Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

2.2 billion wasted on useless ppe says report in telegraph

67 replies

Sanguinesuzy · 26/07/2021 09:52

Mind boggling amount. Not a million, 2 billion. The kind of money that funds national policies that can change lives. More than the entire schools recovery fund. One spanish intermediary was paid £38 million as commissions and delivered nothing. Now in USA. Pest control company in west sussex, no experience in ppe, produced £120 million wrongly specified ppe, but hey tory donors, no probs. Absolutely disgusting looting of the public purse but hey brexit done....

OP posts:
TheTallOakTrees · 28/07/2021 08:35

@TheQueef

If we change the name from PPE to Benefits there will be more outrage. If people thought £2.2 bill was in the grubby palm of a benny cheat there would be froth.

This is just Tories doing Tory things so it's ok.

This
Iggly · 28/07/2021 08:37

Again, irrelevant.

And even if that were true what is wrong with that?

Iggly · 28/07/2021 08:38

I was replying to @Weebleweeble and the nonsense about the unions

Naaaaah · 28/07/2021 08:46

@Iggly

Sorry *@Naaaaah* This whole thing gives me the rage 🤣
Me too.
Ooodlesofboodles · 28/07/2021 08:49

@Iggly in the context of the spending on the pandemic £2bn IS peanuts.
Also they did have PPE stockpiled and it WAS used. But it was not the ideal PPE for the pandemic we had. It was PPE for a flu pandemic as that was deemed most likely to happen.
There has not been a pandemic for 100 years. People got complacent, it is human nature. Added to which our right wing media would have crucified any gov if they stockpiled every kind of PPE for every possible pandemic. They would have called it wasteful or something.
There are many things I care about in relation to this pandemic but this isn't one of them. Dido Harding and the test and trace scandal, yes. PHE's sclerotic performance? Locking down too late? Patients being discharged to care homes with covid? Things like that makes me cross and I am looking forward to the independent review. But the PPE, no.

Thank god for Kate Bingham and Sarah Gilbert is all I can say.

Orf1abc · 28/07/2021 08:49

Actually the unions would have been a strength on Labour's side not a weakness. It's perfectly possible to protect workers rights (and health) at the same time as producing high quality output. Added to which, the unions have contacts at all of the UK's manufacturing companies, they wouldn't need to be fishing about for random suppliers with zero experience.

The unions could have also helped by negotiating a workable self isolation plan, meaning workers could afford to stay home and not further spread the virus. They offered to support the Conservative government with this, and with managing the issue in schools, supporting NHS workers and their mental health, but they've been ignored. I guess they didn't have the right email address to get noticed?

LemonRoses · 28/07/2021 08:51

Weebleweeble That’s not really relevant and on point, is it?

It’s like saying Harold Shippman wasn’t a bad because someone else might have given opiate overdoses if they’d been the GP.

Tory corruption has led to very high numbers of excess deaths. It has led to further polarisation of wealth in the UK. It has led to control of the media, to removal of democracy and to a huge financial hit for ordinary businesses .

Orf1abc · 28/07/2021 08:52

in the context of the spending on the pandemic £2bn IS peanuts.

Then why didn't they introduce a self isolation payment that covered everyone, and not limit it to a very small group? People can't afford to live in £100 a week, especially when they've had repeated isolations. Better support would have stopped people feeling they had no choice but to go to work.

LemonRoses · 28/07/2021 08:52

[quote Ooodlesofboodles]@Iggly in the context of the spending on the pandemic £2bn IS peanuts.
Also they did have PPE stockpiled and it WAS used. But it was not the ideal PPE for the pandemic we had. It was PPE for a flu pandemic as that was deemed most likely to happen.
There has not been a pandemic for 100 years. People got complacent, it is human nature. Added to which our right wing media would have crucified any gov if they stockpiled every kind of PPE for every possible pandemic. They would have called it wasteful or something.
There are many things I care about in relation to this pandemic but this isn't one of them. Dido Harding and the test and trace scandal, yes. PHE's sclerotic performance? Locking down too late? Patients being discharged to care homes with covid? Things like that makes me cross and I am looking forward to the independent review. But the PPE, no.

Thank god for Kate Bingham and Sarah Gilbert is all I can say.[/quote]
This is absolute nonsense, I’m afraid.

Oblomov21 · 28/07/2021 08:53

This is a disgrace. Why isn't it being more widely reported?

Ooodlesofboodles · 28/07/2021 08:55

Wonderful debating skills you have there @LemonRoses. Unfortunately it's not.

