Why can't more vaccine be made by others..?

[justgeton]

I'll start by saying I haven't a clue about pharmaceutical manufacturing..

But look at how PPE, even ventilators we're being made by factories that previously made something entirely different back in March..

Now they've 'found the recipe' of is it just the 'ingredients' that are short?

Can't others help?

Would you be happy to have something injected into you, and potentially not be made up correctly/offer the protection hoped, after being made by a factory that doesn’t normally manufacturing drugs?

@SilentlyLaughing

Would you be happy to have something injected into you, and potentially not be made up correctly/offer the protection hoped, after being made by a factory that doesn’t normally manufacturing drugs?

I don't even know how many such factories there are.. but with the fight governance, yes I would

*right

I don’t think you can compare making face masks and plastic visors with a vaccine. It’s not a yoghurt as JVT once said.

But there are other pharmaceutical factories.. I wasn't suggesting McVities chip in.. 🙄

I'm not making myself very clear I know... why can't pharmaceutical factories across the world make the Oxford vaccine for instance... or maybe they are?

I wish they would do a vaccine graph every day to do with the the horrendous death graph and the infection graph.

There are many vaccines across the world. Our government just didn't pre order them. We have enough now. It's just injecting them into people that takes the time!

@lovelemoncurd

There are many vaccines across the world. Our government just didn't pre order them. We have enough now. It's just injecting them into people that takes the time!

I hope you're right but fear you're wrong.. and the nhs won't vaccinate very fast and will blame supply

@justgeton

But there are other pharmaceutical factories.. I wasn't suggesting McVities chip in.. 🙄

I'm up for a biscuit vaccine!

I get what you mean, OP. Factories set up to manufacture other injectable medicines or vaccines could make the Covid ones instead.

There is probably a good reason why they can't though.

We have enough now.

It's a worldwide issue though.

Licences for the manufacturing of the drugs are strictly controlled. Not all manufacturers could make the vaccine because of the specialisms and machinery as well as the ‘raw’ ingredients storage not being possible.

The licence holder also has patent on the formula.

Also other drugs are being manufactured that are vital too. Which ones would you stop production of?

@LeaveMyDamnJam

Also other drugs are being manufactured that are vital too. Which ones would you stop production of?

Anything used solely for cosmetic purposes (if there are) or I'd reduce these to what's required for medical need

How many high tech empty factories capable of making complicated vaccinations to you think there are, you know just lying around waiting to be used?

Also with PPE business stopped making what they used to make, say plastic sandwich containers (this actually happened) and made visors, places that make vaccinations are somewhat less able to stop producing the life saving work they do.

@justgeton

I'm not making myself very clear I know... why can't pharmaceutical factories across the world make the Oxford vaccine for instance... or maybe they are?

They are. But they are also making the vaccine for the whole world, and not just the UK.

I'll start by saying I haven't a clue about pharmaceutical manufacturing..

So I work in pharmaceuticals...
They are not all as a standard OP... to put it simply...it's like trying to make chocolate chip cookies in a factory that normally makes...gingerbread men biscuits.

The ppl who work there...they know how to make gingerbread. For them to make chocolate chip cookies...first the need to understand the chocolate chip cookies. Every policy and standard operating procedure, training documents etc etc in that factory would need to be changed to cater for "chocolate chip cookies". They would need to change parts of the machinery possibly in order to make it successfully. (More paperwork!)
I'm in the lab... we would need to test the products, test the media fills ( this is what we call the fake product to put it simply I suppose) we do this to test the whole process...we must test the process every so often to prove the process is without fault (no microbes in any machinery, graded areas etc) as it is being injected this is extremely important. We must do this as once we know the product is tested and the process is test then it absolves us of any responsibility if it becomes contaminated by the person administering the product (the onus is on them)

So that is just a very basic run down I suppose... I'm not saying it's not possible. In ways it is...but it requires a hell of a lot more work than just waking up one more and deciding that we are making "chocolate chip cookies and not "gingerbread men" and fwiw it would literally be the same process in a biscuit factory 🤣🤣

I wonder if they've increased capacity too... longer shifts, cancelled leave.., that sort of thing.

On average, it takes between 12-36 months to manufacture a vaccine before it is ready for distribution. Vaccines are complex biological products with lengthy manufacturing and control processes. The quality controls represent up to 70% of the full manufacturing duration. Successful manufacturing of high-quality vaccines requires international standardization of starting materials, production and quality control […] Etc etc

www.sanofi.com/en/your-health/vaccines/production

This is a good link too...... would you want them to divert production away from Polio and Flu though? As a pp said, you still have to manufacture those, and MMR, and DTP, etc etc etc

Well, face masks and other PPE started being produced by companies who were no longer manufacturing their own products, as demand dropped and they weren't needed anymore. So it was a case of well, the factory is empty as no one will buy our stuff, let's make something else instead.

Which drugs do you think should stop being produced? We're talking on a mass scale here - stopping one drug won't free up enough resources to make vaccine batches like you suggest. So, what are these non-essential medicines we could do without?

Thank you for the helpful messages.. I was never suggesting it would be easy, but was hopeful some of the 'can do' approach that was evident at the start of the pandemic would apply to this too.

Do any of you with expertise in this have any thoughts about things that would help increase supply?

@justgeton the problem is that the supply of vaccines is highly intertwined with safeguard Quality. If you rush pushing vaccines through then you may as well throw quality standards out of the window. Quality is huge in the pharmaceutical industry....you literally cannot enter certain rooms, touch certain equipment, get access to certain system drives without completing a lot of training. I had to pass a simple hand washing technique, how to garb up correctly before I could even get access to the lab.

That should read "safety and quality"
Not safeguard quality.