I love our NHS, I do, but OMG my experience this afternoon...

[NewMatress]

DH admitted yesterday. Long story, but he usually has his pain managed by the hospice and is generally comfortable. I gave the hospital the hospice discharge letter with a list of his prescribed meds, when he was admitted.

He's been calling me c. every hour crying with pain and begging to come home. I've spoken to the nurse in charge a number of time asking what's gone so wrong with his pain management. She's been quite rude saying that he's getting everything prescribed.

Anyway, eventually a McMillian nurse called me to check the dose as she thought the break through pain relief dose was low. It turns out they've been using a liquid with a concentrate of only 1/10 of the one he's actually prescribed. I.e his prescription is for 5ml of a 10mg per ml liquid every hour and they've been giving him 5ml of a 1mg per ml liquid.

Once we got to the bottom of that I thought he'd be more comfortable, but when I went to visit him this evening, he's still crying with pain because at 6:30 he was still waiting for the breakthrough pain relief he'd asked for at 3:30. The nurse told me it was because it needs a 2nd sign off as a controlled drug, which I understand, so get one! At which point she said well discharge yourself then. I'll get a doctor and you discharge yourself. The doctor never came, I'd love to talk to to a doctor, no one has yet been able to tell me why DH is still there, as they've established the chest pain he was admitted with is nothing more sinister than his usual cancer pain.

When he did eventually get the pain relief, both nurses were quite rude to me about my impatience and one accused me of saying I wanted her to lose her job, which was simply not true. I said I wanted her to do what was needed to get the pain relief I.e. find a second person.

Meantime, the man in the bed opposite as begging for help the whole time I was there. He has no use of his hands and no one would help him with a drink (I did) and when they brought his dinner they just left it for him with no means to actually eat it. I marked my card again by insisting that someone help him.

I'm exhausted and I'm not the one who's ill. Don't tell me everyone in the NHS is an angel. I get it's tough but this is simply not OK.

why do these threads always turn into 'all of the older nurses who trained properly are gone and care is shit because of degree nurses'?

It's a multi factorial issue. Some of the meanest nurses I've worked with have been older, not trained to degree level..some of the nicest are brand new out of university and absolutely terrified of their new role. You can't exclusively group the two apart into 'good and bad nurses'.

I consider myself a good nurse and my colleagues are, too. I find that the poor care tends to be more ward culture rather than a single nurse that is bad. If it's rotten at the top it filters down to the bottom.

Anyway, I really hope your husband is getting better care now OP. It sounds awful.

So, he's still there, I'm still not exactly sure why, but a couple of more positive developments:

• I rang the hospital based McMillan nursing team yesterday, they went to see him and were able to give me a bit more information from his notes. Why the ward couldn't, I've no idea but at least I have it now. Apparently there's a minor indication on his blood tests but her view was in his current situation they likely won't treat it and should get him home ASAP. He hopes to see a consultant today.

• he was moved to a different ward over night. I think a specialist palliative care ward. He says it was like moving from a battle zone (he's ex forces) to Narnia and everything is lovely.

Op, to transfer to private, call your insurance company and ask for the care support team. They'll help you find a hospital and consultant who will take on his care. You'd need to contact the consultant and your husband's consultant will need to agree to the move. The team will support your husband's through the move.

No one expects or wants the NHS to be put on a pedestal. Certainly not nurses. Most of us do our jobs to the best of our abilities in difficult circumstances like everyone else. We aren't angels and the majority aren't ogres either.

@Rupertpenrysmistress you sound like an amazing nurse. I know I remember nursing staff who have been compassionate with an almost reverential gratitude so I highly doubt the stories on this thread apply to you. It's just so important to get it right, and I think that's why there are strong feelings both positive and negative. If you're feeling vulnerable and someone treats you with real kindness or treats you like an inconvenience, both those experiences really stay with you.

@Claricethecat45 Your post is difficult to follow. Very “stream of consciousness” in its style. I’ll reiterate that the research exists showing wards with good staffing of degree educated nurses favours patients outcomes and decreases mortality. I think this clearly shows the importance of educating nurses to degree level.

