How do you handle it when a child you see a lot of is very obviously showing clear signs of autism but the parents genuinely can't see it?

[ZippedyBooBah]

Someone I know, single mum, has a 7 yr old DC. I see them daily (not explaining further as potentially outing) but don't feel I know her well enough to talk to her about this.

I assumed when we first met that her DC was on the spectrum (my 15 yr old is autistic, well what used to be called Asperger's). I didn't mention it because it's none of my business, but as we've got to know them I've realised DC isn't diagnosed and that their mum cannot see any issue at all.

The things that make me wonder are:
Walks on tiptoes
Avoids eye contact
Rarely speaks to me despite seeing me a lot, same for other adults from what I've seen (will completely ignore a "good morning" for example)
Practically has a panic attack if bread or other food isn't cut in the right way (we had a lot of picnics over lockdown so I saw this happen regularly)
Very limited vocabulary - about 50% of what I hear DCsay is just "mama" while jumping up and down trying to show her what they want without using words (ie will say "mama mama" and just tug her to what he wants, and if she refuses or says to use words they will use the absolute minimum to clarify ie "kitchen")
DC makes a lot of fairly expressive "huh" and "ooooh" sounds so you can tell if they don't know what you mean or likes something, but hardly ever speaks to anyone except their mum with actual sentences
Really struggles to relate to other children because DC just does their own thing and doesn't seem to get involved in play or communicate their ideas for a game
Sniffs food, and don't mean like anyone would with a new food, I mean full on sniffing and sometimes licking. Ie I made a cake and offered them a slice - they literally put their nose into the icing of the cake and took a big sniff to decide. I've seen this happen with other foods too. Will also take a handful of food from a shared bowl, lick it and sniff it and rub on their face before putting it on their mums plate (or back in the bowl ) if it doesn't appeal. It's not out of bad manners and being repeatedly told not to doesn't seem to sink in.
Can't use cutlery properly or dress etc, mum has to cut up food and help dress
Won't sleep in own bed (mum is very worn down by this)

It's not that they are a badly behaved or rude child though, I work with children and I do know the difference. This child is fairly quiet and as I said is not deliberately rude or naughty, but it's so obvious to me that there is something else going on. I assumed the school would pick up on it and their mum has told me they are suggesting DC might be dyslexic and she was very affronted by it, saying that 7 is far too young to read and write so she doesn't see it as a problem that they pretty much can't do either yet. Dad sees DC fairly regularly and is a full on QAnon conspiraloon who thinks deep state want to microchip our children so I can't imagine he is likely to pick up on anything either!

WWYD?

(Fully braced for an onslaught of MYOB ⛑️)

Respectfully, I'm speaking as one of the ones who would have valued an early childhood diagnosis P0lar.

It's not all about "armchair diagnoses" or "slapping a label" on someone, or letting them have academic extras if they get a diagnosis. It's about potentially giving someone the possibility of self-understanding and compassion.

When I think of the decades of self-hatred and self-torment I went through, the endless mistakes I made and how I used to just beat myself up constantly, I can't help wishing it had been different and wondering who I would have been instead.

My 9 year olds autism wasn't picked up by the health visitor, GP or school. It was picked up when he was being assessed for adhd.

I needed for him to have support in school. He gets supported now but I was tearing my hair out for years. The system is shit.

@Oxyiz

Of course, its possible the Mum is on the spectrum too and has just ignored some things that seem obvious to you.

Absolutely. One of my dc would have been diagnosed years earlier had we not been so accepting of their quirks. Another of my dc is also now on the pathway, also much later than needed. Pretty sure the whole family has strong traits. What is strikingly strange to others can be perfectly normal and unremarkable in a similarly neurodiverse home.

Are you able to talk to her about your autistic child? Open the conversation that way?

I think state your concerns and observations. This child needs to be advocated for. If they are Autistic then the sooner they will get appropriate support in school and they can begin to understand why some things are hard for them. My two children are autistic and I was diagnosed just this last year. I don't understand the point of pussyfooting around, I think there is ableism in there somewhere not intentional but a concern about offending that just wouldn't be there if suggesting to a friend that you'd noticed their child couldn't hear well etc. As has been mentioned ASD often runs in families so parents could be oblivious because of this. But whatever the reason, this boy needs someone to step up for him.

@Oxyiz I hear you, you have articulated my experience also, thank you

I ended up having a conversation with a friend regarding her ds who was showing similar traits to mine - I am also on the spectrum and can be very direct about things (I know this and try not to!)

Long and short of it was she listened and spoke to the school who then put things in place to have his assessed - he is now at a school which is working with him and he is a completely different child - happy and making progress.

My friend was initially very resistant but did tell me months afterwards that she was grateful that I had said something even though she was resistant at the start - I planted the seeds though and that was enough for her to go away and think about it.

My youngest ds is also showing signs he is on the spectrum but so far school are dismissing my concerns as he masks extremely well - no doubt the wheels will come off eventually

She won't listen so I wouldn't bother. My brother and sil has a dc who I have long thought is on the spectrum. Nursery mentioned it so they removed him, school tried to offer him extra help and they refused it. I tried to offer advice and was told that I just wanted their child to be autistic because one of my children is.

That was enough for me to think I'll not bother ever again. People need to take responsibility for their own children.

@P0larB3ar

Not getting all this sadness. No kid gets interventions just for being autistic. They only get it if falling behind which isn’t necessarily always the case if you have autism.

School will pick up if behind academically.

I find all the armchair diagnostic detectives and group eye rolling really offensive.

