The counsellor turned me away today.

[Nopleaseno]

I have PND and health anxiety. It’s taken me a long, long time to accept this and reach out for help. I’d say the depression started during my first pregnancy with my 2.5 year old and never really got better. It’s worsened since my 11 month old was born and I’ve just ended up totally cracking recently, lockdowns have amplified this.

I first reached out for help about 6 weeks ago, I self referred online and they called me back to complete the process the following day which I found impressive. It was a big step for me but I knew I desperately needed the help. She asked me to choose between depression and anxiety, as in which did I find more debilitating because they couldn’t offer help for both. I went with HA because I was struggling to control the worry and I’d been convincing myself I had breast cancer to an extent I was terrified to touch my own breasts or armpits in the shower. She sent me lots of online modules to complete which I did in about two hours and that was supposed to help me… It really didn’t so I had to ask whether there was another option at all because I didn’t feel CBT was the solution (I’ve tried it in the past and didn’t find it helpful then either which I did tell her at the time). She ummed and ahhed and had to speak to her supervisor. She did a second self referral phone call with me based around the depression side of things and decided I fit the bill for another type of counselling. I went to the top of the waiting list automatically because I have a baby so I didn’t have to wait long for an appointment.

This morning I had my first telephone appointment with the counsellor. I was incredibly nervous and worked up beforehand, I didn’t know what to expect. I have my baby and toddler at home with me which I can’t really change, DH works FT and we don’t have any family close by to help out. A few minutes into the phone call my baby woke up and cried a little so I picked him up and the counsellor immediately shut down on me. He said he wouldn’t speak to me unless he had my full undivided attention. I had to tell him I’d never be able to offer this because I have a baby and toddler with me 24/7 but he still insisted therapy will never work if I’m not 100% committed to it.

Long story short, he refused to help me and has put me back on the waiting list for a different counsellor with an evening appointment so DH could watch our DC. He doesn’t know how long the wait will be, only that I’m still at the top of the waiting list because I have a baby. He was quite stand-offish with me and I started to cry so wanted to get off the phone ASAP. Sat and had a cry for a bit because I just feel totally helpless. I’m not sure why I’m reaching out here, I’m just struggling so much and don’t know where to turn. I don’t know what else I can do really. I feel like I’ve asked for help and it just hasn’t really happened so I feel totally deflated. Is there anyone else I can talk to? I don’t know what to do.

@MarkRuffaloCrumble

That’s awful. What an unsympathetic twat he was. At least now though you can find someone a bit more empathetic as he clearly has no idea of the reality of life as a mum of young DC and would probably have done a shit job of counselling you.

Hope you find someone else ASAP.

If you have the energy to complain about his attitude please do. Even if you can understand why he said he needs your full attention he could still have done some work with you today and then asked to move your appointment to a time it would suit you next time. What a dick.

Could not agree more with all of this!

Assuming you're not working, it's reasonable to assume you are looking after your baby so it's a bit dim he didn't realise that

It really isn't. It's patently obvious that you can't conduct a counselling session over the noise of a crying baby and active toddler. He reasonably assumed that OP would know that.

That's rubbish for you. I hope you find something else soon. x

There was charity near me who did counselling with childcare alongside and if your baby was crying too much in the other room they would just bring him/her in to you and you could continue the session. I feel lucky this was an option. It shouldn’t have been a charity to realise this need though, it should have been the NHS. Maybe there is something near you that’s similar. The charity also put me on to some free drop in crèche facilities elsewhere in case I needed that. Again, worth a google.

I don't know if my advice is any good, but I took 'easier' way and asked for medication, not therapy sessions, as I didn't want to wait (I had 1,5yo by then). I am not saying you should do the same, but consider it. Life will get easier when children start school, you will meet other parents, but until then you will be stuck at home, mostly on your own, as not a lot of friends around (you said you moved away from everyone not long time ago), baby groups are not what they used to be pre-covid, husband is working- how exactly few sessions with a therapist going to help you? Maybe, try to combine medication and online sessions? I felt better after couple weeks after starting anti-anxiety meds, felt as if weights lifted off my shoulders. 3 months was enough for me.

Think about that. Good luck.

It's certainly possible to come off antidepressants so don't let this put you off. I've weaned down to 1/3 dose successfully after taking antidepressants for pnd and will stop completely soon

@Kobayashi21

Assuming you're not working, it's reasonable to assume you are looking after your baby so it's a bit dim he didn't realise that

It really isn't. It's patently obvious that you can't conduct a counselling session over the noise of a crying baby and active toddler. He reasonably assumed that OP would know that.

People with severe anxiety and depression aren't always thinking straight. If he'd outlined his expectations before the session, this could have all been avoided

OP hd already talked to someone else multiple times, who probably should have outlined the requirements.
Since this was the first time he spoke to OP, he let her know within 5 minutes the expectations. How much quicker do you think he could have been?

Some private mental health professional offer discounted slots for people in their area - it might be worth looking into their websites if money is an issue for private care.

Please consider medication. I took it for PND and I was able to come off it no problem when I was feeling better. It really helped me and enabled me to do all the other things I really needed to do like exercise and take better care of myself.
It's important to taper the dose at the end rather than go cold turkey (doctor will advise you) but it's totally possible to stop taking them when you have recovered.

I cannot even have a decent conversation with a friend while the dog is whinging at me to play a ball game.

Counselling involves you in hard emotional work and you need to be able to concentrate. I expect you know this. You really need child care whilst you do your counselling session.

This morning I had my first telephone appointment with the counsellor. I was incredibly nervous and worked up beforehand, I didn’t know what to expect.

