Do we find motherhood harder than previous generations and if so why?

[user365683]

This is just my personal experience so I could be wrong. When I first became a mum I think it shocked me how hard it was. I think the sudden change in lifestyle/lack of sleep etc. My sister has recently also had a baby and was the same. She even said to me why did no one tell her how hard it was. Our mothers response was it's not hard just different. My MIL seems to think similar. I have heard similar from other friends aswell.

So my question do you think previous generations found it easier and if so why do you think that is? Or do they just forget/look back through rose tinted glasses?

My only possible thought could be when I look at the differences between my mums parenting to mine. She apparently left me downstairs in the cot from day 1 at night. Obviously that would be considered terrible parenting now but she said it was just normal then and meant she was never sleep deprived.

Well I frequently got sent to my gran’s house round the corner, or my aunty’s house down the street, or my godmother’s house in the next street. I got taken out to play by my cousins. The teenage girl next door used to come in to play with me and feed me while my mum was busy. And there was always a mixed group of kids in the street aged between about 5 and 15, and the older ones looked after the younger ones. You would just go “out to play” and play with whoever happened to be out that day. So my parents didn’t have me all the time.

Nowadays there’s no group of kids in my street that I could send my DC out to play with, and no nearby relatives either. So for my DC to have any playmates I have to resort to paid activities, which is a whole different ball game in terms of hassle and expense.

@sqirrelfriends

Because they could do what they wanted without any internet to say not to. My mum thought nothing of letting me roam free, watch as much tv as I wanted and eat all the shit that was available in the 90's.

Parenting was a doddle, I pretty much just got left to it. No car seat, no routine and no supervision. All this and she has the gall to moan about how much tv kids watch, and how much rubbish food they eat. hmm....

Yes! This is my mother too. She’s always advising me about what I should be doing, completely ignoring how she parented!

Also women have always found it hard, they've just rarely been given a voice in the past. I think this sums it up. It’s always been hard but no one ever asked the women about it.

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants that's really interesting! Do you happen to have a link to that FT article? Would love to read.

@Stopsnowing

Kids fitted in with their parents’ eg trailing round garden centres etc. Now it’s the reverse. Parents organise their free time around their kids activities.

I don't think there is anything wrong with that tbh. Mine went to MFI sometimes for something to do if I was desperate as it was free.

Obviously did other things too

@traumatisednoodle

Isn't it good to leave them to entertain themselves for 10 minutes ?. Ds was happy in his playpen he pulled himself up on the bars, I attached various toys to it. Hours and hours obviously not but a few minutes here and there ?

I used a playpen or travel cot in the 90s. Can't see a problem as long as it wasn't for hours on end

@DazzlePaintedBattlePants

I read an interesting article on the FT which basically says that we are now less confident in society’s abilities to support our children and be healthy for them (in that society won’t provide them with a good education, affordable housing, jobs etc) so parents feel they have to be more obsessive about everything. If you don’t trust the local school, if housing’s expensive, parental engagement to ensure good outcomes is paramount.

Oh maybe I should have quoted you. But this view really stood out as I was reading the thread.

I was reading The Year of Living Danishly by Helen Russell and one of the points she makes is that Danes seem to have a high level of trust in their government, their institutions and each other. They also get 40 free hours of childcare from when their child is 6 months old. Oh and their working week is only about 35 hours. No wonder they're always ranked high ok the happy nations list.

I don’t think so, and I think all this “most women were housewives” thing is a very MC point of view.

My Granny was a single mother of 2 from the age of 22, she worked in the post office and later as a teacher in a borstal. They lived in a tenement flat in Edinburgh and didn’t always have enough to eat, let alone any mod cons.

My Grandma had 4 children, 3 of them were born in less than 3 years and for a brief period she had 3 in nappies, which all had to be soaked, hand washed, wrung out and hung by the fire to dry. She never knew how much my grandad earnt as he would give her a small allowance each week and keep the rest to himself and she worked odd jobs in shops and as a cleaner when the kids were a little bit older to help buy them clothes etc.

Wouldn’t swap with them! You keep your “village” and lack of pressure to entertain your kids, and I’ll have my contraception and washing machine, cheers.

I think they all forget! I'm sure that more people would only have one child if not!

THe main issue is that in previous generations one salary could buy a family home in most of the UK. Now both salaries are required which means many mothers work full time.

Secondly there is now a massive trend for baby led everything and anyone who thinks that sometimes the baby should fit around the family is an evil child abuser. I know it isn't popular on here but IMHO Gina Ford gets it right as she does expect a child to be in a family friendly routine from quite early on.

I don't think I do but I'm a SAHM.

I think it can be harder for those with high powered careers who want to be the best at their job and also the best mother.

