Why is my bread so shite?

[Pumperthepumper]

I used to make bread all the time but got out of the habit and now every time I do it’s invariably terrible. The dough does this weird thing where it gets stickier and stickier as I knead it, it never goes smooth or silky. I’ve tried to do it in the mixer but then it just goes really solid. How can I produce a lovely, golden, round loaf instead of a lump of pale sadness?

Definitely overprooving, and possibly over-kneading too - try Dan Leppard's folding and resting technique instead. If your dough is quite wet, try lightly oiling your hands and work surface instead of using flour. And get yourself some decent organic flour too. The extra strong Canadian varieties are easier to bake with but seriously lacking in flavour.

Another Dan Leppard fan here, but now mix and match recipes.

I normally buy fresh yeast (and freeze it in 30g portions).

OP, how hot do you think your oven is? I don't bother with ice, but do usually add some moisture with a a plant sprayer.

Too late now, but if you could take a photo of the inside of the loaf, we might be able to see what needs tweaking.

It is really satisfying once you get the hang of it.

Right, I’ve got Dove Organic flour and fresh yeast, going to give it a go now. Oven was at 230 yesterday but is notoriously rubbish. Thanks so much for everyone’s help, wish me luck!

Nah, same issue. It never stops being gluey when I’m kneading it, so I have to scrape it off my hands. It’s like it gets more sticky the more I do it.

Pics. This was after about 30 mins of chucking it about.

Pumper: pop some oil on your hands next time you touch the dough (or mix it with a spatula). If you touch it again now, it ought to be getting a firmer stretch?

Clean that bowl and cover it with cling film or a damp tea towel.

Can't you just add more flour? If mines at all sticky I keep adding a sprinkle of flour until it isn't any more. I won't be applying for bake off any time soon but my bread is fine.

OP i think you might be being a bit heavy handed with your kneading technique. This happened to me (dough getting all sticky) until i switched to one hand only and a lighter technique. I highly recommend bake with Jack, his videos are excellent. Try this one:

Thanks Madcats, tried the oil and it did help a bit but it’s still really gluey. Going to cover it now. Yes, probably am being too heavy handed with it, I have very little finesse 😂

I agree, you’re probably being too heavy handed. It’s a real trick to master, because you can end up just adding more and more flour and the dough keeps absorbing it if you let it. You need to learn to handle a dough lightly and a little loosely. But that said, I have a kneady machine thingie so have it easy. ;) I have a super easy recipe for no-knead bread rolls that prove overnight if you want it. Calls for fresh yeast and I haven’t tried with dry but prob doable. Let me know if you’re interested. They end up sort of sourdough chewy, really nice.

Oh yes please @banivani ! Just picked up a block of fresh yeast today so that’ll be perfect, thanks very much 👍

Today’s effort. Better, tastes lovely, but still a bit flat and shapeless.

I'd be quite happy with that effort tbh OP 😂
How are you folding it into its final shape?

Your wish is my command!

A set of scales is very handy for this one.

2 g of fresh yeast (about a pea-sized amount)
300 ml (or g) of water
100 g of whole wheat flour
300 g of plain flour or strong bread flour
1-1,5 tsp salt
Perhaps a little honey, say 10 g (apparently extra nice if you use spelt flour instead of ordinary wheat flour, which is what the recipe originally calls for)

Add yeast water and honey to a bowl and stir until yeast is dissolved.
Add the rest and stir it all together until everything is mixed.
Put a lid on it or cover with cling film. Leave at room temperature or 10-12 hours (overnight basically).
In the morning heat oven to 250 degrees. Use two spoons to dollop the dough onto a baking sheet covered with grease proof paper. You should get eight “buns” out of it, and use your two spoons to shape them a little as you plop them down.
Bake for 15 minutes at 250.
Done!

@banivani

Your wish is my command!

A set of scales is very handy for this one.

