Government wanting to weigh children

[birthdaybelle]

Anyone see this on Jeremy Vine this morning? Loads of backlash (rightly so!) about children's mental health and eating disorders etc. But what stands out to me is another bloody bashing of every day people trying to feed their kids on meagre wages or benefits.

More shame piled on to us because on top of everything else, our kids are fat.

@Pluckedpencil

I am not that old but remember a school nurse and being weighed. It's a measure of health, and they're trying to improve it. Pretending being overweight isn't a problem isn't the solution to child poverty.

I disagree with this. I had a letter in my child’s bag with his BMI on... I was trying to find a chart to work it out and visually see how he was in the over weight bracket. I even asked the nurses at work and they said said to worry about it. My child is not over weight for a start! If he was though is that effective advice from the school nurse? For the parent what exactly is that meant to achieve? I think it’s really unhelpful and a waste of bloody resources.. a letter with a circle drawn round 1/3 options. No BMI graph of anything.

That was a major breach of process, BananaBread88

Because the school is only a convenient venue for the NHS measuring programme (which hphas existed in one guise or another since the 1940s) and letters are sent out by the NHS. They shouldn't have been anywhere near the school.

And perhaps worth reiterating from earlier on - any new weighing/measuring is not a government policy. It is something that was released by the interest group The Obesity Forum.

Kids are more likely to have mental health issues if they become overweight/obese in the first place. At least 5 chn in dc7 class are overweight. They are becoming increasingly aware of this even though no one would ever say anything. No adults anyway.

They are becoming more body conscious and know when they can't fit into a fancy dress costume on a play date or borrow a swimsuit to use the paddling pool.

Working in a school, I have seen that these are the kids hiding behind their chairs when changing for pe or asking to go into the toilet cubicle to change privately. In reception year.

Kids should be weighed annually at school as part of a wider health check and action taken as appropriate. If parents won't or can't then the government need the data to make societal changes. As a society we need to be able to see weight for what it is, one measure of good health.

I weigh my dc every 3/4 months. I just ask them to jump on the scales to check they are growing well.

I wouldn't tell them if they were overweight but I would definitely make changes to their diets and not bury my head in the sand and hope that they grew out of it.

They are becoming increasingly aware of this even though no one would ever say anything.

This. The parents can make all the excuses they like but the children know, poor little things. Quite often they blame themselves as well ("I'm greedy", "I just need to eat less", "If I wasn't fat, people would like me"). Children are often unkind to each other about these things.

In my experience, it is much, much easier being an overweight adult than an overweight child. It is entirely within your control, you're much less self-conscious about it and adults are generally better-behaved and more polite to each other than children (with the odd exception). That's why I'm largely indifferent to what I weigh whereas if DC started putting on weight I'd immediately make dietary changes and plan more activities.

I think it’s a good idea actually to do the extra weighing in March so they get a more accurate picture of the impacts of lockdown on the cohort. I think it will be especially important for those children who have just been at home. I know myself that the days my 4 year old has been at home while we’ve both been working have not been anywhere near as active as her days in nursery or camp or my days off. Playgrounds opening have been really important as well in supporting active play.

I live in an affluent area and most kids are not fat. However, even then, I was surprised when we saw some of my daughter’s friends that a few of them had really piled on weight. In one case, I know it won’t be food but will simply be a consequence of inactivity as her parents both work full time and she is a sedate child. I’d have thought by March she’d be back to normal but will probably weigh as overweight if not obese for the measurement in September.

Most of my dc's friends are normal weight, the normal weight kids have normal weight parents - the kids who are overweight have overweight parents and overweight siblings.

If parents can't tackle their own eating issues then how are they going to tackle their dc's - it's cultural in many families - the way they eat, the types of food they eat, the amount of food they eat - changing that will take more than weekly weighing, it take the whole family to make the change and that going to be a tough nut to crack. Weighing and measuring makes it look like the Gov is doing something but it's doing naff all.

