Government wanting to weigh children

[birthdaybelle]

Anyone see this on Jeremy Vine this morning? Loads of backlash (rightly so!) about children's mental health and eating disorders etc. But what stands out to me is another bloody bashing of every day people trying to feed their kids on meagre wages or benefits.

More shame piled on to us because on top of everything else, our kids are fat.

Parents should be responsible for their kids weight. It's bollocks to say parents can't do anything. Joe Wicks and any number of free programs are available and require no outside space. Veg is pennies in Aldi. It's negligence to let them get fat as kids. Bollocks you can't do anything about it.

My mum felt my children were missing out because I didnt take them to McDonald's. Missing out? On what!
I couldn't agree more. Nasty, processed stuff, filled with processed, refined fats, carbs, salt & sugar, & mostly devoid of any real nutritional value. I'd sooner go hungry. But, that's just my personal taste.

Veg is pennies in Aldi. It's negligence to let them get fat as kids. Bollocks you can't do anything about it.
Are you volunteering the use of your car so people without one can get there, then?

Veg is pennies in Aldi.

If you have an Aldi nearby and the means to get to there too.

People who have been on diets lacking in fresh fruit and veg, particularly children with a limited palette/exposure to such, aren't going to suddenly start filling themselves full of pak choi, brussel sprouts, and nectarines just because someone with a clipboard has said they have to. Some attitudes are entrenched and pushing will only make them dig in.

To get a shift in attitudes then the first thing, in my opinion, needs to be a drive to increase awareness of appropriate portion sizes. In an earlier post I mentioned that food packaging should show a visual of portion sizes, so instead of just saying a serving is 35g and this is 200 calories it should show a visual of 35g of the cereal in a bowl to give people an idea of what a serving actually looks like so when pouring their own bowl they're more likely to get it closer to a 35g than they would if they were just guessing what 35g looks like. Packaging should also state whether the portion size given is for an average adult man or adult woman or for a child so people can adjust accordingly. There is a meme on social media along the lines of "dear Cadbury, don't tell me the calories for 30g when we both know I'm going to eat the whole bar..." so why doesn't food labelling reflect this? Give people the information and some, not all admittedly but some, will make the adjustment for themselves when they realise "shiiiit, how many calories!?"

Once amount is sorted, then start looking at content of diet.

so instead of just saying a serving is 35g and this is 200 calories it should show a visual of 35g of the cereal in a bowl to give people an idea of what a serving actually looks like so when pouring their own bowl they're more likely to get it closer to a 35g than they would if they were just guessing what 35g looks like.

This wouldn't work, if the 35g in the manufacturer's bowl fills it half full, but the consumer's bowl is three times as big, the consumer is going to fill their own bowl half full as that's visually what it looks like...

OP, the argument that you can't afford to help your children lose weight doesn't stack up. Porridge, eggs, lentils, soup and many other food staples are cheaper than ready meals, treats or takeaways. It isn't about time or cooking from scratch either. Porridge in the microwave, an omelette, baked potato in microwave with any topping.... There are lots of nutritious meals which can be batch cooked and reheated or made from scratch in 15 mins.
Water is cheaper than fizzy drinks and juice.

This wouldn't work, if the 35g in the manufacturer's bowl fills it half full, but the consumer's bowl is three times as big, the consumer is going to fill their own bowl half full as that's visually what it looks like...

Not necessarily. I had mini shredded wheat this morning and 35g looks like 35g no matter what the size of the bowl, you can see from the rough number of pieces in the bowl. It would still get people closer to an actual portion size than guesswork without a visual.

Not necessarily. I had mini shredded wheat this morning and 35g looks like 35g no matter what the size of the bowl, you can see from the rough number of pieces in the bowl. It would still get people closer to an actual portion size than guesswork without a visual.

Try that with some thing like coco pops and you'll get a very different idea, half a bowl is half a bowl. You can't tell how big the bowl is from a picture and you sure as heck can't see the rough number of pieces!

the argument that you can't afford to help your children lose weight doesn't stack up. Porridge, eggs, lentils, soup and many other food staples are cheaper than ready meals, treats or takeaways. It isn't about time or cooking from scratch either. Porridge in the microwave, an omelette, baked potato in microwave with any topping.... There are lots of nutritious meals which can be batch cooked and reheated or made from scratch in 15 mins. Water is cheaper than fizzy drinks and juice.

