School won’t open despite new 10 day self isolation rules

[WinstonmissesXmas]

Just that, really! AIBU to expect school to reopen on Monday now that children who should have been isolating until the latter part of the week no longer have to? The school my friend’s children attend announced they would reopen Monday (similar situation) and yet ours sent out a message saying they won’t be open Monday. They also said the kids should continue to isolate. All the kids will have been isolating for over ten days as of tomorrow so they should be allowed back, shouldn’t they?

@Danglingmod

Schools have to follow DfE guidance, not the generic change of guidance posted on the govt website (which, itself, didn't come out until after the end of the school day yesterday. Again.)

But the DfE is the government!

This is just ridiculous - the government puts out a blanket new policy, then the DfE has to put another one out to all the local councils, then the councils have to communicate it to each school, then the school has to communicate to all the teachers, and then to all the parents?

All those separate messages flying around, just because some schools/teachers won't accept the message direct from the government applies to them or their schools?

And the reason for the decrease from 14 to 10, or whether it's the right decision is a moot point. Decision has been made. That's the new policy, one pushed by the most risk-averse man in the world, Mark Drakeford.

And I have no idea why my message was deleted. Apparently teachers don't like being told that they're probably teachers. Or emojis.

Of course the DfE is part of the govt, but have you not noticed that schools do not have to abide by most of the rules other parts of society do, including as employers?

Since the longer isolation would benefit schools, I don't doubt the schools guidance will change to make things even less safe, but still. Schools take guidance from the DfE, not central govt.

YABU
Direct your ire at an incompetent govt.
Also - new isolation thing starts on Monday, irrelevant to your current isolation, and schools in any case wouldn't have time to implement change/unions/staffing. They are not magic.

Perhaps the school know better than the government and are aware that 14 days is safer than 10 days so they are sticking to the 14 days to avoid other families having to isolate over xmas?

Schools should all have shut on Friday. Dragging out another week while Covid cases soar is madness.

[quote TheRuleofStix]@HikeForward and of course no parents or children are breaking the rules. None of them mixing, No meeting up outside of school. No sleepovers or play dates. It’s all the teachers fault. [/quote]
This ⬆️ I work in a school and the amount of kids who have visited family outside of our tier 3 area, gone on play dates and are having birthday parties. Makes me so cross as no school is covid safe anyway even with measures in place, so for kids to be telling me all their plans when my own son is having a zoom party today for his birthday makes me angry. Teachers may have spread it a bit especially if they’re mixing but it’s the kids and their ducking families not following the rules that are my nightmare at the moment. I want to see my mum at Xmas and don’t know if I dare.

@Flipflops85
It was an email direct from the Health Protection Team, we asked them directly whether the new isolation period was retrospective and they said NO!

Also unlikely to pick it up from an asymptomatic child as they don’t shed the virus in the way symptomatic people do.

Not quite as unlikely as you seem to be peddling.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/neurosciencenews.com/coronavirus-shedding-children-16933/amp/

Schools wait for the DfE guidance on many things. It might take a couple of days, but when it comes it's clear and takes account of the environment schools operate in.
The honest truth is that it doesn't matter what they do - there will always be parents moaning, saying it should have been done differently and generally running the schools down. We in schools knew that the honeymoon period where parents were supporting and understanding wouldn't last long, then the complaints would start. Such a shame to be proved right.

@RaspberryCoulis it’s not about head teachers refusing to accept the message, they are in contact with the DfE daily and it is them who advise them. If they go against DfE advice and there is an outbreak that could come back on them- it’s not surprising they don’t want to take that risk. My head is in charge of 2000 staff and students and it’s a big responsibility, they haven’t had training in pandemics and they will make mistakes. But they are doing their best and erring on the side of caution until they’ve officially been advised otherwise makes sense.

@spanieleyes

What’s the health protection team?

Most teachers I know are also parents of young children. So other school closures and bubble closures affect them as well. These decisions are not taken lightly.

My child's school is bringing class bubbles back after 10 days now rather than 14.. Received message Friday... So kids that would gave been back later next week have received a note that can come back earlier in week.

I don't think the head is keen and I'm not sure how many from class bubble effected will return as they are infants age and there has been at least one other case in group.

Sorry can I just jump on this, the rules of isolation have changed?? My son was sent home to self isolate and I had to keep all of my children at home due to being a single parent and having no one to do the school run!

@spanieleyes

Sorry, just googled it. Bizarre that some must be giving different advice, however not surprising.

