Can white people ever experience racism?

[LittleRedCourgettes]

Following a discussion on this topic with some students, I was reading this article and am interested to hear your honest thoughts on this question.....

https://www.nas.org/blogs/article/wherediddwegetttheideaathatonlyywhitepeopleecanbeeracist

I got called a "racist white girl" by a (presumably homeless) black man on the subway in New York because I didn't put change in his begging cup. I genuinely had no change, I had been in the US about 2 hours. He then started going round to all other non-white people on the train and telling them about the racist white girl who wouldn't give him money.

My cousin was killed by a black man who was looking for a white man to beat up after his girlfriend had danced with a white man in a club.

The guy was off his face when arrested & admitted he was looking to hurt any white man.

I would say my cousin experienced racism.

I wouldn’t call it racism unless it was towards a minority such as travellers or in some cases Irish people. If a white person who in all other aspects of their worldly experience is the privileged majority then any discrimination they face due to race I would describe as prejudice not racism.

[quote Devlesko]I will post this again for anyone interested especially if you can share etc.

www.travellerstimes.org.uk/features/travellers-times-condemns-hostile-new-anti-traveller-laws[/quote]
I will share this!
I’m always shocked at how negative people are towards travellers. Comments on our local Facebook pages are awful.

So basically there's a distinction between experiencing discrimination/prejudice due to your skin colour in a one-off experience, and experiencing it as part of a structural system of discrimination.

Traditionally, and as per the dictionary, we call the former racism and the latter structural or systemic racism. What people would prefer is to call the former prejudice based on skin colour, and the latter racism.

In the end it amounts to the same thing. It's just semantics. Why try to change established definitions? Just creates pointless arguments like we see on this thread.

@FishWithoutABike white people are absolutely able to be discriminated against by merit of race, as is any other ethnic group. That is racism.

@nancy75 I am so sorry about your cousin.

Thank you, x

That wasn't meant as a response to nancy. It was just caught in the same response box. That truly is a horrific act. Reminds me of Lee Rigby.

@MellowBird85

Oh hark at Socrates.

And that bloody book “Why I’m No Longer Talking To White People About Race”. What an awful, passive-aggressive title which I will NEVER read because I don’t like my opinion invalidated based on the colour of my skin, funnily enough.

Try reading it.

Honestly, she explains exactly what she means in the blog post which the book is named after. She is talking about people who are determined to not see her point. If you are determined to not see racism and it's affects on black people skip it, if you are a reasonable human try it.

Yes . Jewish people, Irish, Welsh.

White people can certainly experience prejudice and discrimination. However, not racism.

Racism = discrimination + power. We all live in a white supremacist society and therefore the power part is lacking if white people are discriminated against by others from a different race.

I would really recommend the book White Fragility by Robin DiAngelo who gives a really valuable perspective.

Yes they can.

However, We had a similar thread last year that got quite heated and I think the general opinion was that white people can't experience racism.

Racism = discrimination + power

This is what comes up every time and this is not the definition of racism! Why are people constantly trying to convolute what is clearly an important issue by needlessly trying to change the definitions of words and terms that already exist?

@ChocOrange1

I got called a "racist white girl" by a (presumably homeless) black man on the subway in New York because I didn't put change in his begging cup. I genuinely had no change, I had been in the US about 2 hours. He then started going round to all other non-white people on the train and telling them about the racist white girl who wouldn't give him money.

He wasn't being racist. He was saying that you are racist. Calling someone racist (even if that person is wrong) isn't racism.

He called you racist because he (wrongly) believed not giving him money must have been because you don't like him (as a black man).

I've been called a white slut on many occasions just walking down the street, are used to sometimes think it was racism. But I think it was misogyny really.

Yes of course. I'm white and English, try living in some areas of China.

Absolutely. Experienced it at university in London from British Middle Eastern female students. Often it would be behind your back but in earshot or occasionally in Arabic (my friend spoke Arabic). Id generally ignore it as I know I'd end being the one accused of racism/Islamaphobia. 🤷🏻‍♀️

What do you honestly think @LittleRedCourgettes?

@PoplarTrees

Racism = discrimination + power

This is what comes up every time and this is not the definition of racism! Why are people constantly trying to convolute what is clearly an important issue by needlessly trying to change the definitions of words and terms that already exist?

I agree with this, and said so earlier in thread but possibly not very clearly! Don’t mean racism against white people is the big problem here. It’s not. But changing the language just confuses people I think.

FishwithoutaBike
Surely that is very contorted thinking. How can prejudice be different from racism? Being racist is being prejudiced, and vice versa.

@Babdoc

Try being English in Scotland, OP! One of the consultant surgeons from my hospital had an SNP supporter spit in his face, shouting “Bloody English” - for daring to chat (to his own wife!) in an English accent in a shopping street in broad daylight. I have been intimidated by a Scottish van driver while campaigning against the independence referendum. I have been warned to stay silent by Scots friends, and hustled out of a cinema for my own safety during a screening of Braveheart, where the atmosphere was turning distinctly ugly. And when I was a newly qualified junior doctor, I overheard two of the nurses on my ward discussing me: “How’s the new doctor?” “ Well, she’s English.” Said in a tone of disgust. Before adding grudgingly: But she’s all right.” My DD had to report one of her high school teachers for anti English racism, and suffered regular abuse from pupils during the football world cup. So yes, white people can also suffer racism.

I'm English and have lived and worked in Scotland for 25 years. I can honestly say I have never experienced racism of any form.

God yes, was in a mixed heritage marriage and friendships for years and heard “Guri Kuti” (spelling?) enough times!

It means “white bitch” by the way.

I have been mocked, had stones thrown at me and been sexually assaulted because of my skin colour. I would say that was racism(combined with sexism) but I have always had the opportunity to move to a different country or job where I didn’t have to experience racism in that way.

@Babdoc

Try being English in Scotland, OP! One of the consultant surgeons from my hospital had an SNP supporter spit in his face, shouting “Bloody English” - for daring to chat (to his own wife!) in an English accent in a shopping street in broad daylight. I have been intimidated by a Scottish van driver while campaigning against the independence referendum. I have been warned to stay silent by Scots friends, and hustled out of a cinema for my own safety during a screening of Braveheart, where the atmosphere was turning distinctly ugly. And when I was a newly qualified junior doctor, I overheard two of the nurses on my ward discussing me: “How’s the new doctor?” “ Well, she’s English.” Said in a tone of disgust. Before adding grudgingly: But she’s all right.” My DD had to report one of her high school teachers for anti English racism, and suffered regular abuse from pupils during the football world cup. So yes, white people can also suffer racism.

Don't I know - it's awful - I've heard another member of staff taking the mick out of my accent (she didn't know I could hear her) and the rest of them joining in. Been told 'well you're an 'Englander'' whatever that means and told to 'go back to England'.

I hate the thought of independence - been in Scotland 25 years plus and still feel like an outsider.