Wouldn't bother me at all but then my DC have a healthy diet and aren't at all over weight so maybe I'd feel differently if they were overweight.

On one hand I think it's a good idea because like pp have said, a lot of people don't seem to realise their kids are overweight and SO many are. But on the other hand, parents seem to be in denial about their kids weight. I've heard so many parents fume when their kids reception weights come back as over weight or obese, because they they honestly think they aren't.

Yes, I've absolutely ignored the change 4 life advice.
Its crap. I do not want my kids eating reduced fat (read, added sugar and thickeners), reduced sugar (read artificial sweeteners, which I cant stand the taste of) reduced salt (fine, so long as they dont bump up the sugar for taste).
I want them eating normal food. With ingredients that i could actually find in the cupboard (fortified iron/Vit d etc as exceptions).
If fat makes you feel full, why does reduced fat exist?? To keep you eating?!

I’m fine with them being weighed. Done sensitively, and used as part of a conversation about nutrition this is a good tool. It’s not the only tool but it’s a tool and we have a childhood obesity problem so I think it’s a tool that should’ve used.

But the worst food my DD gets is at school! I wish they’d address it- you get the literature saying they’re healthy but what they give them does not match the menus. She gets treats at home like ice cream but her base meals are healthy. School lunches are things like chicken nuggets, pizza and white bread ham sandwiches. Fine occasionally but not every day. We noticed her taste buds change during lockdown back to liking the healthier meals we feed her at home. And then deteriorate again once back at school, and improve again now school holidays are on.

(I know we could send her in with a packed lunch but she wants school lunches at the moment because that’s what her friends have. And they’re free)

Weighing and measuring makes it look like the Gov is doing something but it's doing naff all.

It's not the government that's feeding these kids. It can only do so much.

If parents can't tackle their own eating issues then how are they going to tackle their dc's

It comes down at least partly to motivation. I was determined that I wasn't going to repeat the cycle with my DC.

Yes, I've absolutely ignored the change 4 life advice.
Its crap. I do not want my kids eating reduced fat (read, added sugar and thickeners), reduced sugar (read artificial sweeteners, which I cant stand the taste of) reduced salt (fine, so long as they dont bump up the sugar for taste).

I think the same. However I remember an awful and cringeworthy ad about making simple changes, and one of the lines was, "instead of sweets, have fruit!"
Like really??? There cant be many people that dont know fruit is better for you than sweets but if it was a simple as "just swapping" no one would have a weight problem! One of my DC would probably choose fruit over sweets but the other one wouldnt in a million years. If I really fancied a bit of chocolate, an orange isnt going to cut it for me unless it was a chocolate orange

However I remember an awful and cringeworthy ad about making simple changes, and one of the lines was, "instead of sweets, have fruit!"
Like really??? There cant be many people that dont know fruit is better for you than sweets but if it was a simple as "just swapping" no one would have a weight problem! So much simplitistic nonsense -"I did it so why can't they" "Carrots are cheap" "A banana costs 40p" None of this is getting to the heart of a very complex problem and neither will weighing kids - but at least the Gov can tick the box that they are doing something - doesn't matter that the something they are doing is very effective - it's all optics.
Cooking real food is an effort, especially if you've been doing a manual job on your feet all day - your feet are sore, your back is sore, standing cooking in a kitchen is the last thing you'll feel like doing - processed food is what you are going to reach for, as little physical effort as possible, with as little clean up as possible. Sure you love your kids - but life is exhausting for a lot of people on minimum wage jobs.

Weighing and measuring makes it look like the Gov is doing something but it's doing naff all

The government is doing naff all. The proposal is from a lobbying group who want the government to adopt the idea.

