I feel like I’ve got no control over my 9 year old

[BlueBlanketMum]

He is a law unto himself. He is so, SO stubborn and refuses to do things that he doesn’t want to do.

This evening, the rest of the family wanted to go out for a short walk. DS1 wanted to nip to the shop, DP (not the kids’ dad, unlikely to be relevant but don’t want to be told off for drip feeding!) wanted to take the dog out for a walk, and I wanted to get some fresh air post dinner. It would have been a 15 minute walk. DS2 did not want to go. He doesn’t enjoy walking, but unfortunately is overweight and I do try to encourage him to walk even if it’s just a short distance.

Anyway, he lay on the sofa and just completely refuse to move. Anything I said, he ignored. The suggestion of consequences, he ignored. The other two went out and left me at home with him after about 10 minutes of this. I told him he either had to get up off the sofa and go for a walk or do the washing up from dinner. He still wouldn’t get up.

I am not proud of myself, but I lifted him off the sofa and told him he had to do one thing or the other. He was crying at this point, and eventually he agreed to do the washing up together.

I feel like I have no control over him to get him to do anything. That may be a bit of an exaggeration but he is very difficult to motivate to do stuff he doesn’t want to do. When I was younger I always just did what I was told because I knew I would get a very hard smack if I didn’t behave, but I don’t smack my kids and I don’t want them to feel scared of me any comply due to fear. I want them to do things because they are unselfish and realise that they sometimes need to do things for other people!

Maybe that’s too much to ask of a 9 year old?!

But if I can’t get a 9 year old to do what he is being asked to do, what hope have I got when he is a teenager?!

[ShandlersWig]

If he needed the exercise I would have insisted, and the consequences of him not going would have been the removal of his prized posessions (switch) for a week. And followed through.
I found I only needed to do this once. (But you have to stand firm on following through with the consequences otherwise it's game over and you have no hold!)

[CatsAndEyeliner]

The suggestion of consequences, he ignored.
What were the consequences and did you actually follow through and do them?

[WhereverIGoddamnLike]

I have a 9 year old. I cant even imagine this. They're still little. They literally rely on your for everything, and you can enforce consequences very easily.

What's you're parenting been like up to now? Do you actually enforce consequences? Or has he grown up with a threat of a consequence but then not actually doing it?

What are his punishments?

[nancybotwinbloom]

I think the consequences are important for him to understand here.

You have to follow through on whatever restrictions you are going to put in place.

[CallmeAngelina]

What do you mean, the "suggestion" of consequences?

[Wolfiefan]

So what happens if he doesn’t comply? You need consequences. Losing screen time etc.
Going for a walk won’t sort the weight. That’s a diet issue.

[DianaT1969]

He sounds unhappy. Is he?

[BlueBlanketMum]

The non compliance was no bedtime story tonight, and no screens on Wednesday (he is at his dads until then). My understanding is that consequences need to be immediate and relevant - if the consequence of no screens is delayed until Wednesday he probably wouldn’t care (and he didn’t). There are no consequences he would really be bothered about losing for the rest of today.

[Wolfiefan]

But you tried to make the washing of the dishes the consequence. Then said you would do it with him.
Pick one consequence. One. It has to be immediate.

[BlueBlanketMum]

He did the washing. I didn’t do that. I stood next to him as he did it and I dried up.

[BlueBlanketMum]

@DianaT1969

He sounds unhappy. Is he?

To be honest, probably yes. His brother is autistic and monopolises my time. DS2 has a pretty hard time.

[BlueBlanketMum]

@Wolfiefan I agree about the diet. Unfortunately at his dad’s he is given portions that are far too big and gets sweets and cake every day. He eats more healthily at mine but I can’t change that happens when he is with his dad.

[InTheLongGrass]

In this house, it would be no screens until we have been for a walk.
"Suggestions" of consequences make it sound like lots if possible things, none of which actually happen. Is that a fair interpretation?

[Wolfiefan]

Then he won’t lose weight going for a 15 min walk. Maybe it would have been better to let everyone else go and you and he have a few mins quality time doing something he enjoyed.
Pick your battles.
Clear and immediate consequences.

[ChikiTIKI]

Since he goes away to his dad's house for periods of time, would marbles in a jar work for rewarding good behaviour (put some in) and punishing bad behaviour (take some out). When the jar is full, he gets a reward like choosing a film for you all to watch, an activity or you cook his favourite tea or something.

My eldest child is only 3 so sorry if the suggestion is totally off the mark... I've not had to deal with this yet but I'm sure the day will come!

[ImFree2doasiwant]

I think 9 is old enough to have delayed consequences. My 5 yr old has just discovered that I really DID mean something I said a few days ago. He got a tiny bit upset, but he understood perfectly why he wasn't allowed XYZ today, as a result of behaviour on Thursday. (Today was the first time it came up).

If you went to the trouble of lifting him up, I'd have lifted him out of the door and gone for a walk.

