of beautiful Victorian arcades as well as a big modern one.

For the past few years, including pre-Covid, the customer service has been shit in most medium-large stores. There’s never any staff around when the self-service tills don’t work (boots) and there’s never a good range of sizes on display (m&s) and if you do fine someone to ask about your size, it’s either ‘not their department) (JL) or they offer to order it in for collection in a few days (m&s).

They make it harder and harder for shopping in their poorly-lit stores to be a pleasant experience.

I’d like to think some will live on. 10 years from now we’ll be much less car dependent, city centres will become more residential and start getting local business again. Stores that have choice of sourcing can support small and sustainable suppliers and be flexible. Councils will have to re examine business rates for a new model. If you try something in a shop and then order online, that should count as a sale for the shop.

I’ve been trying to buy more sustainable/local food recently but i involves too much driving between different farm shops etc on a Saturday morning. If only there was one hub where I could get everything from small businesses… oh yes, a market.

@Hairbrush123 it's different in London cos there are so many tourists (pre covid) and also a lot of Londoners don't drive like me. Also a lot of wealthy neighbourhoods in zone 1/2 like Knightsbridge and Kensington, Chelsea, so people would use these shops as their local store..

I would find it much harder to get to a retail park! For me the main problem with in store shopping is not being able to find the items I want. I like browsing though. But the items sold in department stores aren't the cheapest and I think a lot of people are more budget conscious. The less budget conscious would rather go for independent brands like Carrie Symonds who has rejected John Lewis in favour of some indie designer who has a penchant for wicker furniture.

@OhSmellyCatSmellyCat

Our local JL which was purposely built has closed permanently. It was constantly busy so I'm not sure what happened. Their customer service was shit the last time I bought a large item though so that maybe a factor

York?

@allonlychildhamster totally agree with London.

Every time I've asked for something in a John Lewis site in the last few years, the assistant has said to me "Have you tried online?" So they did it to themselves basically.

The cafes restaurants in John Lewis used to have great food. Service and organisation poor though. Food before lockdown pretty poor compared to before. So not been in JL for about 3 years. If I wanted furniture or household stuff then I would go. Good for make up too.

It’s a catch 22 for me.

I used to love going for a wander round the shops. Find things I wouldn’t be looking for, see what the trends are etc. Also loved all the independent shops- even big centres like trafford and metro used to have areas/markets with jewellry, goth shops, that kind of thing. Couple of decent department stores like house of fraser, john lewis, debenhams, even selfridges used to have some concessions that were one offs.

Now it doesn’t matter where you go. Which city, which centre. Primark, tesco/sainsburys, claires, lush, it’s the same everywhere. So I rarely bother now, there’s never anything new and as more shops close there’s nothing to see.

I do think the department store model has had its day.

We have a relatively new John Lewis near us that went in as part of new upmarket shopping centre development. The problem is it is a very small example of a department store so it doesn't have anywhere near the product range than a bigger JL store would have and holds very limited stock quantities. It's a frustrating place to shop because they usually don't have what you want.

I think the future may be for big retailers like JL to turn their floor space into showroom setups where you can go and touch and feel products, get product advice from trained staff members and place orders that are then fulfilled by their online business model.

My local John Lewis was York (until it shut). As it’s in a retail park next to a large Next and M&S I’m still not sure why it closed.

Speak for yourself. I can be in my city centre and parked up in 15-20 minutes. I love a mooch around the shops when I’m in the mood. I’m lucky to live in a city which has lots of beautiful Victorian arcades as well as a big modern one

That sounds lovely but I hope the mood takes you frequently and that you buy as well as mooch.

@allChequerBoard is this Cheltenham? I find the store's offerings limited compared to Solihull (my local), Cribbs Causeway...

Went to John Lewis this morning, for school shoes and a new fitted sheet as one of ours has ripped. Clearly I’m the only person who didn’t know you needed to make an appointment for school shoes, so we didn’t achieve that. And they didn’t have any white cotton kingsize fitted sheets. So I came home in a rage, but will probably end up click-and-collecting from them so they won’t grasp that I did actually want to buy in person and would have browsed and possibly bought more stuff had I not reached peak irritation within minutes of arrival.