Iggly · 28/07/2021 08:57

[quote Ooodlesofboodles]@Iggly in the context of the spending on the pandemic £2bn IS peanuts.
Also they did have PPE stockpiled and it WAS used. But it was not the ideal PPE for the pandemic we had. It was PPE for a flu pandemic as that was deemed most likely to happen.
There has not been a pandemic for 100 years. People got complacent, it is human nature. Added to which our right wing media would have crucified any gov if they stockpiled every kind of PPE for every possible pandemic. They would have called it wasteful or something.
There are many things I care about in relation to this pandemic but this isn't one of them. Dido Harding and the test and trace scandal, yes. PHE's sclerotic performance? Locking down too late? Patients being discharged to care homes with covid? Things like that makes me cross and I am looking forward to the independent review. But the PPE, no.

Thank god for Kate Bingham and Sarah Gilbert is all I can say.[/quote]
To you it’s peanuts because they wasted so much more on other things like Track and Trace.

But it’s important to remember that £2,200,000,000 is not peanuts.

Notonthestairs · 28/07/2021 09:13

"People got complacent, it is human nature"

Thing is we don't pay the Government to be complacent, especially regarding public health.

We had a few weeks of warning - China and Italy were significant warning signs. We knew that the PPE stored in warehouses was already out of date.

I don't know when we started contacting UK and NI based manufacturers but I think it is a fair guess to say it was later than it could have been.

And we still couldn't afford to extend FSM.

Damn right I'd roast Labour if they had performed the same.

BigGreen · 28/07/2021 09:33

Ditto! This isn't about party politics, I'd be up in arms if Labour had been so outrageously cronyist.

LemonRoses · 28/07/2021 09:45

@Ooodlesofboodles

Wonderful debating skills you have there *@LemonRoses*. Unfortunately it's not.
Let’s both explain what was stockpiled, how it was the wrong PPE, where it was used and who had oversight of that. Do let’s explain the differences and similarities of influenza transmission and Coronavirus transmission.

You first.

TheQueef · 28/07/2021 13:59

Dido getting the Test and Trace gig with her track record is a perfect example.
We are reaping what we've sown, this is the result of 10 years of rich, capitalist, shady fuckers running the country. Being in the right WhatsApp group the key to everything leaving us with incompetent people in critical roles.
Opposition should be romping ahead but instead it's eating it's own tail out there on the left, just not a viable choice.

I live in hope that the grown ups will appear soon.

LemonRoses · 28/07/2021 14:30

OK - no response so I shall go firs.t

The claim Also they did have PPE stockpiled and it WAS used. But it was not the ideal PPE for the pandemic we had. It was PPE for a flu pandemic as that was deemed most likely to happen.

The reality There were no gowns, visors, swabs or body bags in the government's pandemic stockpile when Covid-19 reached the UK. Vital items were left out of the stockpile when it was set up in 2009 and that the government subsequently ignored a warning from its own advisers to buy missing equipment.
The expert committee that advises the government on pandemics, the New and Emerging Respiratory Virus Threats Advisory Group (Nervtag), recommended the purchase of gowns in June 2019.

Gowns were one of the items in shortest supply in the UK in 2020 and became difficult to source because of the global shortage of PPE. That UK shortage could have been avoided.

Millions of FFP3 respirator masks are unaccounted for. There were 33 million on the original 2009 procurement list for the stockpile, but only 12 million have been handed out. The government refuses to explain where the other masks have gone. We sourced a supply for the two GP practices where our daughter and son in law work without any problem. Unfortunately, many NHS staff had to compromise their safety because the government favoured contracts didn't supply them in sufficient numbers after shortfall was identified.

It was not ideal PPE, so not suitable for Coronavirus It is certainly true that the government said the stockpile was designed for a flu pandemic and that Covid-19 is a different disease with a higher hospitalisation rate. Thta rather fails to address or explain the failings though. A higher hospitalisation rate and higher mortality would need more, not necessarily a different type. Body bags are sadly needed whatever the pathogen causing death. Cygnus estimated a 2.5% death rate and 750, 000 deaths. Coronavirus deaths are approaching 130,000 in the UK, so significantly less than predicted by Cygnus. You'd think therefore that appropriate planning from the exercise findings would have informed stock levels and that would have probably given us almost twice the amount of PPE required. Instead we had serious shortfalls.

As to the type of PPE needed, the DHSC are clear that the stocks held were inadequate rather than ' the wrong sort'. I refer you to the national Personal Protective Equipment (PPE) Strategy for full details and a link to the guidance hub. The same equipment is needed and used across health and social care settings - although staff working in areas where there are aerosol generating procedures occurring may need additional levels of protection.

That bit about no pandemic for over a 100 years isn't accurate either.
Lets think about seasonal Flu. In 2017-2018 in USA alone about 95,000 people died. Swine Flu in 2009 saw nearly half a million deaths globally. Measles has seen global pandemics with the richer nations protected. Similarly it is likely that Covid19 will continue to mutate and it is possible that will have ongoing epidemic problems caused by a lack of sharing of vaccines. Silly behaviour to not share as rapidly as possible with the poorer nations.

New posts on this thread. Refresh page
Swipe left for the next trending thread