2 g of fresh yeast (about a pea-sized amount)
300 ml (or g) of water
100 g of whole wheat flour
300 g of plain flour or strong bread flour
1-1,5 tsp salt
Perhaps a little honey, say 10 g (apparently extra nice if you use spelt flour instead of ordinary wheat flour, which is what the recipe originally calls for)

Add yeast water and honey to a bowl and stir until yeast is dissolved.
Add the rest and stir it all together until everything is mixed.
Put a lid on it or cover with cling film. Leave at room temperature or 10-12 hours (overnight basically).
In the morning heat oven to 250 degrees. Use two spoons to dollop the dough onto a baking sheet covered with grease proof paper. You should get eight “buns” out of it, and use your two spoons to shape them a little as you plop them down.
Bake for 15 minutes at 250.
Done!

Oh now, this might be a game changer. Can I use rye flour instead of whole meal?

Cava I just shaped it as best I could with my hands, it was mad sticky though so ended up being a weird blob shape.

Pumper, that looks great! If I was being super-picky you might have overprooved it a little (I do this because I always figure I'll be in the kitchen to check...then something crops up...).

If the dough goes into the oven a bit late it won't be as good at holding its shape (so the weight of the loaf presses down on the lower bit and flattens the lower air pockets).

I think I'll give banivani's recipe a go at the weekend. I usually don't get a loaf made until lunchtime (I think my baguette recipe takes about 8 hours), so that would be a pleasant surprise for everybody.

Yes, I think I did overproove it, we went for a walk so the second proove was just over an hour. It tasted nice but the dough was far too sticky.

I think rye is more unpredictable since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure.
In Sweden we get a mixed rye-and-wheat flour that I wouldn’t hesitate to add instead of the whole wheat or maybe a little more. plain rye - I wouldn’t add too much but sure it’s cheap and easy to play around with this recipe so have at it!

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

I think rye is more unpredictable since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure.
In Sweden we get a mixed rye-and-wheat flour that I wouldn’t hesitate to add instead of the whole wheat or maybe a little more. plain rye - I wouldn’t add too much but sure it’s cheap and easy to play around with this recipe so have at it!

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

I think rye since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure.

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

In Sweden we get a mixed rye-and-wheat flour that I wouldn’t hesitate to add instead of the whole wheat or maybe a little more, but I wouldn’t use all rye.

I think rye wouldn’t work as well since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure what the effect would be. You could try mixing some in and see what happens. I’ve made this with only plain spelt or plain wheat flour, strong and not strong, and it turns out nice each time. But never tried with rye, so can’t say.

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

In Sweden we get a mixed rye-and-wheat flour that I wouldn’t hesitate to add instead of the whole wheat or maybe a little more, but I wouldn’t use all rye.

I think rye wouldn’t work as well since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure what the effect would be. You could try mixing some in and see what happens. I’ve made this with only plain spelt or plain wheat flour, strong and not strong, and it turns out nice each time. But never tried with rye, so can’t say.

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

In Sweden we get a mixed rye-and-wheat flour that I wouldn’t hesitate to add instead of the whole wheat or maybe a little m

I think rye wouldn’t work as well since there’s less gluten in it but I’m not sure what the effect would be. You could try mixing some in and see what happens. I’ve made this with only plain spelt or plain wheat flour, strong and not strong, and it turns out nice each time. But never tried with rye, so can’t say.

This is a link to the original recipe btw www.koket.se/dinkelfrallor it’s in Swedish so no help to anyone ;) but there’s a photo

Hey OP, folding (as I've learnt) is as important to the final structure as the kneading and proving. If you get it into a nice tight ball that will hold its shape well you'll get a better rise in the oven.
Bake with Jack has another good vid on this
I know I sound like I work for him...I don't lol. Just find him v accessible in an often inaccessible world of baking!

Hey OP, folding (as I've learnt) is as important to the final structure as the kneading and proving. If you get it into a nice tight ball that will hold its shape well you'll get a better rise in the oven.
Bake with Jack has another good vid on this
I know I sound like I work for him...I don't lol. Just find him v accessible in an often inaccessible world of baking!