I’m an 80s baby and remember my childhood being fun, mum always at home (she was on benefits), house always immaculate and as kids we had a responsibility to keep if that way. When we were at school she had the time to do what she wanted (whatever that was), clothes always cleaned, ironed and put away.

Weekends we stayed with family and mum was at home. Mum tells me she had it easy - I was one of three.

I have two, 6 and 2. My partner and I work full time in demanding roles. We are knackered. All the time.

The day starts early as both kids in nursery/school by 7.45/8.00. Rush home to do some chores whilst opening up laptop to start the day and gulping back the coffee that has gone cold! Day finishes, collect kids around 5,30 (would have been 6pm pre covid). Kids in bed by 8pm (2 year old between 6.30/7) after doing dinner, homework, bath etc.

Invariably I’ll crash on the sofa, wake up at 10am and realise there’s all the house stuff to do - clean, laundry, plan weekly shopping, bins etc. We both do this together but it’s never ending. Plus there’s the swimming lessons, crafts, games etc.

Other posters are right, it takes a village BUT when you go to have strong family or friend support you’re fucked. You outsource as much as possible, you’re stretched really thin, you’re in ground hog day.

I feel like I need a day a week off work, with an empty house just to break the back. I’m hoping as they get older this will get easier.

Secondly there is now a massive trend for baby led everything and anyone who thinks that sometimes the baby should fit around the family is an evil child abuser.

This is so true it's very sad. It is why there is so much anxiety in children and snowflakes

@Londonmummy66

THe main issue is that in previous generations one salary could buy a family home in most of the UK. Now both salaries are required which means many mothers work full time.

Secondly there is now a massive trend for baby led everything and anyone who thinks that sometimes the baby should fit around the family is an evil child abuser. I know it isn't popular on here but IMHO Gina Ford gets it right as she does expect a child to be in a family friendly routine from quite early on.

Yes.....so true!! You should breastfeed until they are at least 1, give them only organic, home made mushed up stuff, let them chuck food all over the floor whilst weaning and never ever let them cry it out.

Don't forget to read parenting books, sign them up for every extracurricular activity and do shed loads of reading and maths with them to make sure they pass their SATs at the age of 7.

Absolute bollocks, you should do whatever works for your family and yourself....

I cannot imagine that my life is harder in any way shape or form than my grandmothers. Widowed at 35, with 5 children in a remote welsh hill farm, no washing machine/fridge/freezer/tumble dryer, well water, no car, open fire for heating, cooked over traditional stove and made bread in the bread oven for the family and workman. 6 miles from the butchers. Grew fruit and veg and killed rabbits to survive in general but particularly through the war. My mum says that once a day she would put her feet up for 30 mins so that she didn’t get varicose veins.

I'm also surprised people see a playpen as bad?

Do you not think learning to keep one occupied is a very important skill to learn at a young age?

Then People wonder why the youth these days have mental a health feel lonely all the time need attention and occupying all the time.

Honestly some of the comments on this thread are different, saying older generations didn't parent! Maybe a good thing as it appears to me resilience is a life skill that seems to have totally disappeared

Like a pp I do think we are less resilient than previous generations. Since even the 80s and quite rightly so there has been more effort made in getting people to recognise their feelings, talk and more recently share them. Yes previous generations had it harder before washing machines were commonplace and disposable nappies etc. Now we have several things to make our lives easier but more mums are working and time poor.

I think more recent generations of mothers put higher expectations on themselves and there is many parents out there who feel a constant need to entertain their kids, you are neglectful if you don't fill their days with activities and open them up to different experiences.

My kids were bad sleepers, my mum tried the techniques she used with my siblings but we were all big babies and good sleepers, we drank, are and slept well. This used to leave me on my knees. I then would go to work but still did everything she would do for us but had less time to do it in. I was also older, first baby at 29 compared to her at 20 so I had less energy and was more used to focusing on myself. I had complications that she didn't in pregnancy and that for me made things more difficult. She was able to go to stay at my gran's for a month after each of her children were born so she could rest. I live too far away for that. I do not have any family help nor do I expect it but often find that I am constantly juggling. Its the life I have chosen and I am happy with it but I do find it hard sometimes and am not ashamed to say so.

Wasn’t this done a couple of weeks ago?

There are a LOT of variables.

What demographic is "previous generation"? I'm 48 so in all likelihood probably fairly close in age to your mother/mil.

Then there are cultural and socio-economic factors, health of the mother, whether dad is still in the picture...

Tons to consider.

I definitely had it harder than my mum and then mil which they both acknowledged. Starting with I had dd overseas as ex was army and that's where we were living at the time. I had a difficult pregnancy due to multiple health issues and my mum/mil sailed through their pregnancies and births. I had an emcs, lost a lot of blood, had a rare complication and dd was extremely poorly and in scbu tube fed etc.