Again though it comes down to having f access to these staples in the first place and then having the know-how and capability to make something with them, the money on the gas/electricity to run the cooker or microwave or keep the fridge-freezer going to store the batch cook. Kids not used to lentils and soup and porridge aren't going to suddenly start eating them so wasting food and money becomes an issue too.

There was one if those benefit bashing TV shows on ages ago that showed one of the people spending their very last £5 on a large kebab and chips leaving then with absolutely no money for the two days running up to their next UC payment. There was a thread here where people were going on that this £5 could have bought a bag of rice, a bag of pasta, fruit and veg super six from Aldi, 2-3 tins of chopped tomatoes, a loaf of bread, possibly a bag of frozen veg too. However the person on the show didn't have access to an Aldi or other supermarket and only had enough money on the meter for the lights with no top up for cooking, so the large kebab and chips was hot, available, could feed the two of them for their dinner and then the leftovers would feed them the following day too.

I know its been said on the thread that there is no excuse for not looking stuff up or figuring out a way to make nutritious meals on the cheap but there really are adults in this country for whom that is beyond their capability. Who don't know what the fuck they would use porridge oats for or who would consider lentils to be too confusing. Adults raised in chaotic households who then go on to lead chaotic lives of their own aren't suddenly going to get their shit together enough to start making soup from scratch.

In the year 2018-2019 the Trussel Trust food bank issued 1.6 million food parcels, a figure they expect to beat this year. The parcels contain food that is designed to be easily cooked considering those in food poverty are also likely to be in fuel poverty. The groups try to make the parcels balanced however they don't usually contain fresh produce as items need to be non-perishable and there is a reliance on heat-to-eat items such as pot noodles, pasta meals, tinned meat, etc. which typically have a high calorie and fat value. This is again something which impacts upon overall health.

There are many issues around social and financial inequality that tie into health

@Gancanny I agree completely

@DianaT1969

OP, the argument that you can't afford to help your children lose weight doesn't stack up. Porridge, eggs, lentils, soup and many other food staples are cheaper than ready meals, treats or takeaways. It isn't about time or cooking from scratch either. Porridge in the microwave, an omelette, baked potato in microwave with any topping.... There are lots of nutritious meals which can be batch cooked and reheated or made from scratch in 15 mins. Water is cheaper than fizzy drinks and juice.

This is fine if you're not working two care jobs with your kid in wraparound care and no time to shop!

I think people just don't understand how hard some people are working just to keep their head above water.

I know its been said on the thread that there is no excuse for not looking stuff up or figuring out a way to make nutritious meals on the cheap but there really are adults in this country for whom that is beyond their capability.

Yes but they're not the majority and there are also council/community schemes to help parents of overweight children.

Overweight parents and parents of overweight children can always find reasons why they can't do anything to change the situation but the truth is, unless they get a handle on it they risk setting their DC up for a life of misery and weight problems.

Today's Mumsnetters often say "I'm overweight because I was made to clear my plate as a child".

Future Mumsnetters will be saying "I'm overweight because my parents fed me too much food and didn't see I got enough exercise".

This is fine if you're not working two care jobs with your kid in wraparound care and no time to shop!

You can't shop online?

there are also council/community schemes to help parents of overweight children

Not many of these now, sadly.

Public health has really been cut back, in all areas.

I don't understand why people think that weighing a child will make them lose weight. I'd be fascinated to know how many parents successfully and on a long-term basis got their child to lose weight as a direct result of being informed by school that their child was fat (which they almost certainly already knew). Not many, I'm guessing.

I also don't understand how the 'a bag of carrots is 40p in Aldi' comments are helpful. It's not about the price of vegetables, it's about the cheapness and addictive tastiness of processed crappy food, how much it comforts people (especially if their lives are otherwise shitty) and how hard it is to wean people off it when they've known little else since toddlerhood. Telling them lentil casserole is nutritious and cheap really isn't going to cut it.

I don't understand why people think that weighing a child will make them lose weight.

It won't if the parents don't get onboard and stop saying "but but but" and actually do something about it.

When it comes to teens, also, (and I'm not making excuses here) as with everything else, our control lessens over what they eat and drink. They're out and about more with their mates, they have their own money.

We can control what we cook and have in the house, though. (I'm guilty of far too much leniency with Coca Cola. Work of the bloody devil).

I also don't understand how the 'a bag of carrots is 40p in Aldi' comments are helpful. It's not about the price of vegetables, it's about the cheapness and addictive tastiness of processed crappy food, how much it comforts people (especially if their lives are otherwise shitty) and how hard it is to wean people off it when they've known little else since toddlerhood. Telling them lentil casserole is nutritious and cheap really isn't going to cut it.