I believe there is no actual evidence to suggest your ‘we learnt on the job’ style was better for patients, but happy to be corrected.

Do other countries with degree educated nurses have this (tired) argument? Genuine question if any MNers can shed any light.

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@Hen2018 that is appalling, I'm so sorry that your grandparents received such poor treatment may they rest in peace.

A lot of people's stories on here are quite harrowing and completely unacceptable.

My mum was chronically ill in hospital for almost 3 months a few years ago and if you sit around on wards you soon notice there is a lot that gets missed and goes wrong. It's so sad. My mum spent time in various wards and the worst are the ones where OAPs get stuck waiting for alternative options. Many are treated so badly, especially if they have no family to look out for them. Everyone needs an advocate in hospital these days. It's scary! My mum was in a bed opposite a very mentally ill lady at one point who kept swearing and shouting profusely. They did nothing. It took me to say to them that my mother was very sick and shouldn't have to put up with this. Nothing happened. I kept complaining and eventually spoke to the sister who then moved the lady into a side room. This is just one example. Every day when I turned up to see mum I had to ask if meds had been given, teeth brushed, if doc had been. I felt like we were constantly chasing the staff. It's like many of the nurses are robots and just tick the boxes without thinking. Many of them barely tick the boxes.

I don't think more funding is going to work. They have already increased funding again. It's an insane amounts yet treatments and drugs are becoming more expensive its completely unaffordable for any government to sustain. Problem is when we look at the US it quite rightly puts us off privatisation but there must be a middle ground. In a country I used to live in you pay £10 for any visit, whether it to A&E or a 3-day baby delivery. You pay for meds on top I think. I have had my fair share of health problems so I would be concerned about a fully privatised system but by making more services payable for those who can afford it to pump more money in for essential services then we should certainly be exploring those options. We should also trim down the types of free treatments that they are offering and probably make it a free service for acute health only rather than everything under the sun. It can carry on like this!

*can't

And yes Op, we shouldn't feel guilt tripped into using the preface "I love the NHS but ..." it shouldn't have been placed on such a pedestal. It's broken. I'm absolutely shocked at how GPs and many hospitals seemed to stop during covid and some GPs are continuing with restricted services. Shocking!

I'm sorry things have been so tough for you both OP and I'm glad he's now in Narnia. What a horrid experience.

Last year I took a serious overdose and my experience in hospital was so distressing. I've been in a psychiatric hospital ever since (9 months) but often think about it at night and get really upset. I was left alone after I was moved to AMU from resus, with no buzzer or anything and my curtains drawn, nobody came to speak to me for the first 12 hours I was moved there even though I was constantly being sick and in a lot of pain. I didn't have a kind word during my entire stay, in fact not one person came to speak to me at all.

They say “everyone will be affected by cancer at some point in their lives” ie everyone will either have it or know someone that does, and I think that similar could be said for the NHS...everyone will encounter shitty NHS staff at some stage, either themselves or someone they know. My late Mum did. An elderly woman in the bed opposite couldn’t feed herself, yet she was given no help and her food was just left in front of her until it was removed untouched. The poor woman was losing weight, purely because the nursing staff didn’t care enough to make sure she was eating, didn’t consider why she wasn’t touching her food. Seriously, I really hope none of them have pets if that’s their level of care.

My Mum had similar when she was dying of cancer. She complained to me that nurses would do their rounds, move her side table to do whatever, and not move it back. This meant she couldn’t reach her water, and would wait ages for someone to move the table back to where it should be. Totally thoughtless and unnecessary. I’m still cross with myself that I didn’t make a formal complaint but I was understandably emotionally drained once she died. Oh, and she got pressure sores too.

I dread ending up in hospital as I have no-one to look out for me. It scares me to think about it. Thankfully, so far, the worst HCPs I’ve encountered aren’t as bad as the stories on this thread, but enough to make me wonder why they’re in the jobs due to their off attitudes.