Both mum and mil their mums and sisters came and stayed with them for a good while immediately after babies born and helped out. My mum worked and was a carer for my dad by the time I had dd and so was unable to visit at all. I barely got speaking to her on the phone as dad had a major heart attack around this time and she was tied up with that. My mil provided childcare for my ex's sisters child while sister worked and said child has sen.

Money was tight and that certainly added to stress.

No paternity leave then so ex was only able to take 2 weeks off when we got home from hospital and that was considered generous.

We'd not been living there long so no support network of friends as such, just colleagues of ex and neighbours. They were lovely in their way but they'd work and their own families to take care of.

Ex and I moved back to Uk, still not near family, he had affair and we split so then I was a single mum and that brings a whole new set of challenges...

All that said...

My mum/mil had to deal with little money coming in, husbands getting no time off around birth at all, none of the "mod cons" we have now that make life a little easier - automatic washers, dish washers, microwaves, disposable nappies, ready made formula...

Swings and roundabouts I suspect

Also older people forget! And I include myself in this. Dd is 20 now, a few of her friends their older siblings have now started having families of their own and posting on sm about the joys and challenges and there's so much I've forgotten! Plus posts on here too of course.

They generally didn’t work

See this posited often on mn

1 never been true for working class. Some may not have worked outside the home but many took on paid jobs they did from home, many did work outside the home and used informal "free" childcare by grans, maiden aunts or even worked out something with a neighbour and reciprocated - a lot of shift work and they'd work opposing shifts and cover each other's childcare

2 even among middle class a relatively recent phenomenon to never return to work after starting a family.

Parenting style - yea there was a LOT of "benign neglect" going on though I'm not convinced it was benign. Plus a lot of ACTUAL neglect. It wasn't uncommon to leave young even v young children in the care of older but not old enough siblings. My parents were both the eldest in large families and did a lot of childcare from around the age of 10/11 and didn't really have a childhood themselves.

I think in previous generations women were often more used to being around kids and babies as they were expected to help out with siblings etc.

Definitely.

I'm the eldest of 3 kids and umpteen cousins, I've been looking after babies and kids since I can remember! Albeit supervised initially (sort of!) as a result I'm used to babies and young children I'm rarely phased.

My ex was the youngest of 4 kids and the youngest cousin. Dd was the first newborn he'd ever held and he was in his late 20's when we had her! He was very nervous, very anxious about doing something "wrong" from how he held her to changing nappies, to bathing her. Much hilarity ensued as he learned these things and he'd get very apologetic to me when little mishaps occurred like
he splashed her face while bathing her and it startled her and she cried which he later described as "nearly drowned her"

I also didn't "jump" every time dd so much as murmured, I'd wait and see if she'd settle herself back first.

I've noticed it with others of my generation and definitely younger ones too, unless they too are from a large family.

Dd is an only on my side but has 5 brothers on dads now with another on the way.

But she is also the eldest cousin so she was raised used to being around my brothers and sisters kids and caring for them so she's similarly confident with babies etc

Her best friend from school is the eldest of 4 and again the eldest cousin so she's the same.

When they first became friends it puzzled many inc me and friends mum as on paper they'd nothing in common

Dd - only child, single mum, not born and raised locally, not raised Catholic...

Best friend - large family, parents married and still together, born and raised locally, raised Catholic

But when we eventually met and got chatting at a school play the other mum and I discovered they'd a lot in common -

Both used to large families, dd is from a Catholic family just not raised Catholic and the main thing - we had similar parenting styles which was a surprise as I'm 10 years older than the other mum. The girls were at this point trying to persuade each set of parents to let them do a thing that others in their group were being allowed to do by their parents and we'd both categorically said no! And for the same reason. This led to discussion on other general parenting decisions - curfew, pocket money etc and we had the same opinion on the vast majority of things. As time went on we didn't always agree but we rarely had completely different opinion/approach to parenting.

Even now there are people the girls meet locally who don't know them and the history and assume it's an "opposite attracts" thing and it's kinda become an "in joke" that they explain that they had very similar upbringings despite on paper appearing not to have

Fwiw I would have loved a big family but couldn't have any more after dd

One difference is the age of having children. The early years are tiring and broken sleep is easier to bear
At 25 than at 40.

Also true! I understand the arguments for having 1st at older age now but bodies don't evolve that quickly! It's still more risky physically and will of course be more exhausting too! In my close circle I have a range of everything from a couple who had their firsts at 15/16 then a gradual increase towards most having first around late 20's and early 30's then tapering off and a few having their first in their 40's but I have to say the majority of those who had their first in their 40's it wasn't their intention. There were different medical issues at play that led to this.

