Council house advice MIL can’t afford rent.

[velvetcandy]

Does anyone know anything about the old style council house system?
My MIL is in a three bedroom house with the old style agreement back in the 80s she says it’s a house for life unlike the contract you would get today? She’s also on her own, her partner died last year. She’s complaining she can’t afford the £700 rent a month but doesn’t want to downsize does anyone know if they reduce rent? Just to clarify I think she should move to a flat but it’s not my business, what is my business is her asking us for money so I need to get the right information on this, cheers x

Good grief!

I am 63, and have known for a long time that I won't get a state pension until I am 66...it went up from 65 when everyone's pension age went up.

OK, it wasn't that well communicated, but it has been known for long enough.

Also, she should check because if she only has state pension and a tiny bit of workplace / stakeholder pension she won't be able to afford £700 pcm on that, either, I don't think.

It is pretty outrageous, a fit healthy 60 / 61 yo declining to work f/t to pay her bills if she is able. I work f/t, am an occasional carer and get on with hobbies etc. I certainly don't need, and wouldn't expect, a family member to subsidise my choices!

She should also up her hours and work f/t because then she will get more employers contribution into her pension, and more tax contribution.

Obviously most of us would want to help a relative who was in dire straits or an emergency. Expecting others to pick up the bill because she is refusing to compromise the style to which she has become accustomed is outrageous.

I assume her partner had no private pension that named her as a beneficiary?

I also find it pretty outrageous that council tenants are allowed to occupy houses much bigger than they need and then to benefit from renting out rooms, to people who are not on the council waiting list.

If she is 61 there are only 4/5 years left until she reaches retirement age, at which point pension credits and state pension will fund her rent and bills.

So she could look for a stop gap solution just for those few interim years. This could be earning more, taking a lodger or asking relatives for help.

One last thing OP. I talk to a lot of people who are in debt. One very common comment is that they had a bereavement and then "got themselves in a bit of a mess".

If you can help her get some grief counselling, if she's willing to engage, it might help her.

We have a local charity that helps people suffering from grief, their sessions are currently in Zoom but I've heard that they're still very helpful.

Thanks @JingleJohnsJulie I am worried the she’s holding onto the house for sentimental reasons and it’s going to get her in debt I know she’s already living in her credit cards so it’s such a worry because I don’t want to have to bail her out I know some people think I’m being selfish but I have kids and need my money

She should also up her hours and work f/t because then she will get more employers contribution into her pension, and more tax contribution

How exactly do you propose she does that? Presumably her employer has some say in that? And don’t say she needs to find another job. There’s a glut of younger, fitter people seeking employment now, it was hard enough for anyone over 60 to find a job before covid struck.

Sounds like it's a car crash waiting to happen.

Don't sugar coat it you need to be blunt.

"MIL you are living beyond your means your options are

Get lodgers in
Investigate a swap to a cheaper and smaller property

Carry on like this you will end up homeless we don't have the money to bail you out"

Repeat repeat repeat.

Sorry just reading past comments .We’ve had to sort all kinds of debts out in the past her partner didn’t make much money so everything went on credit , catalog style accounts like very. Jd williams studio etc 😂 I think my partner just feels sorry for her and won’t say anything to make her upset. Thank you all for your help I’m going to suggest that she gets some money advice also now I definitely know they won’t reduce her rent like she’s planning on so we can move forward from here/ going to suggest she either finds more hours at work or looks for another job if she really can’t part with her house.

You are not being selfish by stopping giving her money but I'm interested in how your DP is with this. Do you think he'll agree to stopping giving her money?

My Ex MIL occupies a 3 bed council house here in the South where there is a massive shortage of social housing. It's paid for by benefits, as it has been for as long as I have known her. She is in her late 70's, the house is excessive for her needs with a big garden yet she refuses to even consider moving to something smaller.

Her own grandson, my son, is struggling to find affordable housing for his young family including my SEN grandson, and he works full time.
I despise this selfish old witch who has a sense of entitlement beyond anyone I have ever met. Families are in desperate need of Social Housing yet there is nothing that can make her move out to something more suitable . It is very wrong.

@Ferrylights

My Ex MIL occupies a 3 bed council house here in the South where there is a massive shortage of social housing. It's paid for by benefits, as it has been for as long as I have known her. She is in her late 70's, the house is excessive for her needs with a big garden yet she refuses to even consider moving to something smaller.

Her own grandson, my son, is struggling to find affordable housing for his young family including my SEN grandson, and he works full time.
I despise this selfish old witch who has a sense of entitlement beyond anyone I have ever met. Families are in desperate need of Social Housing yet there is nothing that can make her move out to something more suitable . It is very wrong.

Hear hear Ferrylights! I know of 3 households in London all hogging 3/4 bedroom social houses. They comprise of 2 x couples & 1 x widow. One even had the gall to moan about the council not re-housing Grenfell folk quickly enough, ok they probably did fall down in this respect, but talk about hypocrisy.

She took in a lodger a few years ago then complained that the DWP wouldn't let her keep the rent money on top of her benefits...I'm glad she is my Ex MIL, however she is still my kid's gran and they all feel the same as I do

She does have a house for life @ladyslattern. She just has to pay for it.

