Any car insurance experts? I've fucked up massively :(

[G3ntlemanJ]

And it's not me that's affected, it's my dd.

She's had her licence for 18m and from the very start I was in charge of her insurance, organising and paying for it. Direct debit set up for monthly payments.

Dd (19) was stopped on the motorway by police two days ago for not having insurance. Apparently the policy ended in January!! It didn't auto renew, which is what I had assumed. Stupid, I know.

After searching my email account I found one email from them saying there was a number to call to renew the policy, but it had gone into my spam and I'd totally missed it. We have otherwise had absolutely no communication from them. No letter to say it was going to be cancelled, no letter confirming it had been cancelled.

Because dd has had her licence for under two years she now faces 6 points on her licence and it being revoked and then taking her test again.

I am absolutely devastated to have done this to her and I feel so, so guilty.

But I can't help thinking that the insurance company are at fault too? Surely we should have had some further communication from them? From what I've read online they have to take 'reasonable steps' to notify the policyholder and this doesn't seem to have been done here, so we were reasonable to think it auto-renewed.

Does anyone have any advice at all??

Massive TIA!

I know

Ah it could've been worse OP, at least the testing is now back on and it's not like she has to go through all the lessons and stuff again

I'm not going to repeat what everyone else has said but as an aside if you have any future DC's I recommend you don't let their first couple of years auto renew as you will be paying WAY over the odds. I paid £1100 for my first year and got it for £680 for my second year even though my renewal price was still over £1k. Then in my third year I got it down to £400ish where it stayed for another couple of years until I was 25 then dropped again. Normally you don't even need to change insurer, call them up and tell them you don't want to renew and they more often than not match it or get very close to whatever you say X comparison site is quoting you.

I appreciate that you're not apportioning blame and how sickening it can be when you make a mistake like this one.

My car policies are rarely set to auto-renew as I like to shop around for a good price (even just as a new customer with the same insurer). That said, I've had more than just an email when a policy has expired and I've not renewed it. For my last car insurance policy, I must have had four or five letters telling me that my insurance had expired and to make sure I renewed or took out a new policy or I wouldn't be covered. Although it's not the insurer's job to chase you, I think you've been a bit unlucky to have received one email and nothing by post.

Such a shame this has happened but I too think although it's worth going to appeal.and asking for leniency I'd be very surprised if it's granted.

@YesItsAPeacock

Does anyone have any advice at all??

Yeah, don't coddle your 19 year old, adult, daughter. Especially if you're not actually that organised anyway.

This.

And be grateful that the problem was identified in this way, rather than her having had an accident with no insurance.

I understand you as parents wanting to help with paying for it, but she should be organising it and paying for it from her account and you give the money to her.

I hope she forgives you.

@GillBungalow

There's no minimum time period though

The problem is there's such a bloody huge backlog of people waiting to take tests that have been postponed/ cancelled

Hundreds of thousands according to the news yesterday, it's going to take months to clear the backlog

I’ve never had an insurance policy not auto renew.... it’s how I’ve ended up paying over the odds. ( on the plus side I was at least insured). I’ve never only received an email either.... always a letter with details of the new ( more expensive ) policy. I can also imagine it would be easy to miss a transaction not being paid - much more difficult than a transaction that shouldn’t have been made. I can easily see how it would happen. I do think though that since she’s the one who commits the offence she should deal with the admin.... even if you pay for the policy overall.

Sorry this happened to you and your dd. I think some pp are being a little quick to jump on you! I've never had a car insurance policy that didn't auto renew, I didn't realise it was a thing until reading this post! I've always had to ring and cancel the renewal to move providers. I also organise and pay the insurance and DH, I guess, just trusts that the car is insured! He's never asked. I'm a control freak and would want to see that certificate! Yes, your DD is 19 and able to drive and should have checked, but I don't think I'd have questioned it if my dad had told me my car was taxed and insured at 19, it took me a good few more years before I started acting like the adult I was.

Sometimes bad things have to happen so you can learn that lesson to check in future.

I would write a letter to explain that you take responsibility and your daughter trusted you, as her mam and you fucked up. It happens, we all do.

I’d ask to have the points added to your license. Worth a shot if it means it saves her.

Thankfully nothing happened so it’s a huge lesson learned for you and you DD.

Hope it works out ok

I have sympathy for you and your daughter, it's a shit situation to be in. In future flag any emails from insurance companies as important and hopefully they won't go into spam and also forward copies to your daughter and make sure she reads them and does the same to double the chances .

@jessycake

I have sympathy for you and your daughter, it's a shit situation to be in. In future flag any emails from insurance companies as important and hopefully they won't go into spam and also forward copies to your daughter and make sure she reads them and does the same to double the chances .

Not car insurance but I've had a similar issue with an email going to junk recently. How do you flag the emails as important if you don't know the exact email address they'll be coming from? I use an outlook address if the method is different for different providers.