@iminthegarden

I don't think more funding is going to work. They have already increased funding again. It's an insane amounts yet treatments and drugs are becoming more expensive its completely unaffordable for any government to sustain. Problem is when we look at the US it quite rightly puts us off privatisation but there must be a middle ground. In a country I used to live in you pay £10 for any visit, whether it to A&E or a 3-day baby delivery. You pay for meds on top I think. I have had my fair share of health problems so I would be concerned about a fully privatised system but by making more services payable for those who can afford it to pump more money in for essential services then we should certainly be exploring those options. We should also trim down the types of free treatments that they are offering and probably make it a free service for acute health only rather than everything under the sun. It can carry on like this!

There are plenty of other models - some really, really good and equitable. But that's a different discussion.

The core question is how much money are you going to put into healthcare as a country ? The NHS is cheap and highly cost-effective. We can adopt the French, German, Canadian models etc but they'll be crap - unless we properly fund the service.

@DarlingWithoutYou

I'm sorry things have been so tough for you both OP and I'm glad he's now in Narnia. What a horrid experience.

Last year I took a serious overdose and my experience in hospital was so distressing. I've been in a psychiatric hospital ever since (9 months) but often think about it at night and get really upset. I was left alone after I was moved to AMU from resus, with no buzzer or anything and my curtains drawn, nobody came to speak to me for the first 12 hours I was moved there even though I was constantly being sick and in a lot of pain. I didn't have a kind word during my entire stay, in fact not one person came to speak to me at all.

This is so sad, so sorry about your awful experience. I really think an organisation of volunteers should be set up in hospitals to do all the things nurses don't seem to have the time (or inclination in some cases) to do. Just to show patients a bit of compassion and help with basic things that are being neglected.

First of all, I'm so sorry you've had to go through this, are going through this and you'repoor husband isn't being treated the way he should.
Secondly, I'm a nurse. This is appalling. Yes, things can take a while to get sorted, yes sometimes someone else isn't available, but 3 hours for breakthrough pain relief is absolutely unacceptable.
Please please please complain. It's the only way anything will change. Most staff (not all, I'm under no illusions) would be mortified to hear or be involved in this. Don't speak to the nurse in charge of the ward, speak to the ward manager and then go higher to the clinical nurse manager/matron. If you don't get the answers you want/need aim higher.

Another nurse here. OP I'm going to be another voice saying please formally complain.

All other things aside, administering the wrong medication is a really serious error and the ward should be making a formal incident report - an IR1 or a datix - and there should be an investigation. I would speak to the ward sister, but also go through the trust complaints procedure. This sort of error - repeatedly giving the wrong dose of a medication- just should not be happening.

The attitude of the staff on that ward sounds appalling, and I'm so sorry you had to go through it. I'm glad your husband is somewhere better now.

Like any profession, there's good and bad - unfortunately there are people that just should not be in the job.

@Staffy1 thank you for your kind words. I think volunteers in hospitals would be so useful too.

@Staffy1 thank you for your kind words. I think volunteers in hospitals would be so useful too.

I agree, and I was thinking about this and wondering if there is such thing as a volunteer patient advocate? It can be very overwhelming when you're in the middle of these situations and hard to know who to speak to, etc. It's heartbreaking to think of people who don't have anyone, then potentially being neglected or poorly cared for with no way to get their voice heard.

Due to my condition I can be in hospital a few times a year. After being left in pain 2 times in a row and having to wait to 1am for a medication they should be given every 12 hours on the dot and should have been done at 9pm I take in my own meds and hide them in my bag. I take them as I need them and put the meds they eventually give me in a small box. It’s not just the pain they wanted to give me this medication at 1am and 8am when there should be 12 hours in between just to suit them. Now I just medicate myself

Volunteers are a great idea but how do you screen them ? How do you ensure they are not like the very same nursing staff that people are naturally complaining about ? Some nurses can be lazy, lack compassion and rude, invariably the general public can too. If anything the vetting process will be even more lax and open to abuse, attracting unsuitable people.

@Sanguinesuzy I don't understand your point, why would someone volunteer there if they were lazy or lacked compassion?

A neighbour applied for a nhs hospital volunteer role, to do ward clerical work. In the end the recruitment, vetting, medical and training process was so protracted she gave up. I doubt anyone "lazy" would bother.