Do work place bullies always get their comeuppance?

[Hypie]

NHS

We have a notorious senior manager. She's been around for years, quickly went through the ranks because she 'gets things done'. The way she gets things done is shouting, screaming, swearing, telling people she could replace them the next day and just general awful fucking behaviour.

The service she works for has massively high staff turnover, last two managers under her have gone off sick with stress and she's had two people put claims against her which fell down because nobody would go on record as a witness.

She is now my manager and within two weeks i've already had two run ins with her. The first was hearing her directly ask someone if they 'were fucking stupid' the second was her phoning me and giving me an earful because of a complaint the department had received (unfounded but she hasnt come back and apologised).

She has apparently reduced men to tears! I've seen her screw her face up when people are talking on teams calls, she is just a foul nasty person with no management skills whatsoever. All she knows how to do is shout and scream to get people to do things.

These people always come up against someone bigger and better eventually don't they? Even for the NHS she is pushing it, I've seen some shitty managers in my time but she is something else

The answer to your question is 'No'.

Even when staff turnover is extremely high, upper management will take no interest.

I used to work for a manager who shouted in people’s faces, humiliated them, threatened foreign workers with deportation and made them cry. Their reports often took time off sick with anxiety. I called them out on their behavior on a couple of occasions but nothing changed.

No one would complain to HR because in the industry I was in, people move jobs quite a lot and did not want to prejudice their reference from the bully. I knew I was going to leave the industry and has built strong working relationships with other department managers.

So all the affected employees made a plan. I offered to be a referee to them should they want to move jobs, and gathered written evidence of all the incidents from the group. Then before I left I went to HR. The bully didn’t get sacked but they were denied an important promotion and left fairly soon afterwards.

No. My public sector department head was a bully. I'd get shouted at for things like not working on my days off. At the last call for voluntary redundancy half her department applied and those who were unsuccessful left anyway. She's since been promoted.

Currently dealing with one, been in the job a week and has upset 4 members of staff - I am keeping records and will hand it in if nothing is done, happy to go to HR to complain.

I do know two bullies that got theirs back in spades. One was eventually managed out due to reorganisation , and occasionally turns up locally at interviews for jobs way way way below their last pay grade.

The other one also got their karmic comeuppance but it involved serious ill health and traumatic disability so while I am pleased they arent inflicting their brand of nastiness on any other workplace it is hard to feel anything but pity for them.

The NHS is notorious for poor middle management; band 7/8A level.

Where I am in a coal-face, Band 6 position, this issue is that none of the Band 7/8A managers have any previous managerial experience, and, being the NHS, there's no money to send them on any managerial skills training.

There is a saying about getting promoted to one level higher than your competence threshold, and the NHS demonstrates this in spades.

I have never ever seen the bullies lose out.

Yes. The two in my place did. One retired and as it was COVID we couldn't even throw her a goodbye lunch which I know she really wanted. The other went on Mat leave and again couldn't have a work baby shower or a goodbye lunch. They both just left. It's only something small but it makes me feel like karma won

I dont think they ever get their comeuppance.

One of my line managers bullied me off sick for 7 months. I had a grievance against her, had to go to mediation and she had a temporary promotion. She had a history of bullying. But short term she was effective and things got done (not by her). She lied and cheated. She couldnt keep a team together. Other teams avoid her. She is still doing it and has screamed at other teams. I think no one wants to tackle her behaviour. They just move her on.

The other one was made to retire because she crossed the wrong perdon so she got a gold plated pension. But she is broke, her husband and kids do not live in the same country as her. She is truly miserable I'm sure and I'm glad.

However, others who let the behaviour happen have won awards. It beggars belief.

Some do, some don’t.

There used to be a horrible clique of bullies in my organisation. Two of the worst bullies are still still here. One of these has been promoted to a senior role and she’s a shocking choice for this particular responsibility, IMO. The rest of the clique have left or been made redundant.

A relative had a dodgy boss for over ten years. This manager was a lazy, dishonest bully who would victimise anyone she saw as a threat. Unsurprisingly, staff turnover in that part of the business was very high. Eventually, senior management took an interest, carried out an investigation and the dodgy manager either resigned or was sacked. It was the dishonesty that did for her in the end.

Only if they can be managed out by a bigger fish.

No it usually gets brushed under the carpet!! My trust did an online forum a few years ago where staff could air their views etc. The amount of staff complaining about bullying was off the scale. The forum was taken down and nothing more was ever heard about the findings of it !!!

A lot of these stories seem to be about female managers?

Why would overseas workers be deported Elephant? Are they here illegally?

Have seen two of these. One went on sick leave when challenged: it took years of serious complaints for any action to be taken. Works for another organisation now poor sods.😔
The other resigned when a colleague who was badly affected spoke up, soon joined by others. I'd left by this time so didn't see her at her worst. Two-faced; she'd sidle up and say Hi how's the family and then bitch to her mates (the gobby clique) !!!! I ignored her but she didn't like this as she wanted everyone on side. Crap manager too, we got on much better without her. I'd heard she was quite badly affected by the disciplinary process.
When a bully is so bad that your colleagues have breakdowns and dread going to work it's hard to feel any sympathy 😥

I worked for a very unpleasant woman years ago, who bullied all of her younger more junior staff until they generally left. Eventually she got made redundant due to a company takeover and was forced to apply for more junior roles outside of the organisation, however, it was a relatively small industry and unfortunately for her the people that she was now applying to work for were the same people that she had bullied, who had now risen in seniority. As far as I’m aware, never managed to get another job in that industry- so bullies do get their comeuppance sometimes!

@hamstersarse both that I witnessed were female.

@hamstersarse. Most of the accounts are from NHS workers, I've never worked for the NHS but would imagine they have a predominantly female workforce ?
.

[quote Gingerwhinger1]@hamstersarse. Most of the accounts are from NHS workers, I've never worked for the NHS but would imagine they have a predominantly female workforce ?
.[/quote]
Yes, senior management is predominately female for the organisation I work for. I was bullied horrendously in the NHS, problem is that the management hire their friends etc so if you even complain they close ranks and you become the trouble maker. So pleased I left that trust, I was off sick for three months from stress caused by this bullying. They don't ever really get their comeuppance in my view.

In my experience the bullies float without hindrance to the top cutting a swathe through decent, capable, hard-working folk and useless muppets alike.

Awful manager at my place has just resigned whilst there was an investigation into allegations made against them.
Now they have a new job as a manager at another place - potentially managing 2 people who left ours because of them.

@Whingey

Why would overseas workers be deported Elephant? Are they here illegally?

Of course not, but visas for foreign nations come with conditions that need to be fulfilled in order for them to continue to be valid, such as remaining employed and or earning over a certain threshold amount.

*nationals

In my experience they get promoted to more senior positions and everyone else ends up leaving.
Bullies and bitches seem to have the gift of the gab.

If they pick on the wrong person they do.

I had a line manager who was awful to staff in their department. I watched this unfold from a different area and could see what was happening but was not in a position to help and I didn’t have all the facts.
Each one was bullied by this person and they left one by one. Too young or inexperienced to do anything about it ( it was just easier for them to move on tbh).

I was moved onto the team and became their next target. I am a very experienced member of staff and worked with them for just one year, gathered my evidence and put in a very detailed complaint with the help of a solicitor. Our senior manager was disgusted and now watches this person like a hawk. They are under scrutiny which is quite satisfying to see.
Nothing has gone right at work for this person since. I like to think that karma is alive and well.