Shalaalaa

You have a responsibility to your kids there is plenty of ideas for easy healthy meals
You don't need to spend hours in the kitchen slaving away
Children love helping in the kitchen when they are young so it's good bonding time also
You are just another one full of excuses

Slow Cooker meals

Batch cooking so u can freeze some and have a quick healthy meal from your freezer

Veg doesn't take long to cook a salad can be quick also especially of you have quinoa or Bulgar wheat already prepared in the fridge

Where there's a will there's a way! Not I can't /don't want to! Its your children it will effect on the long run

Of course a treat every now and then
. We need to stop making excuses and get on with it is fine but takeaways and processed food every day is just fucking awful parenting

@40andginger no need to get personal with your You are just another one full of excuses Where did I say my kids were overweight? Where did I say I couldn't cook for them? Couldn't look after them?
This is a discussion - no need for accusations, try to understand other people's challenges regarding why their kids are overweight, instead on accusing them of fucking awful parenting! That is helpful to no one...it might make you feel better though - but then this isn't about you, you have it all sorted don't you?.

Most of my dc's friends are normal weight, the normal weight kids have normal weight parents - the kids who are overweight have overweight parents and overweight siblings.

If parents can't tackle their own eating issues then how are they going to tackle their dc's - it's cultural in many families - the way they eat, the types of food they eat, the amount of food they eat - changing that will take more than weekly weighing, it take the whole family to make the change and that going to be a tough nut to crack. Weighing and measuring makes it look like the Gov is doing something but it's doing naff all.

This is something I'm really conscious of, DH and I are overweight and currently the kids aren't (checked recently) but as they get older that could change if they copy mine and DHs eating habits so DH and I are trying to change our habits.

Shalaalaa
I may have worded it wrong it wasn't aimed at you it was aimed at your statement about how u see people with that kind of lifestyle look for an easy option

I mearly pointed out that there are ways around your points
Not feeding your (people not you specifically) children a good diet is bad parenting fucking awful in my opinion

And there is just excuses after excuses on this thread

Your children are the most precious things in your life! Adults can do whatever they want but children rely on their parents

We all have struggles it's just some people play on them more

but life is exhausting for a lot of people on minimum wage jobs

And it isn't for anyone else? The government should be doing more, but also parents should. As it is no one is really doing anything because the blame is just shifted onto the other.

The government should be doing more.

What should they be doing?

your back is sore, standing cooking in a kitchen is the last thing you'll feel like doing - processed food is what you are going to reach for, as little physical effort as possible, with as little clean up as possible. Sure you love your kids - but life is exhausting for a lot of people on minimum wage jobs

Yes it is and we can sympathise for sure but the truth is when you choose to have children then you have chosen to take on the responsibility of doing your best to take care if them regardless of how tired you are or how little you feel like doing it.

Now none of us are perfect. We have all been guilty of letting things slide sometimes. End of day then are 2 choices really. Continue ignoring what's in front of you and carry on as you are. Or ask for help. Spend some time working out how you can make some changes but still keep things reasonably easy on yourself.

There cant be many people that dont know fruit is better for you than sweets but if it was a simple as "just swapping" no one would have a weight problem!

This isn't strictly true though.

Fruit has greater health benefits overall than sweets (obvs, there are no nutrients at all in sweets) but sugar wise, there isnt a huge amount of difference. Of the 5 a day advice, only 2 (max) of those 5 portions are supposed to be fruit because of the high sugar content. A lot of people don't know that OJ has as much sugar in it as coke and feel virtuous when they swap but without realising they are doing the same damage to their bodies metabolism and weight wise.

A breakfast of porridge, a banana and a glass of orange juice or a fruit smoothie is seen as a healthy choice but has a similar impact on the body to junk food insulin/metabolsim/weight wise due to high carb content.

I don't have the science at hand at the moment but sugar is the bad guy in this, not fat. Weight gain isn't caused by eating too much fat. Unless that fat is also consumed alongside a high carb intake because the body prioritises using carbs over fat as fuel because it's 'easier'. Weight gain is caused by insulin spikes as a result of high carb intake.