I’ve heard nothing from my children’s school and today would have been the last day for isolation so I guess they aren’t having them back. Annoying but glad we don’t have to isolate anymore! (Second time in a month 😤)

@HikeForward

I agree with you OP.

In my DD’s school the first cases were spread by teachers (they all attended a meeting face to face with no masks, then one tested positive!) And the teachers were mixing outside of their bubbles!

One by one the year groups had to self isolate due to teacher exposure, then more teachers tested positive followed by lots of kids testing positive.

School is now shut for a month!

I’m cross the school didn’t manage this outbreak better. It only takes one teacher to come into work with a cold (that’s actually covid) and without rules about teachers mixing, sharing staff rooms, wearing masks etc an entire community is thrown into chaos 😡

Your teacher friends should also have been able to tell you that teachers and TAs aren’t really in bubbles. They are permitted to cross bubbles, and in many cases have to cross bubbles in order for the school to function. I genuinely don’t see how my school could safely operate, let alone provide an adequate education if adults crossing bubbles and collaborating in person when needed didn’t happen.

The head isn’t allowed to force staff into masks, thankfully the government haven’t gone quite that crazy.

@FrippEnos
You said that extending it to 14 days isn't going to catch any more people.

now you are saying

The number of people who develop symptoms after 10 days but before 14 is so tiny that the damage to the economy or their education of keeping them away for the additional 4 days just isn't worth it.

Are you still not seeing the contradiction?

This isn’t a contradiction! It’s the entire point:
Almost everyone who will go on to develop symptoms, after contact, will have done so by day 10, the number developing symptoms in the day 10 to 14 timeframe is tiny. Therefore having an isolation period of 14 day compared to 10 is just not needed - it won’t catch any more people, statistically.

[quote Flipflops85]@spanieleyes

Are you U.K. based? That text would completely contradict the government website (which to be fair wouldn’t surprise me at all!)

I know someone who got their text yesterday, and it said 10 days for any close contacts too - which also contradicts your text.

The only message that would still say 14 days is the track and trace app, but the government guidelines say to stop isolating when the app says 3 days.[/quote]
My partner's text said 14 days for close contacts as well.

Does he have the track and trace app?

@Littlepond

Schools should all have shut on Friday. Dragging out another week while Covid cases soar is madness.

It's perfect as it enables the government to carry on blaming the people in schools and parents.

My children’s schools have been battling to stay open and function safely since after half term as the cases here started rising rapidly and many of the staff were unable to come in due to their own children being sent home to self isolate. They would then come back for say a week or whatever and then the teacher/TA/various other staff (youngest is in a special school) would be sent home with the rest of the bubble for 2 weeks. I don’t blame any teacher who thinks “sod it, let’s finish the term now” whether they admit out loud or not.

Basically it’s a nightmare for all working parents by the looks of it, including your children’s teachers.

I work in a school and the amount of kids who have visited family outside of our tier 3 area, gone on play dates and are having birthday parties. Makes me so cross as no school is covid safe anyway even with measures in place, so for kids to be telling me all their plans when my own son is having a zoom party today for his birthday makes me angry. Teachers may have spread it a bit especially if they’re mixing but it’s the kids and their ducking families not following the rules that are my nightmare at the moment. I want to see my mum at Xmas and don’t know if I dare.

That must be very annoying! I thought household mixing is banned? I don’t know how they’re getting away with play dates and parties, visiting family etc.

We haven’t been on any playdates since summer, no parties happening here (and I wouldn’t consider attending one anyway). The only place I go is work and Tesco.

Work are very strict about infection control. We’re all covid swabbed twice a week, wear masks all day, all meetings and training happens online. If staff need to interact we stay 2m apart and keep our masks on. Even in the offices we have our windows fully open and have to sit 2m apart, follow a one-way system etc. So when my teacher friends tell me they’re sharing staff rooms and having face to face meetings, unmasked, I’m shocked and a bit horrified.

I haven’t seen friends since summer and it’s over a year since I saw my parents and brother. We’re not meeting up at Christmas as it doesn’t seem worth the risk. I’m also working over Christmas.

It must be impossible for teachers in secondary schools to be in bubbles, let alone the kids who often all get the same transport to school and then home so are passing it round between them then. My youngest goes to a school where at least 90% of the kids are taxied in and those taxis are determined by route not bubble so the children are mixing outside of their bubbles anyway. Add in all the non teaching staff in the setting who have no choice but to cross into various bubbles I’d be surprised if everyone isn’t absolutely riddled in both schools.

The school are probably waiting for guidance from the DfE who may not give it to them until Monday. Please don't blame schools for the government's failure.

twitter.com/stuart_guest/status/1337379476418727937