The ageism on MN is really odd. This is (as far as we know) a fit healthy woman who has just turned 61 and people are treating her like a doddery old woman.

She is only 5 years older than Boris Johnson and over a decade younger than Biden or trump.

She is 2 years older than my sister who is a company director and worked 50 hours last week. She's 5 years older than me and I worked 23 hours over 2 days just before Christmas to finish a project. I'm also a single parent to teenagers, one of whom has autism.

She is lucky enough to have secured a council property which is far cheaper than an equivalent home would be on the private market. She's a grown up and she needs to act like one. And MN needs to stop treating the over 50s like overgrown children.

Awkward - definitely don't pay for her, OP.

She needs to seek professional advice.

Sounds like she is too used to not having to pay her way. She's had it very good and doesn't want to change this. This is probably why she now expects the subsidy from you.

The council where we live offer a financial incentive for people to move to a smaller property. My sisters MIL did it. Went from a 3 bed house to a 1 bed bungalow.

@VinylDetective

She should also up her hours and work f/t because then she will get more employers contribution into her pension, and more tax contribution

How exactly do you propose she does that? Presumably her employer has some say in that? And don’t say she needs to find another job. There’s a glut of younger, fitter people seeking employment now, it was hard enough for anyone over 60 to find a job before covid struck.

This is true of the job market in general, but the OP does seem to imply that her working p/t is a matter of choice rather than the only current option.

How does she propose paying the rent once retired?

When she's above pension age, she'll be entitled to housing benefit and possibly pension credit and help with council tax.

However, the housing benefit might not pay her full rent if she's deemed to be in a property too large for her circumstances.

London Boroughs usually have a number of schemes to downgrade.

They will pay out some cash for each bedroom rescinded to help with removal expenses.

Then there's a relocation scheme whereby she moves, usually to coastal areas.

There's also mutual exchanges. IF she wants to exchange, let the council know. Many have links with homeswapper and it's provided for free. Many London boroughs also do a discretionary housing benefit fund for the extra benefits whilst they are looking.

It's not up to posters to decide if she can get any additional help based on her working part-time. There can be a number of acceptable reasons to do this, she needs to be honest with benefit people.

Legacy tenancies shouldn't be a reason to stay. The new tenancies are just as good providing rent is paid on time, you're not a nuisance neighbour or you're earnings are not very high.

She wouldn't be exempt until pension age so a few years to go and by which time she would have been evicted.

www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/cuts-to-housing-benefit-for-social-housing-tenants

The problem is the options for downsizing are really poor. I just had a look on my HA website out of interest and they have a studio flat available in Bromley (so not even near central London) for £520 a month. Who would want to give up a house for a studio? Especially when the price difference isn’t massive. Anything else on there is out of London and not particularly nice.

You get £1000 for each bedroom you give up. Last time I moved I packed everything myself, the removals just took it from A to B and it was still £1000. So that money won’t go far.

I’ve spent loads on my place, it was a wreck when I moved in and anyone in social housing knows that the landlords do the bare minimum. Before anyone asks why I would spend money on a rented place, it was so my DC had a nice home to grow up in. I’m sure anyone would do the same. I also have a secure tenancy and quite honestly no I won’t be budging unless I can get an equivalent style of property and “all” associated expenses covered. I’m not going to put myself out of pocket and/or in a miserable living situation.

It is not individuals hogging 3 or 4 bedroom houses that is causing the housing shortage. If every one of them moved to a 1bed there would still be thousands waiting. There are very few 1 beds available.

Please remember that these are peoples homes and they have probably spent thousands doing it up as the council do bare minimum.

I know it is not ideal but it is not the individuals fault. Blame the governments for the right to buy and not replacing housing stocks.

@Whatamesssss

It is not individuals hogging 3 or 4 bedroom houses that is causing the housing shortage. If every one of them moved to a 1bed there would still be thousands waiting. There are very few 1 beds available.

Please remember that these are peoples homes and they have probably spent thousands doing it up as the council do bare minimum.

I know it is not ideal but it is not the individuals fault. Blame the governments for the right to buy and not replacing housing stocks.

Scotland and Wales have withdrawn the Right to Buy. Its about time England followed suit. I was a council housing officer, and saw people grow old in houses (and gardens) that they then couldn't look after, and sometimes the only option by then was a care home. Much better to look at options before they become a necessity.

As someone with a desirable family sized house, putting in for a home swap could be the best option. Apart from not having to worry about the 'bedroom tax' (extra room subsidy) the cost of heating would also reduce.

I agree that the downsizing won’t wholly solve the social housing crisis.

But the issue here is that she cannot afford the rent.

This is an issue for any of us if we cannot afford the housing we occupy. I am a long term mortgage-holder and am about to downsize and move to a less desirable area because I can’t afford what I currently have.

The OP’s MIL has options: to rent out a room, maybe to increase her hours, or to relocate. All of which I would consider before expecting anyone else to pay my basic living costs.

And I am a bit older than the MIL in question.

@tanguero

Thanks - I never knew that.
As a homeowner, I'll need to downsize and move to a cheaper area to be able to afford to keep a roof over my head once I retire