My daughter is going through screening for autism. She is bright.Struggled to make friends originally but has ended up with a lot. She learnt to mask and has had some mental health difficulties recently( hence the screening) but frankly a diagnosis years ago wouldn't have made a bit of difference. She wouldn’t have had any help academically or socially due to being a masking master.

Going forward it may help her to understand the way her brain works, it may not. It is for us to decide when we’re ready.

The thought of so called amateur autism experts collectively diagnosing her with raised eyebrows behind my back and thinking we’re shit parents for not rushing to slap a label on her is really upsetting as I’m sure it would be for the op’s friend.

Fyi just so you’re aware children with autism vary hugely. My dd hasn’t ever lined up cars or flapped.

I have sympathy with what you are saying, but the support etc is not just about school providing support, it is also about understanding how you yourself think and helping others to at times put that bit extra in.

The girl I referred to above would have MASSIVELY benefitted from an earlier diagnosis, as her social skills are so poor. That may not have come through school, but it may well have come through a support group, or some counselling support etc.
School were not interested because she was academically able and compliant in class.
So it was not until she was14 and had a complete mental break down that they started to think a diagnosis might help. Personally I think that is a bit late.

We are currently going through screening for our dd too. I have suspected she was on the spectrum for years, but she was never 'bad enough' to get anywhere, and, like you, she was coping well in school. But she is now 13 and puberty and secondary school have not been easy, so now we are wondering if a diagnosis would help.

You say 'kids with autism vary hugely' but then seem to not acknowledge that some kids need an earlier diagnosis than others.

I don’t think there’s much to be gained from being direct or confronting her with your concerns.

However, the ranting about dyslexia is an indication that she feels very protective of her dc, and the fact that the child is talking to her suggests a trustful, safe relationship. Those are good foundations.

Autism can be a helpful diagnosis but it can also be a troublesome label. My own experience is that it’s the key to the door to access professional services. Once you get in there, professionals aren’t interested in autism per se, but in the individual’s needs and struggles. But outside of that it can be a slapped on as a label to dismiss the person’s needs and write them off. Not always, but it happens.

A lot has changed from the time we were in school but for many of us, our experience of SN labels was that they were the new PC version of “stupid”.

I think many people see the diagnostic process as ending with a label that is a stigma, but they don’t see that various therapies and supports can be enormously helpful, because they have no experience or knowledge of it.

Could you chat about specific experiences of how particular therapies have helped. My ds struggled with writing and the kind of hand focused exercises teachers use in the classroom weren’t helping because he needed to stabilise his shoulder. We got lots of fun OT play activities. I described this recently to a friend whose dd is, I suspect also on the spectrum, and who struggles with handwriting. I’m hoping that signposting the way to help on a small issue might put her in the way of people who can connect the dots.

I believe passionately that neurodiversity is important, and that in many cases it is our environment that makes a particular profile of talents and limitations seem “wrong”. But I also can see that when we have to live in society, anything that can ease the way for us us also a good thing. Unfortunately, to access the help, parents have to go through a painful confrontation that there is something “wrong” with their dc. There isn’t the same psychic trauma in accessing some extra tuition for maths, or doing extra piano practice. If you can change the focus of her thoughts from there is something wrong to she might need a bit more help with this skill it might help shift her out of the intransigence.

You sound like a very caring friend btw.

I have a DC with a recent autism diagnosis. He would previously have been described as Aspergers and can function and mask very well (until he doesn't...)

My friend has children of similar ages to mine. When we meet, one child has zero interest in interacting with mine, even though there is a strong overlap in interests. His friend at school has an ASD diagnosis. His speech is hard to follow and is clearly out of synch with his intelligence, and can talk about particular detailed subjects. He's very sensory with food and play. Has low interest in things that are not on his agenda and stubbornly plods on at his own pace regardless of the rest of the world. On the occasions when DS2 plays with him, there is always an upset. His emotional reactions are younger than his years.

To me, he screams ASD for so, so many reasons, but I also know as a parent that you tune into your child's normal and it's hard to see the wood for the trees. I didn't notice DS1's eye contact until it was drawn to my attention that he focuses on the "safe" person, obviously that means there is no issue at home, but since it was pointed out, I do notice that he does focus on me or another safe person while he talks to someone less familiar.

As the gaps persist and grow and specific issues are opening up in school, friend is opening up to the possibility of neurodiversity. She has an ND identified at university and is begining to consider that child may too, and there is some overlap, but ASD and this ND also frequently co-exist, indeed DS has this combination.

Other child is socially normal range, but does have an ongoing medical issue, and I do suspect that there is some denial because there is already a lot to contend with there.

I've been open about my DS and have occasionally dropped hinting questions when a conversation has naturally opened that way, but she has to be ready to deal with it and it's not my place to impose it.

From my experience in teaching, it is frustrating when issues are clearly present and you want to offer support but are effectively blocked because a parent is either in denial or outright negative about it. I was proactive about DS because diagnosis puts more balls in our court. He is who he is regardless, but he is happier for understanding his nature more clearly. He can plod on as he is, and if more help is required, diagnosis assists with that process. Likewise he is not obliged to disclose it when he feels it is unnecessary.

It can be a difficult thing to bring up.
Given the way your friend reacted to the suggestion of dyslexia, I would say that it doesn’t sound like she’d be receptive.

I’d still bring it up gently if there was a suitable conversational opening. Although ultimately it’s up to the parents to decide whether to act on it.

I have one friend whose DS (same age as your friends DD) shows a lot of autistic traits, but she’s always resisted any suggestions about it.

I’ve dropped hints, she’s told me that several of her DS’s teachers have suggested that they get him assessed for ASD, but whenever it’s come up, she’s always said that she doesn’t think it’s necessary or helpful to get any sort of assessment because he’s not behind at school.