[jazzandh]

I have a 9 (nearly 10 year old) like this, and until you have experienced the absolute stubborn determination of them .....it is difficult to believe!

I have an older son - but he would - and even at 16 generally does - do as he is told - maybe with a whinge and moan...but DS2 is a category all on his own.

He has been like this since he was tiny - and I am no pushover. They need a different way of being handled imo. More cajoled into compliance.

I have seen similar personalities (in my in laws as children) and when forced, the resentment and "chippiness" can last into adulthood.

Its a strange thing!

You have my sympathy and solidarity op!

[WhereverIGoddamnLike]

Delayed consequences are fine at that age.

However, if you know he isnt getting your attention and is always the one being left out or his needs pushed aside in favour of his brother's, then didnt you think that maybe saying "ok, they'll go off out for a walk and you and I can have a story/play a game/watch a show together"?

Maybe what he needs to stop acting out is not being told "your brother wants to go out, so do we so that's what we're doing". Maybe do something he wants.

[Ohalrightthen]

DS2 has a pretty hard time.

What are you doing about it?

[BlueBlanketMum]

@jazzandh sorry you have experienced the same, but I’m glad I’m not the only one! Honestly this kid will be a politician one day. He is so stubborn and convinced he is always right. In a way I kind of admire it but as a parent it’s a bloody nightmare.

We had already done a lot of things today that he wanted to do, including him and I playing a new board game together that he really wanted to play, and it’s rare that we get time without DS1 but he was downstairs doing his homework supervised by DP.

I do struggle with immediate consequences but the only one he would really care about is screens and he had had his screen time for the day today. I will enforce it on Wednesday but it does feel too long away for it to really feel relevant to him.

[BlueBlanketMum]

@Ohalrightthen

DS2 has a pretty hard time.

What are you doing about it?

Prior to lockdown, I would take him out of school once a fortnight for us to go and have lunch together, just him and I, but I can’t do that now.

We have an hour every day where it’s just us (DS1 is on screens) and we usually read together or do a puzzle or play. So he has an hour a day of quality time together.

We are on a waiting list for a siblings group but of course with COVID that’s gone out of the window too and the waiting list was long anyway.

I am trying, but it’s hard. He just wishes he didn’t have a brother with autism.

It’s also difficult because DP works long hours so if he is working then it’s just me and the kids and often that’s more difficult because we are also having to manage DS1’s behaviour.

[Ohalrightthen]

In a similar situation in our family, we found that literally the single most important thing was validating the non-autistic kid's feelings. Telling them that you know it's shit. That you know it sucks and it isn't fair. Don't say "but", don't do any "look on the bright side", just let him know you know it's a bitch.

Would he perhaps be happier spending more time with his dad for a bit? Or if you could split the custody for a few weeks so you take it in turns to have one boy each and they get actual proper time, not just an hour with their brother still around?

[Tickledtrout]

Be very wary of punishing him for what is, in effect, his way of communicating his unhappiness. You've suggested that his brother's behaviour is quite challenging. He can't out behave him so he's showing his feelings in his feet dragging. And taking comfort in food.
Is he allowed to talk about how he's feeling? How it's perfectly normal to resent something you can't change?
Don't undermine your relationship further by fixating on punishment and winning every petty battle. He wants a bit if control over what's happening, that's all. Focus on building up your relationship with him.

[BlueBlanketMum]

@Ohalrightthen

In a similar situation in our family, we found that literally the single most important thing was validating the non-autistic kid's feelings. Telling them that you know it's shit. That you know it sucks and it isn't fair. Don't say "but", don't do any "look on the bright side", just let him know you know it's a bitch.

Would he perhaps be happier spending more time with his dad for a bit? Or if you could split the custody for a few weeks so you take it in turns to have one boy each and they get actual proper time, not just an hour with their brother still around?

Yes we do talk about feelings and he does express that he finds it really hard with his brother having autism and I hear them and don’t dismiss them at all. At times it really does suck to be him.

I don’t know about the lining arrangements stuff. He would prefer to be with his dad, I’m sure, but part of that is because he never has to walk anywhere and gets cake every day!

DS1 on the other hand doesn’t want to go to his dad's at all at the moment (but still does go).

[BlueBlanketMum]

@Tickledtrout

Be very wary of punishing him for what is, in effect, his way of communicating his unhappiness. You've suggested that his brother's behaviour is quite challenging. He can't out behave him so he's showing his feelings in his feet dragging. And taking comfort in food.
Is he allowed to talk about how he's feeling? How it's perfectly normal to resent something you can't change?
Don't undermine your relationship further by fixating on punishment and winning every petty battle. He wants a bit if control over what's happening, that's all. Focus on building up your relationship with him.

Thank you. I really appreciate and take on board this response. I agree with trying to improve my relationship with hi , which is why I would be unsure about him spending more time with his dad - because then it feels like I am giving up on him and that’s not what I want.