"You clearly haven't read the post where I expressly said that I wasn't looking for people to take the blame - I have fully accepted that it's my fault."

You clearly said you rang your magistrate ex husband for something you could "use" and that you "can't help thinking the insurance company are at fault".

At 17 deemed old enough to drive a car, at 70 mph & carry passengers, plus insure, tax & MOT, in all kinds of weathers & driving conditions

There is responsibility to oneself & others

It is NOT acceptable to be writing or calling anyone to say "my mother...."

Your daughter needs the advice of a motoring lawyer, before saying anything else to the police or courts. She will have to appear in court since there's the possibility of a driving ban. A lawyer can advise if she has a chance of pleading "special reasons" that could allow her to keep her license, though she will still have to declare the conviction when taking out insurance in future which could price her off the road anyway. (There's also "exceptional hardship" but this is less likely to apply.)

I’d ask to have the points added to your license.

I'm actually stunned that someone thinks this is a possibility. This is real life. 'Can my mum take the points?' isn't really it, you know?

@starfishmummy

I've never heard of car insurance auto renewing and I have been a car owner for 35 years.

And I've never had a policy that didn't auto renew so I can see how the OP ended up in this situation.

Which would mean monthly DD of over £80. That's not something "missable"!

Of course it is, to a lot of people. I might not notice 80 quid here or there.

You and the insurer will be bound by the terms and conditions of the contract. It is down to you to know when the contract ends. I don’t think the insurer has any liability unless there is something in the terms and conditions. I would check them over carefully.

It's down to you to check these things. Auto renewal isn't something they all do, it's useful but not required and you have responsibility for making sure you are insured. This is also why you should be checking your junk folder regularly.

By sending you an email they fulfilled their duty by informing you it was due, it isn't their fault you don't check your spam.

Does she have diagnosed special needs or a learning disability and this is why you do her insurance for her? If so you might be able to claim mitigating circumstances and that it isn't her fault. It would be at their discretion but she might be let off with a warning or less points so that she keeps her licence.

If its just a matter of you babying her a bit then there's nothing to be done for it. At 19 her insurance is legally her responsibility and she will be given the points.

I've worked in motor insurance for about... 20 years. The driver is the only person who is responsible for making sure she's insured. Not her mum, not the insurance company. She can't go to court and ask for the points to be given to her mother. If she'd had a crash, she would have been paying it off for years or got a CCJ. God forbid she seriously injured someone it could be into the millions. Time for her to take responsibility for her own financial affairs instead of relying on mummy.

"Having a genuine belief that someone else is handling your insurance is indeed a defence, but it's really just applied in the employer/employee scenario. That said, ex has seen it used successfully (but v rarely) in similar cases to this one, but we won't be going down that route.

Her license will be taken back to a provisional one and she'll have to re-take her test to get it back. There's no minimum time period though."

I don't understand G3ntlemanJ, why won't you be trying that route? I would in those circumstances. She might , by pleading this as her defence, get 6 points but no ban, in much the same way as some people can accumulate 12 points but successfully avoid a ban

This isn't a question for insurance experts. The facts are plain: at the time she was stopped she had no insurance. Even if they wanted to, the insurance company cannot now backdate your cover.

However, there is hope although your fate does lie in the hands of the magistrates. I have seen exactly this situation in court - the (adult) child and the mother both genuinely believed she was covered on the mother's insurance, and the magistrates awarded no penalty.

Your daughter will need to plead guilty but argue special reasons. As a six point penalty is effectively a ban you might find a sympathetic bench will show mercy, but this is a discretionary matter so make sure you get proper legal advice. It will be worth the money.

Magistrates (and courts) aren't as scary as you might think, and possible fines aside, the court fees should only be £85 which could be money well spent.

Insurer was expected to auto-renew and didn't is by the way a fairly common occurence, and is why most insurers do auto-renew. Also common is someone other than the driver paying and a payment fails. The poor communication from the insurer, by email only, ought to help her case. (But remember it's not going to get her deemed innocent, just get her a reduced penalty.)

Lawyers and magistrates will have seen cases like your daughter's many times.

What are the Implications of New Drivers Law?
New drivers are covered by the new drivers act.
The ‘probationary period’ for new drivers is the first two years that you are on the road from the date you pass your first driving test.
If you accumulate 6 points during the first 24 months, then the DVLAA_ will revoke your driving licence. In order to get it back you will need to take a complete re-test.
This new driver penalty is not a discretionary matter for the court. Pleading for leniency from the court is pointless.
If you are guilty of the offence, then magistrates have very little discretion about imposing points on your driving licence.
Once you have the points then the decision to revoke happens administratively at the DVLA as soon as they are notified of the 6 points added to your licence by the court.
This process is automatic and there is no means of affecting the outcome.