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Insular towns and villages

259 replies

Cactus1982 · 20/04/2021 19:23

Has anyone else ever lived or worked on of these places? By insular I mean fearful, mistrustful and in some cases down right hostile to ‘outsiders’? There’s a large village about fifteen minutes outside of the town I live in that has always had a reputation for being like this. Apparently, in non Covid times if you as an outsider walked into a pub there it would go quiet and everyone would stare at you. I always took this with a pinch of salt until I started working there this last week. I swear that as I walk from my car down the street people slow down and stare intently at me as though I’ve got three heads. I know we are living in strange times, but this is very unnerving. I was also asked by someone how far I’d traveled to get there and when I told them they said ‘oooooh that’s a long way’ as though I’d come from Mars or somewhere. It’s not a long way, it’s a fifteen minute drive! I’d never actually have believed it had it not experienced it with my own eyes!

Are there any other places like this in the UK?

OP posts:
Walkingwounded · 22/04/2021 07:35

Quite a lot of rural Northumberland.

The racism and sexism really struck me as well.

Throwntothewolves · 22/04/2021 07:50

I think a lot of small towns and villages are like that, it's not unusual, but it is horrible to be made to feel like you don't belong. It's a bit of a sore point for me actually as we moved to a small Scottish town when I was a teenager having lived in England for many years. Despite actually being Scottish I never fitted in because of my accent and could not wait to move away. I still live in Scotland and love where I live now. I 'fit in' because everyone in our big new build estate is a newcomer of sorts. Plus having kids helps because my lifestyle is like so many others who live nearby. I feel like I 'belong' here and cannot see me moving away.
All I can say is people are weird and if they decide you don't belong, you never will regardless of how long you live or work there.

MotherOfGodWeeFella · 22/04/2021 08:03

@MrsDThomas

I went to Wales and it was like this, started speaking in Welsh when they realised I was English

Oh that old one. 🙄 this does not happen. Fucking complete bollocks and something read in the Daily Mail

I've had it happen to me in North Wales. Conversation in English between shop worker and a couple of people who were local. Shop worker asks if there is something specific I'm looking for and when I reply in English, the three them then started speaking in Welsh with a couple of glances in my direction. But I must have made it up Hmm
loginfail · 22/04/2021 08:12

"Insular" should be the alternative name of the small town/village where I was brought up, as was my father and all the grandparents, great grandparents, etc etc.

I escaped eventually to the big city and beyond but on one of my occasional visits back home to see parents I remember struggling on one occasion to get served in one of the pubs in town because the person working behind the bar only seemed to be able to see the "locals"....

It wasn't a busy night but it did seem to take an inordinate amount of waving of cash, shuffling of feet and leaning over the bar top to get served by one of my own cousins Shock.

..I'm not going to names, Shropshire/Worcestershire/Herefordshire border should narrow it down nicely, very near a very fashionable market town.

Checkingout811 · 22/04/2021 08:18

@purdypuma haha that made me chuckle! I suspect he is right 😂

dementedma · 22/04/2021 08:34

Fife here, in one of the small former mining villages. What the media would call close knit, but actually insular as fuck.

mermaidsariel · 22/04/2021 08:37

Cardenden?

mrshonda · 22/04/2021 08:52

I lived in a small 'touristy city' in the north for several years, and most of the born and bred locals were extremely hostile to anyone from outside the area - wouldn't speak to me, I was followed down the street, my house was splattered with eggs. I then moved to a rural North Yorkshire village and was welcomed with open arms, I loved it there.

StoneColdBitch · 22/04/2021 08:52

@Incognitool

Leicestershire. Large, prosperous village, not far from Leicester. I grew up in the country myself, but I’d never lived anywhere so insular. It wasn’t a ‘total silence when you walked into the pub’ situation, just an incredibly narrow outlook — no one who hadn’t always lived there really existed. No one interested in things, places or people not in the immediate vicinity really existed. No one with foreign friends, a ‘strange’ job, or who didn’t spend their money on understandable things really existed. Having a foreign accent, renting a house, being WOHM, having lived overseas, giving any intimation you might not still be living in the village at your death — all deeply suspicious.

I’m an open-minded person, and I did everything recommended — had child in baby groups, preschool, then village school, I volunteered, got involved in local events, ran a popular club, went to the pub, supported local businesses, litter-picked, campaigned for the retention of the bus service etc etc. After eight years we left.