Because its not about the parents it's about the children so they should not have to be weaned off junk food!!!
And the price of healthy food is helpful because some posters are saying its too expensive to feed a healthy diet!
I get people are busy working but you still need to eat healthily and insure your children follow suit because every child deserves a nutritious diet and not fed on shit because its easier or cheaper!
Also it's not just aldi that's cheap veg is cheap in most shops if you don't buy the pre prepped stuff!

@mbosnz

When it comes to teens, also, (and I'm not making excuses here) as with everything else, our control lessens over what they eat and drink. They're out and about more with their mates, they have their own money.

We can control what we cook and have in the house, though. (I'm guilty of far too much leniency with Coca Cola. Work of the bloody devil).

But really isn’t that all the more reason for parents to as much as possible take the time to build sensible healthy routines when they are young enough that parents are in control?

@Gancanny whilst there is truth in what you say, the people who I know who have overweight children do not fall in to that category. I live in London, there's supermarkets every where. There are many, many people who have the time and money to feed their children properly but for some unknown reason choose not to. The information is out there telling us the health risks but they choose to keep feeding there dc vast amounts of crap. We need to help those that genuinely need it but stop pretending that's the main problem. We have a terrible food culture here.

I also don't understand how the 'a bag of carrots is 40p in Aldi' comments are helpful. It's not about the price of vegetables, it's about the cheapness and addictive tastiness of processed crappy food, how much it comforts people (especially if their lives are otherwise shitty) and how hard it is to wean people off it when they've known little else since toddlerhood. Telling them lentil casserole is nutritious and cheap really isn't going to cut it.

Aldi and Lidl are constantly used as examples when people doubt the affordability of healthy food and sanpro.
Not everyone has access to a supermarket, if you rely on cornershops or a small co-op for example they might not have a bag of carrots or it will be more than 40p.Similarly the smaller shops dont always have the more reasonably priced San pro. I shop at Aldi because it suits my budget better than waitrose and sainsburys in my town, but I do need to drive there.

A lot of teens certainly do gain a few pounds when they're more in control of what they eat, especially if they're not particularly sporty.

But when I look at my 17yr old DS's overweight friends, every single one of them was overweight in primary school.

It won't if the parents don't get onboard and stop saying "but but but" and actually do something about it.

Well exactly. But mostly they won't.

Because its not about the parents it's about the children so they should not have to be weaned off junk food!!! I get people are busy working but you still need to eat healthily.

Yes, well you can say 'they should/shouldn't eat X, Y or Z' or 'children shouldn't have to be weaned off junk food' as much and as loudly as you like, but the truth of the matter is that eating habits are hard to change and people don't want to stop eating what they like and find it very hard to make their children do so.

The long-term success rate of dieting and weight loss is very low, even among intelligent, highly-motivated, well-off people with nice jobs, pleasant homes and happy lives. How much harder must it be if you're poor, overworked and beaten down and cheap sugary food is the only way you can afford to cheer your kids up?

I'm not saying it's not important to feed your kids healthily. I'm saying I don't see how weighing kids in school or telling people they should be eating more vegetables is actually going to achieve that.

We need to help those that genuinely need it but stop pretending that's the main problem. We have a terrible food culture here.

We really do have a terrible food culture, especially around things like using food as a reward and a motivator and the idea of "being naughty/cheeky" in relation to food. There needs to be a huge cultural shift to view food as exactly what it is - fuel. No "good" foods, no "naughty" foods, just food as fuel and that just like you fuel you only need enough to make the engine run and using a better grade of fuel (i.e., healthier food) will make it run more efficiently. This culture is part of the problem too.

I agree that not everyone overweight is in poverty or from a chaotic household or lacking in capability however they do also contribute to the overall problem.

There doesn't seem to be any one, coherent approach that can address the issues of food culture, poverty and inequality, time pressures, food deserts, and so on. It's a very complex knot to try and unpick.

Good healthy non fattening food is not expensive.

Good healthy non fattening food is not expensive

I agree. It's easily affordable to me, plus I'm a good cook and I love fruit, vegetables and pulses. I'm still overweight though. Persuading people to eat healthy stuff is only one part of the challenge. Persuading them to stop eating unhealthy stuff is much harder. Sadly the carrots and lentils don't cancel out the sweets, doughnuts and crisps.
If you put a couple of raw carrots and a big slice of luxury chocolate cake in front of a hungry person, which instruction would they find harder to obey - 'eat the carrots' or 'don't eat the cake'? No contest.