The ones in their late 30's/40's it was a shock to the system physically and they were KNACKERED! One bless her was dealing with both adopting a toddler and a HUGELY unexpected pregnancy (many years of infertility and treatments etc) and complicated birth in the same year, I dunno how she stayed upright!

I bf for first almost 10 months but not every time she cried or whimpered and I wasn't advised/pressure to either. That's tough if that's changed.

Why is it that this generation of parents think they know better than all previous generations?

I agree - not ALL parenting is better now. I've seen it in real life and on here! Parents who think it's abusive to DARE to utter the word no! Who think they have to satisfy every whim a child has, who think their needs don't matter...

Seen it said on here before and I am starting to agree - things may have swung too far in the other direction. And it doesn't do kids any good either! Kids feel secure with good boundaries and non vague parenting. I also see a lot of overly structured parenting, whereas anyone with good knowledge of child development knows that it's good for kids to have free time to explore their imagination, learn to be comfortable in their own company, not freak at the idea of being "bored"

I think it's also interesting that as parents have 'parented' more, they're more and more likely to allow their kids to shirk responsibility for their actions YES!

@TheMoth I have friends and family who are teachers and they do comment that a child who fails an exam (because they screwed about in class and didn't revise) that failure is placed on the teacher/school as if the child had NO part to play in the matter. It's not only insulting and incorrect to teachers, it's not doing the kid any favours cos unless the attitude to school/exams is sorted then that kids gonna leave school with fuck all qualifications and not be able to get a job!

We just know more about child development now and try being better.

Try being the operative word! New developments aren't always necessarily correct. Eg at one point formula was considered better for babies than breast milk based on "new research" - my mum was actually told off by hv for bf me! The theory of "learning styles" is now largely discredited. Just prior to the big Anne Diamond campaign there were still new mums being advised by midwives and hv to make sure babies were "warm enough" in their cots and bedrooms by having heating up, windows closed etc and we now know this is dangerous advice

Divorce was frowned upon as were single mums in the 70s

Single mums - still frowned upon! Not as much and maybe not as overtly but there is definitely still a stigma!

Also I'm sure a lot of baby medicines and some colic treatments had - alcohol? Which would send the baby to sleep.

That's true, it's fairly recent that this was stopped.

When mine were little we did these things, but didn't label it, and I think that puts added pressure on

Yea I think that's true. Apparently I did attachment parenting - wasn't even aware of it! Because I co-slept, fed to sleep and held her when she napped in first few months as that worked better for us. Who knew?! I certainly didn't at the time I just did what felt right and natural based on years of experience

I don’t remember most people’s houses being spotless and perfectly decorated back then which seems to be the norm now

I'd agree with that generally, but our house always had to be spotless as else mum would at least get shouted at by dad, or worse.

Then People wonder why the youth these days have mental a health feel lonely all the time need attention and occupying all the time.

Yep!

@Maireas

I've seen loads of modern playpens! They tend to be mesh and plastic rather than wood.

We had a wooden one - it was brilliant and I'm so glad we had it. Found it for sale second-hand in the local paper 20+ years ago and it was already quite old, but in good condition and worked perfectly.

My mum says she doesn’t remember doing half as much laundry as I do, and she had 3 kids to my one. I’ve thought about this.

It might just be me, but I just couldn’t put my kid in the same clothes for a week anymore like she did. We had new underwear every day, but the rest of the school uniform was washed weekly. The blazer (wool) was cleaned at mid-term only. Our play clothes were on a similar rota, then pristine Sunday clothes. She wasn’t poor or have low standards (in fact her need for tidiness is and was epic). It was just the norm in the 70’s where we lived.

Certainly my 10yo now has far more clothes and shoes overall as well. Means more maintenance, and the faff of giving them away/selling them when outgrown.

I know that I can say similar with meal prep as with laundry (and a few other things). I put more thought, more care, more science and more time in than mum ever did. I would do an ‘egg on toast’ meal every fortnight or so, whereas she did it every 3-4 days. She counted the kids’ nutrition across a week (loosely), whereas I do it more across a day (ie didn’t eat enough veg at lunch, include more at dinner).

I also am sure that school requires far more interaction from me now than my schooling did for my mum. She did a 2-hour shift at the canteen every fortnight and that was it. Unless you’d been really naughty or had an award coming, there wasn’t any communication home or reason for her to involve herself. My inbox is brimful of stuff from school I must respond to, clarify, organise around or turn up for. It’s constant! Hours a week.

I agree that also the memory of the hardship of parenting fades over time. My mum seems surprised when I mention things, things I know she did for years!