I think it's cruel when this happens & then you get let down. They should've made sure you had childcare organised before the session took place. Some counsellors & organisations don't seem to take into account the enormous psyching up & girding of the loins which goes on before you interact with a counsellor for the first time.

I had it repeatedly when I tried to get post-life-event counselling some years ago. I would be put on a waiting list with no priority, wait months & finally get a date for the first session. Tension rose as the date got nearer, I'd force myself to go - & then get let down as one counsellor told me she wouldn't see me after that day as her client list was full (so why not do something about that BEFORE I turned up?), another took me in at a glance, as women do, noted that I was wearing the same style of clothes as she was & told me, "There can't be much wrong with you because you look alright" - !! - before jettisoning me & shoving me onto another waiting list. Another time, when I wasn't near the top of the queue, I was phoned out of the blue & asked to come in the next day, because a client had just refused to work with one of the counsellors & they couldn't let a slot go unused. It was ludicrous & very cruel.

However....

I don't want to put you off as that was 20 years ago, & you're being offered things very quickly & have been prioritised. I hope you get a new appointment soon, & I hope things work out with your new counsellor. All the best.

@MartyHart

Please consider medication. I took it for PND and I was able to come off it no problem when I was feeling better. It really helped me and enabled me to do all the other things I really needed to do like exercise and take better care of myself. It's important to taper the dose at the end rather than go cold turkey (doctor will advise you) but it's totally possible to stop taking them when you have recovered.

^^ this 100% I came off meds easily by tapering. My GP prescribed them in liquid form, so it was easy to decrease gradually.

All of this sounds so wrong, I'm so sorry

Asking YOU to decide whether you have anxiety or depression? That's ridiculous, not only because they often go together but because people should not be diagnosing themselves

They should have indicated you needed childcare, that is not obvious when it's a telephone appointment

It may not be ideal to have a therapy session with a baby in hand but it's better than nothing, it's better than fobbing off a struggling woman and making her feel worse. The first appointment is mostly 'getting to know you' anyway. It's not like every moment of every session is ultra-emotional.

I would also encourage you to go private if you can.

You really do have to give counselling your full, undivided attention for it to have any real value. Half concentration is a waste of their resource and your time too.

Thank you all for your advice. I won’t be complaining about the counsellor and I do appreciate that I should have asked whether they had evening/weekend slots beforehand so DH could watch our DC. I haven’t had therapy for years so I wasn’t aware they offered evening sessions, I wrongly assumed it would just be regular working hours.

It all could have been avoided if they’d told me beforehand not to have my children in the vicinity and that they offered evening and weekend sessions. It does take a lot just to even ask for the help in the first place and I do feel like I’ve been knocked back although appreciate it’s just my mentality right now because I’m depressed, I know it isn’t personal.

I’m seeing the GP on Monday morning to talk through medication options so maybe that will be the route I go down. I do feel like a bit of a fool for expecting it to work with my DC around now, I just didn’t think straight and have been desperate for some sort of help for so long. Thank you all again.

Asking YOU to decide whether you have anxiety or depression?

It was difficult to decide between the two. I have both conditions and was essentially put on the spot forced to choose which I found worse. Both are equally bad and go hand in hand really . Just hope I’m not on the waiting list too long.

If it helps at all, anti depressant medication isn’t addictive. If it was, drug dealers would sell it, as they do with street drugs and painkillers. They don’t have a market for it!

It is important to reduce anti depressants very slowly (so by a fraction at a time, over weeks) and to stay on them for at least 6 months before cutting down, to avoid rebound depression.

Sorry to hear that you are on another waiting list for counselling. Would it be helpful to listen to podcasts or perhaps Headspace in the meantime?

I hope you are not paying for this shit. He sounds useless.

@Kobayashi21

OP hd already talked to someone else multiple times, who probably should have outlined the requirements. Since this was the first time he spoke to OP, he let her know within 5 minutes the expectations. How much quicker do you think he could have been?

Well the person she spoke to should have outlined the requirements then. You can't assume knowledge, that's unfair and not very helpful.

I don't know who you've been speaking to OP but one of my friends is a volunteer at pandas which is a specialist PND charity. All their counsellors (as far as I know) have had PND themselves so they've been where you are. I wonder if that might be helpful?

pandasfoundation.org.uk/how-we-can-support-you/

Thank you so much for that link @Clymene, I’m going to give them a call. The children’s centre aren’t running any groups right now after all so that’s another set back.

I’m only reluctant to try anti depressants because I know a couple of people who have used them for many years and seem unable to stop. When they have tried to stop they feel completely awful so they seem to have accepted they will be on them forever now. I’d prefer that not to happen ideally.

I wouldn't have expected them to tell you that it wasn't appropriate to have a counselling session with your child present. That is basic common sense. I think you're being a bit unreasonable about this tbh.

“Kobayashi21”
“In a less ridiculous view, he was doing his job as he is supposed to do. In the same way you couldn't bring a baby and toddler to a counsellors office and expect them to accomodate, you can't do it over the phone either. He was neither "a twat" or unempathetic, he was doing his job as he is supposed to do it.“

His job is to know how to deal with someone who has PND, a serious condition, which by necessity may well involve a woman alone with a tiny child. At the very least a gentle explanation together with suggestions for finding a way round how to speak to her when she is alone would have been in order.

I am very sorry to hear you have been experiencing such difficulties OP and hope the next counsellor will work out better.💐

You could also get in touch with your GP and tell them you don’t want the anti-depressant route.

Don’t despair. This will get better. Do try to get out for walks and keep looking out for groups and general company.

@nothingcanhurtmewithmyeyesshut I clearly lack basic common sense then.

Sorry but I am on the side of the counsellor. They are doing a job and if they can't carry it out in a professional way then they were right to end the session. But it should havd been discussed beforehand.