A lot of people don't know, understand or realise that all carbs are converted into glucose by the body to be utilised as fuel. And a lot of people don't realise that glucose is just sugar.

We have been pushed a low fat (eating fat makes you fat) and, therefore, high sugar, diet since the birth of the diet industry in, what?, the 60s. 'Healthy' options in supermarkets have the fat removed and replaced with sugar/sweeteners and thickeners. And yet we've never been fatter. Why?

An anecdote...

My ex husband eats low fat everything. He only eats lean cuts of meat, he only eats 0% fat yoghurt, salad dressings, he uses 'low fat' spray oils rather than fat for cooking etc. If fat were the issue, he'd be slim. But he's not slim, or even a 'normal' size. He's obese and he has T2 diabetes and horrendous sugar/carb cravings. He's always been frustrated by his weight because he follows the low fat guidance to the letter.

I used to be similar. Three stone overweight with the associated health problems. Always restricting my calorie intake to 1200 cals, never understanding why cals in/out worked for me for a short time but then stopped.

I moved to a low carb way of eating a few months ago. My calorie intake has increased. It's not a 'restrictive' diet in that sense. I now consume around 1600+ calories a day I only eat 'real' food. I eat pork belly, real butter, cream and fry (rather than grill) my food in lard alongside salad and leafy green veg etc. I've turned the food pyramid on its head and, yet, I've lost all sweet/carb cravings and have lost weight as well as improving overall health. People who talk of cravings and addiction, yes, it requires will power fornthebfirst few days but I can sit in a room with people eating cakes, sweets and chocolate and whereas I'd previously have been dipping in for extras when no one was looking, I have no desire to eat it at all now.

The carb/sugar cravings aren't inevitable. They can be controlled and even stopped.

But still the eatwell plate promotes high carb and low fat intake. Why?

what do you think the answer is then?

I don't really think there is an answer. It's pretty obvious that the government initiatives, child-weighing and hand-wringing can't actually make people eat healthily. At the end of the day, people will eat what they want and many parents will not always do what is best for their children, because it's hard, because the long-term effects of a poor diet are not immediate enough to scare them into action, and because they are surrounded by people who have been overweight their whole lives and yet who seem to be functioning ok and haven't dropped dead.

What should they be doing?

Invest in funding for treatment of what are medically recognised eating disorders such as BED etc, this stops the chain of disordered eating being passed to children; update NHS dietary advice which is out of date, and quite frankly not worth the paper it's written on; increase funding in schools for actual physical education, it's at an extremely low level here but we cannot afford to offer anything else. Or make the one mile run mandatory for schools but actually factor in the time and not just expect it to be squeezed into everything else; more of a focus on healthy food tech and quick prep meals in DT for secondary, rather than cakes which take an hour and will never be made again; instead of paying farmers to chuck milk down the drain, help with finding the supply local shops with affordable fruit and veg beyond supermarkets which some cannot access; run programmes such as weighing in schools to identify areas which would benefit from more localised initiatives.

Yes, I also believe that parents should have responsibility, and don't agree that solutions can or should be handed on a plate, or that more money as some people seem to think would fix it. But there are often a plethora of fundamental issues which have led here, and ignoring them isn't helpful. If losing weight and maintaining a healthy weight was easy, few people would be overweight just out of choice. It needs to be a combination of both, as if it was just government doing anything it would also faul.

Fail*

Yes it is and we can sympathise for sure but the truth is when you choose to have children then you have chosen to take on the responsibility of doing your best to take care if them regardless of how tired you are or how little you feel like doing it. Did any of us know what we were taking on when we had kids - how exhausting it can be, physically and mentally...I certainly didn't. Sure, I have the resources and the time and usually the support, many don't and short cuts are taken.
Telling people what they should do, doesn't make it happen...we've already tried that already and it doesn't work! It doesn't work telling parents they are shit either funnily enough. But we could just keep saying it if it makes everyone feel better.