I lived in the central Midlands for 4 years - we left recently. Not Leicestershire but one of the counties that borders it. This all sounds very familiar. We were considered outsiders and were treated with hostility and suspicion. I was openly ridiculed for being a working mother whose children were in childcare.

I had a job in which I often asked people if they had local family to support them. Lost count of the number of times someone would say their family had moved away, then it transpired that meant that said relative was 5 miles away. Anything other than living in the same village or small town as your family was considered revolutionary.

Very glad to have left. I would never move back.

mrshonda · 22/04/2021 08:57

And I had the 'speaking in Welsh' thing as well, in a garage shop in Snowdonia when I stopped for petrol. They were a bit taken aback when I spoke Welsh too.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 22/04/2021 09:45

My dad's Sheffield born & bred, always said (pre-covid) that when there's a funeral in Stocksbridge they all sit at the same side of the church as they're all related!

Do people normally sit on different sides for funerals?! Is there one side for those who loved the deceased and another for those who are only there out of polite duty and/or for the free buffet?!

Gladimnotcampinginthisweather · 22/04/2021 09:54

Lots of villages in Northamtonshire are like this.
The small town I live in was also like it until the 'incomers' outnumbered the 'locals' because of new housebuilding.

Incognitool · 22/04/2021 10:07

@StoneColdBitch, that sounds very familiar. Appallingly so! I had never anticipated that in the 21st century being a working mother would be considered so outré, and yes, absolutely to the idea that 'moving away' was considered a deeply unnatural, and vanishingly rare, thing to do.

I think that was part of the issue.

These people had, by and large, never left (or if they had, it was for a brief, finite period, like university, and they'd moved back to 'settle down', often marrying someone from the area -- it seemed most often to be university-educated women who moved back and married men who hadn't gone to university, so hadn't left at all).

So it wasn't even so much that they were hostile to, or uninterested in, people who moved to the area from elsewhere -- though they were certainly both of those - it was that they had little or no experience of ever having to make new friends, or deal with people they hadn't known from pre school, so they had very minimal social skills in those areas, as they'd never had to use them.

I'm sure there are people who grow up in similar circumstances who are open-minded, intellectually-curious and interested in the world, but these people lived in a very small world. They were obsessed with the minutiae of one anothers' lives, like new cushions, or disagreements over planning permission.

Less pleasantly, I only realised years in that any reference I made in passing to living elsewhere (I mean, I visibly wasn't from the UK, so it was hardly a surprise that I'd lived in at least one other country, as well as other places in England) was viewed as 'showing off'.

And some minor reference I once made to something that suggested it was likely I would eventually live overseas again was very negatively viewed, as indicating a lack of commitment. I felt that people there actually resented any indication that there was a whole world out there, and that you didn't need any special skills to access it.

It was an incredibly depressing period.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 22/04/2021 10:10

I think another aspect to the 'immediately switching to Welsh' thing is that somebody isn't necessarily being rude or showing their insularity by using their own language in front of you.

How many times have you been to a Chinese takeaway, ordered in English at the counter and then heard the English-speaking counter person immediately shout in to the kitchen in Chinese? I suppose they could be sharing nasty gossip about the customer's funny looks, but I'd say it's a tenner to a penny that they're actually saying something like "chicken chop suey and a beef curry" or "is order 62 nearly ready?". Polish or Hindi/Urdu/Gujerati-speaking colleagues will often do the same when only chatting between themselves.

I also wonder whether some people speaking Welsh in shops are not actually meaning to be rude, but simply don't want their own culture and heritage to be completely ignored. So many times, we see and hear of women people giving way 100% of the time for somebody else's convenience, and then they come to take it for granted - to the extent that they then resent you if you don't give way to them on the odd occasion. The history of the Welsh language being banned and treated like it's shameful or just one big irritation must still cut very deep with many Welsh people. It's very easy for those of us who only/mainly speak the world's single most dominant language to forget that.

Are the people actually speaking to you in Welsh, once they know that you don't understand it - refusing to speak English to you, even though they speak it well; or are they just speaking it to others in your presence? There's quite a difference. Many parts of Wales are bilingual, which means that both languages are freely used - it doesn't mean that everybody must speak English at all times unless they can be certain that no non-Welsh speakers are anywhere within earshot.

Peregrina · 22/04/2021 10:11

There is a definite pattern here. Most villages are insular.

If Welsh villages then the locals who normally talk Welsh decide to talk English when they see a stranger in the distance, so that they can revert back to Welsh as soon as the stranger speaks to them.Grin

English villages lack the advantage of another language, so they have to content themselves with silent stares when a stranger hovers into view. In this case, a stranger comes from a village three miles away.Grin

The trouble is that a lot of villages and small market towns don't have a lot for people to do, so that the people with a bit of get up and go leave, and don't go back. Making the village they left behind even more insular.

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll · 22/04/2021 10:50

That was the perfect encyclopaedia definition, Peregrina Grin

Some people have very, very small worlds and so they jealously guard them in any way they can. It's not just in small villages: individuals with nothing much to interest them in their lives can be the same and get obsessed with 'her at number 19's expensive new curtains' or the like.

I had a relative just like this. She lived on a corner and spent most of her time sitting in the living room and staring out of the window. Not just looking out at the view and the sunshine, but actively patrolling the neighbourhood from Checkpoint Armchair. She would get so angry and suspicious about people walking past on the pavement and cars driving by (it wasn't even a cul-de-sac). I think she was projecting somewhat as she assumed the passers-by minding their own business were staring in at her when in fact, she was the one staring out at them! The corner on her road, just outside her house, happened to be one of the very few perfect ones for learner drivers to practise reversing around, so many instructors brought their pupils to make use of it. She never drove, so they weren't in her way. I was a learner driver once, and I know for a fact that, in those early lessons, you don't dare to nosey in people's windows rather than concentrating intently on the car, road and other traffic. She wouldn't even have known they were there if she hadn't been staring out at them - she was like the people Terry Wogan used to talk about, who sit by their radio or in front of the TV, just waiting to be offended!

If she'd been of the Facebook generation, she would have been on there straightaway 'warning' everybody to be on their guard as she'd seen a white van driving up the road!

Gwenhwyfar · 22/04/2021 17:27

@mrshonda

And I had the 'speaking in Welsh' thing as well, in a garage shop in Snowdonia when I stopped for petrol. They were a bit taken aback when I spoke Welsh too.
If you're a Welsh speaker yourself, you must know that it makes no sense that they would have been speaking English to each other before they saw you. WHY would they have been doing that if they were Welsh speakers? (assuming mother tongue in Snowdonia).
Northernsoullover · 22/04/2021 17:35

FGS if you were in Snowdonia I can guarantee you that they speak Welsh all the frigging time. Seriously. My nan used to speak a hybrid so a Welsh sentence might suddenly have 'bus stop' in it or 'frying pan'. She wasn't speaking English. Let it go now. Its bullshit

MrsMariaReynolds · 22/04/2021 17:36

Gotta be Norfolk! 😉

21833efb · 22/04/2021 18:29

Frome is very insular. They don't like outsiders in their precious, pretentious little town.

Annonnimoouse42 · 22/04/2021 18:49

I was born and grew up overseas. Only visited Scotland once as a very small child. In 1944 my father jleft the village he and generations of ancestors had lived in.
I went back in 1988 aged 19 - first hour someone said to me 'och, you'll be one of oor Maggies bairns'.
Maggie was Dads mother who died in 1934.

purdypuma · 22/04/2021 19:29

Good point!... I think he meant weddings thinking about it!🙈

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 22/04/2021 20:06

@Memedru I think I might know where you mean. A few miles from a dual carriageway but decidedly up itself. Even the co-op looks posh.

I live in a place that is actually very friendly but if an unknown walks into the pub people do stop and look.

NeverBeenNormal · 22/04/2021 20:16

@Northernsoullover

FGS if you were in Snowdonia I can guarantee you that they speak Welsh all the frigging time. Seriously. My nan used to speak a hybrid so a Welsh sentence might suddenly have 'bus stop' in it or 'frying pan'. She wasn't speaking English. Let it go now. Its bullshit
My Welsh-speaking friends' children did admit that they often converse in English to annoy their parents but when they realise it's not having any effect they usually resort to a sort of hybrid language - loads of English slang scattered amongst Welsh words.

I am English and live in England but I do speak some Welsh. People are usually quite pleasantly surprised and appreciate the effort.

Peregrina · 22/04/2021 20:55

My nan used to speak a hybrid so a Welsh sentence might suddenly have 'bus stop' in it or 'frying pan'.

It also used to work the other way a little bit when I lived in an English speaking part of Wales, when we would occasionally throw a Welsh word in. I remember my niece talking about someone who 'worked with his taid' doing ...... (i.e. grandfather in N Wales).

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